Positional Preview #2: The Defensive Backs

ModAdmin · April 24, 2024, 04:57:27 PM

Positional Preview #2: The Defensive Backs

"....And as we continue with the next installment in our Positional Preview Series with our focus on the defensive backs, the script heading into training camp and the 2024 regular season is going to feature the exact same storyline as more change is coming to a unit that somehow doesn't often generate a lot of chatter across the league....."

https://www.bluebombers.com/2024/04/23/positional-preview-2-the-defensive-backs/

CrazyCanuck89 · April 24, 2024, 07:36:20 PM

Can we stop calling it the dime. The strongside linebacker is still considered a linebacker.

blue_gold_84 · April 24, 2024, 07:39:00 PM

Quote from: CrazyCanuck89 on April 24, 2024, 07:36:20 PMCan we stop calling it the dime. The strongside linebacker is still considered a linebacker.

Does it matter?

kkc60 · April 24, 2024, 09:06:33 PM

Always a fun position group to see in TC (any group that has a spot or two open is).

CrazyCanuck89 · April 25, 2024, 01:02:03 PM

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on April 24, 2024, 07:39:00 PMDoes it matter?

Yes, it matters.

Blueforlife · April 25, 2024, 04:58:39 PM

It confused me as I was looking for Kramdi on LBs review

Blue In BC · April 25, 2024, 05:17:52 PM

Quote from: CrazyCanuck89 on April 25, 2024, 01:02:03 PMYes, it matters.

Not really. We all know that a SAM is converted DB. Generally he isn't going to be used at MAC or Wil. He may possibly move to DHB or safety. OTOH, a WIL could be expected to play at MAC and in some cases also be able to fill in at SAM. Very unlikely he moves into the secondary.

Feel free to call Kramdi a LB if you want but I have no problem referring to him as a DB.

theaardvark · April 25, 2024, 05:42:02 PM

With FS and SAM becoming almost interchangeable are they both DB's or LB's?

HB's and CB's are a group, for sure. But FS/SAM are as close to LB's as they are to CB/HB's, aren't they?

Wil/Mack are interchangeable in emergency, but you rarely see a Wil move out to SAM. Likewise CB's and HB's move back and forth, but rarely do you see a FS/SAM move to CB or HB.

So, do we actually now have 3 groups of defensive backs? LB (Mack/Wil), FS(FS/SAM), CB(HB/CB)?

Blue In BC · April 25, 2024, 05:57:31 PM

Quote from: theaardvark on April 25, 2024, 05:42:02 PMWith FS and SAM becoming almost interchangeable are they both DB's or LB's?

HB's and CB's are a group, for sure. But FS/SAM are as close to LB's as they are to CB/HB's, aren't they?

Wil/Mack are interchangeable in emergency, but you rarely see a Wil move out to SAM. Likewise CB's and HB's move back and forth, but rarely do you see a FS/SAM move to CB or HB.

So, do we actually now have 3 groups of defensive backs? LB (Mack/Wil), FS(FS/SAM), CB(HB/CB)?

I'd say they are both DB's. I'd dispute that that FS/SAM are as close to LB's than secondary players. Ian Wild was a WIL that was switched to SAM about 6 years ago. That is more uncommon.

Many of our SAM's did play at either DHB or CB in their careers before joining the Bombers and during their time with the Bombers. Maston, Gaitor and Lawrence to name a few. But feel free to check some historical rosters.

blue_gold_84 · April 26, 2024, 01:10:15 PM

Quote from: CrazyCanuck89 on April 25, 2024, 01:02:03 PMYes, it matters.

CrazyCanuck89 · April 27, 2024, 10:15:35 PM

Quote from: theaardvark on April 25, 2024, 05:42:02 PMWith FS and SAM becoming almost interchangeable are they both DB's or LB's?

HB's and CB's are a group, for sure. But FS/SAM are as close to LB's as they are to CB/HB's, aren't they?

Wil/Mack are interchangeable in emergency, but you rarely see a Wil move out to SAM. Likewise CB's and HB's move back and forth, but rarely do you see a FS/SAM move to CB or HB.

So, do we actually now have 3 groups of defensive backs? LB (Mack/Wil), FS(FS/SAM), CB(HB/CB)?

I would still include SAM as a linebacker, they still play up near the line of scrimmage, they've just gotten smaller over time.

Yes, a SAM may be asked to cover deep zone on a safety, but that's maybe one or two plays a game.

Safety is a DB and has always been. They're the last line of defense and help over the top deep.

TecnoGenius · April 28, 2024, 01:09:39 AM

I think SAM is a DB, at least in the WPG scheme. He's running and chasing a SB way more than he's sitting there trying to stop the run. He needs speed to chase the occasional deep routes. He doesn't need much size.

Kramdi didn't do a whole lot of run stop in '23. Come to think of it, neither did Darby, or going back a ways, Leggett.

Many of the blow-up run plays (RB or QB) used against us in the post-season were in the wide-open vacated SAM area.

And it makes perfect sense because you usually have 5 R's out, so 4 DBs ain't enough. You need that 5th DB, the SAM.

I agree with Aards slightly on the FS issue, but mostly only as it relates to WPG. We use the FS in the run stop mode a ton, probably more than our SAM. So that does make FS kind of like a SAM, but he does also have to free-range on deep pass (double) coverage too, way more than SAM. So in that sense he's more like a DB.

But take a guy like Dequoy in MTL: that dude is a true FS who is doing nothing but looking to ballhawk. He's too puny to do much on the run stop. I would never liken his role to a SAM.

Blue In BC · April 28, 2024, 02:35:28 PM

It's going to be interesting to see how much chance Ford gets to start at CB. We don't need another Canadian starter however it allows us to use the choices for DI differently. It also potentially means a pure rookie doesn't need to be starter on day 1. Ford has some experience and that's his chance to run with it.

That said, we could have the next Alford signed and no real idea of the teams perceived depth chart for day 1 or beyond.

I'll cheer for Ford in the short term as a returning player and hope he's a CFL allstar.