BLUE BOMBERS ADD DEFENSIVE BACK AARON GRYMES TO PRACTICE ROSTER - NOW RELEASED

Started by Blueforlife, July 23, 2024, 02:51:46 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Waffler

He was VERY good. Not sure now though. He's 33 and missed the last 2 years.
Buried in the essentially random digits of pi, you can find your eight-digit birthdate. (Is that a wink from God or just a lot of digits?) - David G. Myers
__________________________________________________
Everything seems stupid when it fails.  - Fyodor Dostoevsky

GOLDMEMBER

A potential very worthy addition. Hopefully he still has his ball hawking skills.
I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

Blueforlife

Quote from: Waffler on July 23, 2024, 02:53:22 PMHe was VERY good. Not sure now though. He's 33 and missed the last 2 years.
Yeah that's what I thought.  Maybe the knee is better and he is still in shape.  Will find out at practice. At the very least teach the young guys a few tricks.

Because he is a vet, what type of salary would he get(AR) ?

Sir Blue and Gold


Slingin Sammy

Maybe they see him as a replacement for BA; assuming they continue to have an import at that spot.  Or as the extra DB in place of Griffin who has been manning that spot, or backup SAM?  When healthy, he played as a halfback primarily; he was fast and was known as a ball hawk with good ball instincts.  Both Holm and Nichols got torched by the slot position occupied by K Schaffer Baker and his replacement Ajou against Sask; but I don't think they're looking to have Grymes start in any one of those positions...
Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses simply have their bright ideas closer together.

Sir Blue and Gold

#6
Quote from: Slingin Sammy on July 23, 2024, 03:24:14 PMMaybe they see him as a replacement for BA; assuming they continue to have an import at that spot.  Or as the extra DB in place of Griffin who has been manning that spot, or backup SAM?  When healthy, he played as a halfback primarily; he was fast and was known as a ball hawk with good ball instincts.  Both Holm and Nichols got torched by the slot position occupied by K Schaffer Baker and his replacement Ajou against Sask; but I don't think they're looking to have Grymes start in any one of those positions...

Agree on all fronts there. The other less likely scenario (as it doesn't happen often in the CFL) is that with him on the roster it might be possible to trade a piece of the secondary if we continue to lose. Not sure what that would accomplish but it's just such a weird add to me (unless someone is hurt and I suppose we'll find out this week). Grymes couldn't really stay healthy in his prime so does 2 years out of the game at age 33 help? Your Alexander theory is interesting I just have a hard time believing we'd replace one old guy for another.

Blue In BC

I can't imagine he'd sign to sit as a PR player for an extended time.  Assuming he's totally healthy now he could be a good addition.

As some have suggested he might replace Griffin on the AR. That in turn might mean than McGhee gets bumped all together? PR size is now technically 1 player over.

It didn't appear we had an injury in the secondary this week, so this is a bit of a strange move.

I had wondered whether we might be considering a trade of one of the back up Canadian DB's. Hallett, Hallett and Kelly don't seem to be either short or long term thoughts at safety. Noting that the Elks lost Hutter for the season and could use a backup at the very least.  Trade value would be low possibly 3rd or 4th rounder draft choice?
Take no prisoners

Blueforlife

Thanks for the chatter, we shall see how this move impacts our pr and ar

theaardvark

FCould this be an attempt to assuage all the fans on this board complaining that we don't sign mid-season FA's?

The fact he is on the PR means he obviously tried to land an AR spot everywhere, and this was the best offer he got. 

I have always admired Grymes playing style, he's an MOS type of guy for sure.  If he is a good fraction of his previous self, he will be a welcome addition.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Blue In BC

Quote from: theaardvark on July 23, 2024, 04:31:09 PMFCould this be an attempt to assuage all the fans on this board complaining that we don't sign mid-season FA's?

The fact he is on the PR means he obviously tried to land an AR spot everywhere, and this was the best offer he got. 

I have always admired Grymes playing style, he's an MOS type of guy for sure.  If he is a good fraction of his previous self, he will be a welcome addition.

It's not another conspiracy theory. Any player being signed will have to learn the playbook so he's not going to be immediately added to the AR unless dire emergency due to injury.

He's not going to be in game shape and didn't even attend any TC this year. So it will be a couple of weeks before they might even consider him being added to the AR.


Take no prisoners

TBURGESS

Grymes used to be great. Lets see if he still has anything left. 
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

blue_gold_84

Interesting addition. Not sure what to make of it at the moment, though.
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず

RebusRankin

A 33 year old with a long injury history whose been out of football for since 2021. Terrible signing.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: RebusRankin on July 23, 2024, 05:45:28 PMA 33 year old with a long injury history whose been out of football for since 2021. Terrible signing.

It's just a PR move. Probably best to pump the brakes for now.
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず

Pete

The caveat has always been we need to expand our recruitment to take advantage of opportunities to IMPROVE this team. If Grymes does that great, but we've missed out already on signing players that meet this criteria.

RebusRankin

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on July 23, 2024, 05:49:42 PMIt's just a PR move. Probably best to pump the brakes for now.

Titus Wall and Tavarus McFadden both have experience, both are younger, both are healthier and we're out there at times this season and we go with Grymes. I stand by my comment that its a terrible move. We've already got issues with Bighill, Alexander and Thomas playing poorly, looking slow and who are all older.

Blue In BC

Quote from: RebusRankin on July 23, 2024, 06:32:20 PMTitus Wall and Tavarus McFadden both have experience, both are younger, both are healthier and we're out there at times this season and we go with Grymes. I stand by my comment that its a terrible move. We've already got issues with Bighill, Alexander and Thomas playing poorly, looking slow and who are all older.

Neither are free agents. McFadden just re-signed with the Argos today.
Take no prisoners

blue_or_die

This signing isn't peculiar to me at all. Reminds me of a few years back when we signed Roosevelt, who never saw the field, to the PR.

Adds vet experience and a plug n play insurance option for an injury or declining performance, especially as the season goes on. It's a smart roster management move IMO but I wouldn't read into it any further.

I mean, we did the exact same thing with Lucky just a few weeks ago (although I expect to potentially see him on the field at some point).
#Ride?

Blueforlife

An insurance policy that might cash one day.  Good move imo. 

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: blue_or_die on July 23, 2024, 06:49:51 PMThis signing isn't peculiar to me at all. Reminds me of a few years back when we signed Roosevelt, who never saw the field, to the PR.

Adds vet experience and a plug n play insurance option for an injury or declining performance, especially as the season goes on. It's a smart roster management move IMO but I wouldn't read into it any further.

I mean, we did the exact same thing with Lucky just a few weeks ago (although I expect to potentially see him on the field at some point).

Fair - it could be no more than seeing a guy up close who used to be pretty good. The Lucky signing was a position of need though. You think if we were bringing someone in we would go with another receiver or defensive end or defensive lineman or some place that isn't one of our only real strengths. That said, not much to lose bringing him in and it might be all there is to it.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: RebusRankin on July 23, 2024, 06:32:20 PMTitus Wall and Tavarus McFadden both have experience, both are younger, both are healthier and we're out there at times this season and we go with Grymes. I stand by my comment that its a terrible move. We've already got issues with Bighill, Alexander and Thomas playing poorly, looking slow and who are all older.

Neither player you mentioned is a free agent.

So much for pumping the brakes. :-\
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず

RebusRankin

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on July 23, 2024, 06:57:38 PMNeither player you mentioned is a free agent.

So much for pumping the brakes. :-\

I said both were available at times this season, not right now. Perhaps you need to take some reading lessons.

Jesse

Quote from: blue_or_die on July 23, 2024, 06:49:51 PMThis signing isn't peculiar to me at all. Reminds me of a few years back when we signed Roosevelt, who never saw the field, to the PR.

Adds vet experience and a plug n play insurance option for an injury or declining performance, especially as the season goes on. It's a smart roster management move IMO but I wouldn't read into it any further.

I mean, we did the exact same thing with Lucky just a few weeks ago (although I expect to potentially see him on the field at some point).

Exactly.

This could be Grymes reaching out to teams asking for another shot and we agreed to bring him onto the PR just to see.
My wife is amazing!

Blueforlife

Wow some of the forum is grumpy LOL We got a new player, cheer up :)

blue_gold_84

Quote from: RebusRankin on July 23, 2024, 07:07:11 PMI said both were available at times this season, not right now. Perhaps you need to take some reading lessons.

Nah. You're just being grouchy.
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず


DM83

Great job scouting.  Is this. Guy the result of six' weeks of scouring the land?  Is McManus still working for the Bombers?  Two hundred guys. Just finished their USFL season, and we come up with a lame Edmonton Eskimo?

Really?

Blue In BC

Quote from: DM83 on July 23, 2024, 08:29:20 PMGreat job scouting.  Is this. Guy the result of six' weeks of scouring the land?  Is McManus still working for the Bombers?  Two hundred guys. Just finished their USFL season, and we come up with a lame Edmonton Eskimo?

Really?

Are any of the USFL players actually free agents at the moment? There is no agreement between the two leagues that allow players to come to Canada unless they are released.
Take no prisoners

Pete

Alexander is on the injury report today, is that a consideration?

Blue In BC

Quote from: Pete on July 23, 2024, 08:51:50 PMAlexander is on the injury report today, is that a consideration?

I doubt it. If he can't play we have an extra DB already on the AR and two on the PR. They will know the play book and the secondary would be shuffled around.

Even if Alexander has a serious injury, we have some other options including 3 Canadians. N. Hallett has started some games in the past.

Maybe we're trying to break some record on how many Canadians we can start. :(
Take no prisoners

Slingin Sammy

#31
Quote from: Blue In BC on July 23, 2024, 09:00:53 PMI doubt it. If he can't play we have an extra DB already on the AR and two on the PR. They will know the play book and the secondary would be shuffled around.

Even if Alexander has a serious injury, we have some other options including 3 Canadians. N. Hallett has started some games in the past.

Maybe we're trying to break some record on how many Canadians we can start. :(


Posted the following in the Bombers v Argo thread:

I was at practise today (July 23rd).  Here are some observations

6 game injured list players: None of them including Lawler practised.  Fox and Haba were running.  Lawson is nowhere near a return.  He was gingerly trying to make his way up the stands backwards with other injured players.

1 game injured list players: Kelly and Samson practised.

New injuries: Wilson and Cole.  Oliveira didn't practise but likely maintenance.  BA didn't practise (not sure if he's maintenance or some other issue).

KR/PR: Case got the 1st reps, followed by Smith and then Whitehead.  Case likely remains KR/PR and backup receiver.

Offence and receivers: No changes other than Augustine and Smith getting reps with 1s in BOs absence.  Whitehead did not get any first team reps.  Highly unlikely he draws into the lineup.

Defence: Some interesting changes in BAs absence.  Nichols slid over to safety; Bridges at boundary half.  Jones in at WIL for Wilson. Griffin in for Cole. D Line rotation remained the same as last week with Garbutt and Jefferson on the ends.

Grymes slotted in with the 2s at boundary halfback.  He was picking BAs brain throughout the practice.

Not sure if the alignment with Nichols at safety is something they're going to try, but it would explain picking up Grymes.  It's also curious that they wouldn't have slotted in one of the Hallets if this was just filling in for BA while he takes a maintenance day.

Zach was up and down.  Threw some nice balls but also some bad picks to Kelly and Bonds.  Seemed hesitant at times when going up against scout D.

I can't make it out to any other practices this week so it will be interesting to see if the changes on D at the start of the week translate into game day/roster changes
Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses simply have their bright ideas closer together.

dd

Once upon a time, Grymes used to be a very good DB, hope he still has some gas left in his tank and our secondary will just get stronger.

Pete

With Whitehead does it feel like Walters signed him with resistance from OShea so now OShea will let him wither on PR?
 Basing this on O'Sheas comments every time hes asked about Lucky. Saying that it takes time to learn the offence. To me this is baloney. Lucky is a cfl vet. You see lots of teams incorporating new receivers successfully.
By game day he will have been here 3 weeks.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on July 23, 2024, 03:06:44 PMDo we have an injury? Seems like a peculiar add to me.

a) Could be a message Parker is 100% done for the entire season.

b) I like the theory he could be a BA replacement.  Or maybe Bonds isn't doing as well as we thought?

My thoughts on Grymes:

1) He's the dude with the poofy hair in a pony tail right?  Superb player when we last saw him: fast and can lay wood.

2) I never noticed he left, I don't follow other teams' IRs and let-gos.

3) 33yo is a problem as DBs are often the first player type to "lose it" when they get anywhere close to 30.  We've seen them age out fast so many times in WFC.

4) But our real need is on the DL!  We always do these weird signings that don't seem to address what most see as the real problem.  Maybe you take what you can get??
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on July 23, 2024, 04:31:09 PMFCould this be an attempt to assuage all the fans on this board complaining that we don't sign mid-season FA's?

Haha!  I doubt it, but it's a fun thought!  I'd be curious to know who in WFC was making the push to get him?
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Blue In BC on July 23, 2024, 09:00:53 PMMaybe we're trying to break some record on how many Canadians we can start. :(

MOS: I won't be happy until I start 24 NATs!  Bwaaahaaahaaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

If we managed to do that, we should just be awarded the GC for sheer temerity.
Never go full Rider!

Blue In BC

Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 24, 2024, 04:43:09 AMa) Could be a message Parker is 100% done for the entire season.

b) I like the theory he could be a BA replacement.  Or maybe Bonds isn't doing as well as we thought?

My thoughts on Grymes:

1) He's the dude with the poofy hair in a pony tail right?  Superb player when we last saw him: fast and can lay wood.

2) I never noticed he left, I don't follow other teams' IRs and let-gos.

3) 33yo is a problem as DBs are often the first player type to "lose it" when they get anywhere close to 30.  We've seen them age out fast so many times in WFC.

4) But our real need is on the DL!  We always do these weird signings that don't seem to address what most see as the real problem.  Maybe you take what you can get??

Grymes hasn't played since 2021. That's a long time. At best it will take time to gain conditioning and improve reaction time.

He had a high football IQ and a nose for the ball.

The signing is curious but worth the look I suppose.
Take no prisoners

TBURGESS

MOS seems to think that our problem is not enough old vets way past their prime.
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

markf

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 24, 2024, 02:59:32 PMMOS seems to think that our problem is not enough old vets way past their prime.

Maybe he's a George Allen fan?

Blueforlife

BMO Field

TORONTO ARGONAUTS   Practice Day   
Player Name   Position   Injury   TUE   WED   THU   Game Status
Tunde Adeleke   DB   Knee   Full   Full      
Rasheed Bailey   WR   Head   DNP   Limited      
Tyshon Blackburn   DB   Knee   Full   Full      
Jared Brinkman   DL   Ankle   DNP   DNP      
Jake Ceresna   DL   Shoulder   Limited   Limited      
Jonathan Edouard   DB   Elbow   DNP   DNP      
Kerfalla Exumé   DB   Foot   Limited   Limited      
Dylan Giffen   OL   Groin   Full   Full      
Jamie Harry   DB   Hip   DNP   DNP      
Daniel Kwamou   LB   Knee   DNP   DNP      
Kevin Mital   WR   Foot   Full   Full      
Folarin Orimolade   DL   Ankle   Full   Full      
Robert Priester   DB   Shoulder   Limited   Limited      
David Ungerer III   WR   Hamstring   Full   Full      
 

WINNIPEG BLUE BOMBERS   Practice Day   
Player Name   Position   Injury   TUE   WED   THU   Game Status
Kyle Samson   DL   Healthy Scratch   Full   Full      
Brian Cole   LB   Foot   DNP   DNP      
Kyrie Wilson   LB   Shoulder   DNP   DNP      
Jake Kelly   DB   Elbow   Full   Full      
Brandon Alexander   DB   Neck   DNP   Full      
Bailey Feltmate   FB   Elbow   DNP   DNP      
Brady Oliveira   RB   Shoulder   DNP   Ful

DM83

What's a Bailey Feltmate?
Who is This Kelly guy?

The Bombers have to have a ton of money available to sign guys

Where is McManus?
If Collaros can't throw for more than a hundred yards, let's start the re building.

Blueforlife

Quote from: DM83 on July 24, 2024, 08:53:38 PMWhat's a Bailey Feltmate?
Who is This Kelly guy?

The Bombers have to have a ton of money available to sign guys

Where is McManus?
If Collaros can't throw for more than a hundred yards, let's start the re building.
Feltmate our FB on 6 game I think
Kelly is a depth player I don't know much about him, others do on here
We don't have a ton of money
Overstated on negative about Zach

Waffler

I had my doubts about Grymes too but watching him in practice today I have to say he looked great. Wearing a giant knee brace but didn't seem to hinder his speed or reaction time at all. Ironically Alexander wears a smaller brace now, just the elastic kind I believe, and he was walking pretty tender on that side at times. How is he supposed to run?

Kind of sad when our 2 insurance players (Lucky the other) are better than what we are starting.
Buried in the essentially random digits of pi, you can find your eight-digit birthdate. (Is that a wink from God or just a lot of digits?) - David G. Myers
__________________________________________________
Everything seems stupid when it fails.  - Fyodor Dostoevsky

theaardvark

Quote from: DM83 on July 24, 2024, 08:53:38 PMWhat's a Bailey Feltmate?
Who is This Kelly guy?

The Bombers have to have a ton of money available to sign guys

Where is McManus?
If Collaros can't throw for more than a hundred yards, let's start the re building.

You realize that Lawler, Schoen and Oliveira are some of the highest paid players in the league, right?  And Zach is the highest paid.  And we have Willie and Biggie too?

We do not have money... except what little savings we might be getting from the 6 game.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

dd

Quote from: Waffler on July 24, 2024, 09:05:38 PMI had my doubts about Grymes too but watching him in practice today I have to say he looked great. Wearing a giant knee brace but didn't seem to hinder his speed or reaction time at all. Ironically Alexander wears a smaller brace now, just the elastic kind I believe, and he was walking pretty tender on that side at times. How is he supposed to run?

Kind of sad when our 2 insurance players (Lucky the other) are better than what we are starting.
Grymes will be an asset for sure. If Alexander is out, I'd be inserting him into the lineup for sure. He's a vet and can help lead things out there, plus he's a very fast and physical player from what I remember. We need more of those!!

Blue In BC

Quote from: dd on July 24, 2024, 10:30:53 PMGrymes will be an asset for sure. If Alexander is out, I'd be inserting him into the lineup for sure. He's a vet and can help lead things out there, plus he's a very fast and physical player from what I remember. We need more of those!!

That's a lot to ask for a player that hasn't played in over 2 years and only had 2 practices.

Alexander did practice today so he'll probably play.
Take no prisoners

Blueforlife

Quote from: theaardvark on July 24, 2024, 09:31:38 PMYou realize that Lawler, Schoen and Oliveira are some of the highest paid players in the league, right?  And Zach is the highest paid.  And we have Willie and Biggie too?

We do not have money... except what little savings we might be getting from the 6 game.
Agree, lots of fake news floating around

Jesse

Quote from: theaardvark on July 24, 2024, 09:31:38 PMYou realize that Lawler, Schoen and Oliveira are some of the highest paid players in the league, right?  And Zach is the highest paid.  And we have Willie and Biggie too?

We do not have money... except what little savings we might be getting from the 6 game.

No one available to bring in right now is coming in at a high price. The salary cap is pretty close to irrelevant right now.
My wife is amazing!

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: Jesse on July 25, 2024, 12:40:37 AMNo one available to bring in right now is coming in at a high price. The salary cap is pretty close to irrelevant right now.

It's not irrelevant at all. Grey Cup in Winnipeg next year and we're going to likely be reloading in the off season. The more we can save the better. I hope we use IR money to front load some contracts prior to fee agency.

winbear

Quote from: Jesse on July 25, 2024, 12:40:37 AMNo one available to bring in right now is coming in at a high price. The salary cap is pretty close to irrelevant right now.
Because of the injuries we may be under the salary cap, however we still have to pay all the players on the roster, the injury list and the practice roster.  Where does that money come from, general revenue?  You can exempt injury costs, but the players still have to be paid.

Blueforlife

Quote from: Jesse on July 25, 2024, 12:40:37 AMNo one available to bring in right now is coming in at a high price. The salary cap is pretty close to irrelevant right now.
Disagree
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on July 25, 2024, 12:56:39 AMIt's not irrelevant at all. Grey Cup in Winnipeg next year and we're going to likely be reloading in the off season. The more we can save the better. I hope we use IR money to front load some contracts prior to fee agency.
Agree

TecnoGenius

Quote from: winbear on July 25, 2024, 01:08:53 AMWhere does that money come from, general revenue?  You can exempt injury costs, but the players still have to be paid.

No one in WFC cares about "real" money for players.  It's all about the SMS.  We're the most-flush $$$ team in the CFL.  If there was no SMS we'd pull a Rocket Ishmael!!

When talking about money, to keep it simple, only talk in SMS terms, IMHO.
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on July 24, 2024, 09:31:38 PMYou realize that Lawler, Schoen and Oliveira are some of the highest paid players in the league, right?  And Zach is the highest paid.  And we have Willie and Biggie too?

Yup.  If you want to see where most of our SMS is, look in the hot tub.  In there you will find Scrooge McDuck swimming in dollar bills along with half our elite players.

KW spelled it out in TC: there. is. no. (sms.) money.  None.  (Just a tiny bit now because of 6GIR, but not as much as we "deserve", because of bonuses...)
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 24, 2024, 02:59:32 PMMOS seems to think that our problem is not enough old vets way past their prime.

Ok, I'll revise my MOS quote:

MOS: I won't be satisfied until we start 18 Canadians and 6 players over 35!  Bwwwaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaa

(allegedly)
Never go full Rider!

blue_gold_84

Quote from: DM83 on July 24, 2024, 08:53:38 PMThe Bombers have to have a ton of money available to sign guys

[CITATION NOT FOUND]
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず

Blue In BC

We're probably saving some SMS on 6 game IR but a lot of the players on the list are ELC guys. Hard to tell how much we're saving with Lawler, Schoen and Lawson due to early money.

OTOH, we've been lucky with very few players on the 1 game. A few but ELC guys for short periods so far.
Take no prisoners

bluebeard

Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 25, 2024, 06:51:16 AMNo one in WFC cares about "real" money for players.  It's all about the SMS.  We're the most-flush $$$ team in the CFL.  If there was no SMS we'd pull a Rocket Ishmael!!

When talking about money, to keep it simple, only talk in SMS terms, IMHO.

It does not take long to burn threw money if the team starts losing.  Look at Sask and Edmonton.  Elks have to sell to private concerns.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 24, 2024, 02:59:32 PMMOS seems to think that our problem is not enough old vets way past their prime.

I guess they shouldn't have parted ways with Nick Taylor, amazing athlete. he'd still be productive at 36.

Jesse

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on July 26, 2024, 04:25:15 AMI guess they shouldn't have parted ways with Nick Taylor, amazing athlete. he'd still be productive at 36.

I wonder how many posts Tburg has saying we should have signed Sankey, Bowman, etc?
My wife is amazing!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: bluebeard on July 25, 2024, 06:24:50 PMIt does not take long to burn threw money if the team starts losing.  Look at Sask and Edmonton.  Elks have to sell to private concerns.

Meh.  WPG fans are nuts loyal and will come out to PAS even if we start pulling a 2014.  Proof: look at 2013-2015.  Sure, numbers were down from today (backing out "new barn" artificial bump), but they never went to EDM basement levels.

I still maintain that "real" money doesn't matter in the CFL.  Even for the "have not" teams.  No one spends $1M less than the SMS because they are too poor.  And in any event, I don't think it applies to our situation & fan base.
Never go full Rider!

TBURGESS

Quote from: Jesse on July 26, 2024, 04:54:30 AMI wonder how many posts Tburg has saying we should have signed Sankey, Bowman, etc?
Zero, but I would take Sankey over Biggie in a heartbeat. 
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 26, 2024, 01:59:30 PMZero, but I would take Sankey over Biggie in a heartbeat.

Who wouldn't? I feel bad saying that, by the way. But holding on too long is in part why we're 2-5.

DM83

Nice hair....couldnt make a woeful elks roster. Bombers are in trouble.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: DM83 on July 26, 2024, 04:51:54 PMNice hair....couldnt make a woeful elks roster. Bombers are in trouble.


He didn't make the Elks roster in 2022 because he couldn't play on one leg.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: DM83 on July 26, 2024, 04:51:54 PMNice hair....couldnt make a woeful elks roster. Bombers are in trouble.

Liquid lunch is always a fun idea on a Friday.
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず

DM83

Thanks, I will drink to that! Oooooh, sorry just frustrated by the lack of effort by both Jets and Bombers.

dd

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 26, 2024, 01:59:30 PMZero, but I would take Sankey over Biggie in a heartbeat.
I still say that was a huge mistake.

TBURGESS

Quote from: dd on July 27, 2024, 02:40:43 PMI still say that was a huge mistake.
You're allowed to have that opinion, wrong as it is.
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

theaardvark

Quote from: dd on July 27, 2024, 02:40:43 PMI still say that was a huge mistake.

Not signing Sankey and sticking with Bighill was a gut call, and I get it, Biggie brings a lot more to the team than stats.  Keeping Collaros over Brown, same deal. The deciding factor in both was what has also built our dynamic team culture.

Many will say that there should be no loyalty in pro sports.  As long as you produce, you earn "loyalty".  In both those cases, the player was producing at the time of decision.  Monday Morning QB hindsight is an easy game.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

dd

Quote from: theaardvark on July 27, 2024, 03:16:08 PMNot signing Sankey and sticking with Bighill was a gut call, and I get it, Biggie brings a lot more to the team than stats.  Keeping Collaros over Brown, same deal. The deciding factor in both was what has also built our dynamic team culture.

Many will say that there should be no loyalty in pro sports.  As long as you produce, you earn "loyalty".  In both those cases, the player was producing at the time of decision.  Monday Morning QB hindsight is an easy game.
We could have moved biggie to will to prolong his career and had a phenomenal LB corps plus transitioned biggie to retirement and had a plan moving forward. Right now, we have an old horse and no succession plan. Great call! For Collaros and brown, I would have traded Collaros and stuck with brown. You could see from last year's elk game who was the better Qb. Collaros would have had some trade value then, not so much now.

BBRT

Quote from: dd on July 27, 2024, 04:50:17 PMWe could have moved biggie to will to prolong his career and had a phenomenal LB corps plus transitioned biggie to retirement and had a plan moving forward. Right now, we have an old horse and no succession plan. Great call! For Collaros and brown, I would have traded Collaros and stuck with brown. You could see from last year's elk game who was the better Qb. Collaros would have had some trade value then, not so much now.

I have to reluctantly agree with your statement. However the past is the past and there is not much we can do about it today. However it is not too late to see what we can do to recover part of the season and also to plan for 2025. I am sure there are a number of discussions going on behind closed doors regarding what worked and did not work in 2024 and plans for how to reload for the 2025 season are probably well under way. Just who stays and who goes will probably not be known until post 2024 season end.

theaardvark

Moving Biggie to WIL means calling on him to drop into pass coverage more, which would be much harder for him.

Moving Biggie to WIL means taking Wilson off the starting DC.

Now, if you wanted to bring in Sankey, you could move to a 3-4 D front with Biggie and Sankey as MLB.

But still, it was unfortunate timing when Sankey came available.  But 7 other teams missed out on him as well...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Blueforlife

Biggie will have ups and downs, was like that last couple of years.  He was once one of the best players ever at his position and the sun is setting.

Zach will sort it out, imo.

dd

Quote from: theaardvark on July 27, 2024, 05:20:59 PMMoving Biggie to WIL means calling on him to drop into pass coverage more, which would be much harder for him.

Moving Biggie to WIL means taking Wilson off the starting DC.

Now, if you wanted to bring in Sankey, you could move to a 3-4 D front with Biggie and Sankey as MLB.

But still, it was unfortunate timing when Sankey came available.  But 7 other teams missed out on him as well...
Ya, but the other 7 teams didn't have an aging, slow, oft injured MLB in their lineup. It's water under the bridge but seems he is still fiercely loyal to in house players and doesn't like to admit that maybe, just maybe bringing someone new in just might upgrade our lineup. Not giving whitehead a shot proves that beyond a shadow of a doubt as Kase couldn't carry Luckys cleats to the field

theaardvark

Quote from: dd on July 27, 2024, 10:18:47 PMYa, but the other 7 teams didn't have an aging, slow, oft injured MLB in their lineup.

How many had 3x GC winner, 3x MODP, 6x CFL all star and future HOF MLB in thier lineups?
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

dd

Quote from: theaardvark on July 27, 2024, 10:22:09 PMHow many had 3x GC winner, 3x MODP, 6x CFL all star and future HOF MLB in thier lineups?
So wouldn't bring Sankey in today if you could?? Nuff said.

theaardvark

Quote from: dd on July 27, 2024, 10:28:18 PMSo wouldn't bring Sankey in today if you could?? Nuff said.

If we had the $SMS, sure.  No brainer, especially with Wilson on the 6 game.

At that moment in time, we couldn't if we wanted to, no $SMS.  We went over that year as it was.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: dd on July 27, 2024, 10:28:18 PMSo wouldn't bring Sankey in today if you could?? Nuff said.

I'm not sold on Sankey, never was.  I'm not sure he's a FIFO guy.  I'm not sure he's a MOS guy.  MLB is more than just physical talent, especially for our team.

Biggie is the team leader and the vet of vets.  He's the guy a C doing the coin toss every game.  You don't just dump such a player for Mr. Bruiser Of The Week.

I think what will happen is Biggie will tell us when Biggie feels he's harming the team more than helping, and on that day he'll hang up the cleats.  Biggie won't prolong things just to get a paycheck.  That's not who he is.
Never go full Rider!

Throw Long Bannatyne

#79
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 29, 2024, 09:30:20 AMI'm not sold on Sankey, never was.  I'm not sure he's a FIFO guy.  I'm not sure he's a MOS guy.  MLB is more than just physical talent, especially for our team.

Biggie is the team leader and the vet of vets.  He's the guy a C doing the coin toss every game.  You don't just dump such a player for Mr. Bruiser Of The Week.

I think what will happen is Biggie will tell us when Biggie feels he's harming the team more than helping, and on that day he'll hang up the cleats.  Biggie won't prolong things just to get a paycheck.  That's not who he is.

I agree, O'Shea is not going to just dump Biggie off on the side of the road, I think the criticism has gotten carried away as Defence is not as serious an issue on this team as some are making it out to be and Biggie is playing adequately well.

Bighill made a total commitment to the Bombers and the city and should be acknowledged as a key player in bringing the GC back to Wpg. along with Harris and Collaros. Don't know if he has a job in the organization when he retires but he might be best suited to replace Wade if he ever wishes to step away from his role as President.

Sir Blue and Gold

#80
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 29, 2024, 09:30:20 AMI'm not sold on Sankey, never was.  I'm not sure he's a FIFO guy.  I'm not sure he's a MOS guy.  MLB is more than just physical talent, especially for our team.

Biggie is the team leader and the vet of vets.  He's the guy a C doing the coin toss every game.  You don't just dump such a player for Mr. Bruiser Of The Week.

I think what will happen is Biggie will tell us when Biggie feels he's harming the team more than helping, and on that day he'll hang up the cleats.  Biggie won't prolong things just to get a paycheck.  That's not who he is.

I am not arguing for Sankey but I want to address the 'Not O'Shea's guy mentality'.

The entire point of having a great culture IS that it brings together players. Occasionally you've got to cut ties for sure, but culture building is done preciously so you get the most from everyone, even players who are harder to coach. That's at least half of O'Shea's job. A great culture should INCREASE the number of players we can bring in while still being effective, not shrink it down. Particularly when we're 2-6.

DM83

Agreed with Sir Blue and Gold.
So there is something else wrong with this management group.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: DM83 on July 29, 2024, 04:22:15 PMAgreed with Sir Blue and Gold.
So there is something else wrong with this management group.

Why does there have to be 'something wrong' with the management group?


theaardvark

There is nothing "wrong" with a group that has gotten the team to 4 straight cups after 29 years of failure. 

Teams can have off years, the league balances itself with the $SMS, teams that have success thanks to great scouting and recruitement/development tend to get penalized by not being able to keep all those players that made them great because $SMS.

We haven't had a great a recruiting crop manifest yet this year, and have a crap ton of injuries testing that depth too early too often.

Management group is doing great.  Coaches are working with what they have, and every coach, regardless record or results, is going to Monday Morning QB'd.  Its just a lot easier to do when the results are not going your way.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

Quote from: theaardvark on July 29, 2024, 04:53:03 PMThere is nothing "wrong" with a group that has gotten the team to 4 straight cups after 29 years of failure. 

Teams can have off years, the league balances itself with the $SMS, teams that have success thanks to great scouting and recruitement/development tend to get penalized by not being able to keep all those players that made them great because $SMS.

We haven't had a great a recruiting crop manifest yet this year, and have a crap ton of injuries testing that depth too early too often.

Management group is doing great.  Coaches are working with what they have, and every coach, regardless record or results, is going to Monday Morning QB'd.  Its just a lot easier to do when the results are not going your way.

I think you're leaning a little too hard in the opposite direction, here. The Bombers aren't infallible, they can and do make mistakes that don't always need the benefit of hindsight to recognize.

I'm fine with the decision to ride this group until the wheels fell off, but there were certainly some things they could have done to mitigate some of our loses and the lack of depth is high on that list.
My wife is amazing!

theaardvark

Quote from: Jesse on July 29, 2024, 05:05:02 PMI think you're leaning a little too hard in the opposite direction, here. The Bombers aren't infallible, they can and do make mistakes that don't always need the benefit of hindsight to recognize.

I'm fine with the decision to ride this group until the wheels fell off, but there were certainly some things they could have done to mitigate some of our loses and the lack of depth is high on that list.

Lack of depth.

We almost won a game, on the road, against a top contender, giving up a 5-1 turnover ratio.  And we went to OT where our money kicker missed one.

All while we have 12 players on the 6 game, including 7 players penciled in to start before the season.

So, we're 12 players (7 starters) into our "depth" and we still almost won a road game where the officials made it very difficult for us.

"Depth" I think is the least of our issues, in a reasonable year.  This year has been totally unreasonable.  Losing your top 2 recievers for extended periods, your starting DT's and a DE, starting CB..

Not sure within roster size and $SMS rules that they could have done better... 
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Nic16

I am completely puzzled why they would bring in a 33 yr old DB - who has been out of football for 2 yrs and showed up with a knee brace strapped on his leg.

We already have 3 backup DB's, and not one American DE on the PR!?!

Jesse

Quote from: theaardvark on July 29, 2024, 07:23:08 PMLack of depth.

We almost won a game, on the road, against a top contender, giving up a 5-1 turnover ratio.  And we went to OT where our money kicker missed one.

All while we have 12 players on the 6 game, including 7 players penciled in to start before the season.

So, we're 12 players (7 starters) into our "depth" and we still almost won a road game where the officials made it very difficult for us.

"Depth" I think is the least of our issues, in a reasonable year.  This year has been totally unreasonable.  Losing your top 2 recievers for extended periods, your starting DT's and a DE, starting CB..

Not sure within roster size and $SMS rules that they could have done better... 

You're looking through a very narrow scope.

Why are we playing so many rookies? Why do we not have players who have been depth and are now growing into their starter roles as Hardrick, and Jeffcoat leave? The injuries are ridiculous, but planning for player succession is something people have been bringing up for 2-3 years now.
My wife is amazing!

TBURGESS

MOS needs to find his inner Wally and cut a couple of old guys who won't be here next year.
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 29, 2024, 07:51:39 PMMOS needs to find his inner Wally and cut a couple of old guys who won't be here next year.

Not if they're vets with guaranteed '25 money they won't!!
Never go full Rider!

TBURGESS

Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 30, 2024, 06:22:42 AMNot if they're vets with guaranteed '25 money they won't!!
Are Neuf, Alexander, & Biggie guaranteed '25 money? Will any of them play next year anyway?
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: TBURGESS on July 30, 2024, 02:28:30 PMAre Neuf, Alexander, & Biggie guaranteed '25 money? Will any of them play next year anyway?

All three of them have deals expiring at the end of this year.

TBURGESS

Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

theaardvark

Quote from: Jesse on July 29, 2024, 07:37:04 PMYou're looking through a very narrow scope.

Why are we playing so many rookies? Why do we not have players who have been depth and are now growing into their starter roles as Hardrick, and Jeffcoat leave? The injuries are ridiculous, but planning for player succession is something people have been bringing up for 2-3 years now.


Look at the IR.  That's where our replacements are.  That's why "so many rookies".

You CANNOT roster vet backups,  The $SMS does not allow for competent vet backups on a roster.  Backups are ALWAYS ELC's or developing NATS.

Most teams (including us) usually have to field a few "backups" due to injury.  12 players, including 7 starters on the 6 game.  Hence, "so many rookies".

And its not like there is a pantry full of competent veteran starter material players waiting to be signed.

Hence, need I say it again, "so many rookies".
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: theaardvark on July 30, 2024, 03:56:29 PMLook at the IR.  That's where our replacements are.  That's why "so many rookies".

You CANNOT roster vet backups,  The $SMS does not allow for competent vet backups on a roster.  Backups are ALWAYS ELC's or developing NATS.

Most teams (including us) usually have to field a few "backups" due to injury.  12 players, including 7 starters on the 6 game.  Hence, "so many rookies".

And its not like there is a pantry full of competent veteran starter material players waiting to be signed.

Hence, need I say it again, "so many rookies".

Injuries are part of the problem but not the only (or even biggest one). There's not the single rookie on the offensive line, actually the guy with the least experience is playing the best, and that unit is LAST in sacks allowed, for example.

theaardvark

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on July 30, 2024, 04:02:38 PMInjuries are part of the problem but not the only (or even biggest one). There's not the single rookie on the offensive line, actually the guy with the least experience is playing the best, and that unit is LAST in sacks allowed, for example.

Sacks allowed is not 100% on the oline.  There are "coverage sacks" and there are blitzes where the oline doesn't have a chance.  5 guys can make perfect blocks, and if they rush a 6th and the RB misses him, sack.

Sacks can also happen when a QB is having an issue with confidence, and holds on too long.

Not saying there haven't been sacks on Oline whiffs, but not all of them have been the oline's fault.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: theaardvark on July 30, 2024, 04:18:29 PMSacks allowed is not 100% on the oline.  There are "coverage sacks" and there are blitzes where the oline doesn't have a chance.  5 guys can make perfect blocks, and if they rush a 6th and the RB misses him, sack.

Sacks can also happen when a QB is having an issue with confidence, and holds on too long.

Not saying there haven't been sacks on Oline whiffs, but not all of them have been the oline's fault.

From the Toronto game:

Zach Collaros dropped back to pass 37 times and Chris Streveler had one passing attempt. Of those 38 dropbacks, they were hurried nine times, hit five times, knocked down three times, and sacked five times.

When Toronto only sent a three or four-man rush, which they did on 21 occasions, those non-blitz rushes led to four hurries, one hit, two knockdowns, and an unforgivable four sacks.

...Sounds like great offensive line play to me!

The Zipp

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on July 30, 2024, 04:23:06 PMFrom the Toronto game:

Zach Collaros dropped back to pass 37 times and Chris Streveler had one passing attempt. Of those 38 dropbacks, they were hurried nine times, hit five times, knocked down three times, and sacked five times.

When Toronto only sent a three or four-man rush, which they did on 21 occasions, those non-blitz rushes led to four hurries, one hit, two knockdowns, and an unforgivable four sacks.

...Sounds like great offensive line play to me!

sub par at best...I do think TO has a very good defence - better than BC's IMO, so perhaps we will get a reprieve for our porous O-line this week.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on July 30, 2024, 04:23:06 PM...Sounds like great offensive line play to me!

Nearly positive he was being sarcastic... Those details, basically what I outlined on my rewatch, are atrociously bad and completely unacceptable in the CFL.
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on July 30, 2024, 04:18:29 PMSacks allowed is not 100% on the oline.  There are "coverage sacks" and there are blitzes where the oline doesn't have a chance.  5 guys can make perfect blocks, and if they rush a 6th and the RB misses him, sack.

Ya, an every single coverage sack where the QB has >3 sec could be avoided by channeling the inner Matt Nichols and chucking it into the stands.  Nichols wasn't wrong about everything, ya know.
Never go full Rider!

BlueInCgy

You know it's bad when the virtues of Matt Nichols are extolled...

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: BlueInCgy on July 31, 2024, 11:56:13 AMYou know it's bad when the virtues of Matt Nichols are extolled...

Matt Nichols was a great QB, no besmirching allowed!

blue_gold_84

Quote from: BlueInCgy on July 31, 2024, 11:56:13 AMYou know it's bad when the virtues of Matt Nichols are extolled...

TIL being a consistently competent QB qualifies as virtuous.
#forthew
лава Україні!
We are now in The Find Out Phase, eh.
井の中の蛙大海を知らず

Blue In BC

We've taken off two rookie DB's from the last game. BC is primarily a passing team. To that end I could see Grymes being added onto the AR.

At the moment, based on the transactions yesterday we have room for 1 more import. Another possibility due to injuries to Canadian LB's is that we add Karamoko as the 2nd Global player in lieu of a Canadian moving to IR.

Part of the real question is about how long are the new injuries going to be out if they move to IR? Two LB's and Woli are the " questionable " players.

OTOH, the good news is that we haven't heard they were moved to 6 game IR. YET. Maybe they can play
Take no prisoners

Jesse

Quote from: Blue In BC on July 31, 2024, 01:43:34 PMWe've taken off two rookie DB's from the last game. BC is primarily a passing team. To that end I could see Grymes being added onto the AR.

At the moment, based on the transactions yesterday we have room for 1 more import. Another possibility due to injuries to Canadian LB's is that we add Karamoko as the 2nd Global player in lieu of a Canadian moving to IR.

Part of the real question is about how long are the new injuries going to be out if they move to IR? Two LB's and Woli are the " questionable " players.

OTOH, the good news is that we haven't heard they were moved to 6 game IR. YET. Maybe they can play

We had a lot of DBs on the roster last week for some reason. Normally we have Hallet one one extra DB. Last week it was 2 Hallets and 2 extra DBs.

Had to balance that out.
My wife is amazing!

Blue In BC

Quote from: Jesse on July 31, 2024, 02:10:36 PMWe had a lot of DBs on the roster last week for some reason. Normally we have Hallet one one extra DB. Last week it was 2 Hallets and 2 extra DBs.

Had to balance that out.

Yes and no. Adams is a much better passer than the Argo QB's. A heavy rotation of fresh DB's against Adams is not a bad idea. However the balance was out of whack when we needed another receiver due to injuries.
Take no prisoners

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: Blue In BC on July 31, 2024, 02:31:43 PMYes and no. Adams is a much better passer than the Argo QB's. A heavy rotation of fresh DB's against Adams is not a bad idea. However the balance was out of whack when we needed another receiver due to injuries.

Other than injury replacement, what are you referring to?  DB's normally play entire games without rotation.


Jesse

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on July 31, 2024, 02:37:38 PMOther than injury replacement, what are you referring to?  DB's normally play entire games without rotation.



Don't think that's the case, saw lots of our back-ups in the field last week.
My wife is amazing!

dd

Quote from: Blue In BC on July 31, 2024, 02:31:43 PMYes and no. Adams is a much better passer than the Argo QB's. A heavy rotation of fresh DB's against Adams is not a bad idea. However the balance was out of whack when we needed another receiver due to injuries.
Agreed. Adams is clearly the best Qb in the league in terms of passing and avoiding the rush-he has very quick feet in the pocket. Dukes and Arbuckle are at best backup Qb's, both can't pass to save their souls.

Given our soft pass rush, our secondary is going to be tested like no other game this season, and with only 5 days between games, I just think that just catches up to them in the second half. On the other side though, Lions have been off for 2 weeks, so they may be slow coming out of the blocks with a bit of rust, but man, they have some weapons on offense to contend with.

Blue In BC

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on July 31, 2024, 02:37:38 PMOther than injury replacement, what are you referring to?  DB's normally play entire games without rotation.



We often add in a 6th DB in
 obvious passing downs. Depending on field position, distance we use different extra DB's in varied defensive schemes.

At times Alexander is clsoer to LOS and maybe Hallett drops into the normal safety position. We saw Kramdi making TFL and Griffin seemed to be on the field.

It's hard to tell with the constant changing of personnel, who is where or why.

The DB's seemed to be used more in coverage teams last week?
Take no prisoners

The Zipp


GOLDMEMBER

I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: The Zipp on August 17, 2024, 12:30:49 AMHe has been released as per Ed Tait

Must not have been able to get healthy?  Too old?

Or is this a function of Jones being amazing at WILL?  Grymes is kind of a DB that can do SAM & WILL, right?  Our DB/WILL cupboard is stocked fully now.

Too bad, what a great player for so long.  Thanks for trying anyhow Grymes!  It's nice he got one last shot.  And I guess he'll be on the couch should injuries arise...
Never go full Rider!