Guardian cap

[theaardvark]

Keeping in mind that the Guardian Caps are to help prevent CTE, which is a cumulative effect which may or may not ever result in missed games. I don't know how anyone can claim there are a low amount of injuries. I imagine, percentage wise, injuries are at 100% across the league. Many will experience deficits of various types throughout their life.

Not to mention the average life expectancy of a professional football player is somewhere in the 50s.

Yup. Just a ridiculous statement, aards.

My point was that protective equipment is pretty much maxed out, you are not going to get 100% injury free, so making the injuries that happen less is the key.  Advances in equipment and in training/preparation has reduced certain injuries, for sure.  With our game and our rules, I am surprised injuries are as low as they are, say, compared to NFL.

Does that happen with equipment alone?  Nope

Do we need more rule changes to make it safer, more suspensions to bring accountability to players for actions that injure?  That would help.

Do we change the actual game to remove plays that cause injuries?  Not sure if there are stats on which plays cause most injuries, short yardage, deep pocket drops, punt returns... are there rules that can be implemented so that players do not have to make plays that lead to injury. 

Do we increase the penalty for injuring a QB after the ball has left?  Do we give a ref a second type of whistle, or an electronic tone that is set off to signal "balls out", making the QB at that moment untouchable?  Make linemen/rushers cease hostilities once that signal goes off?  Make fines/penalties harsher with those infractions.  Sit out 5 plays for the first offense, ejection for the second, plus 15 yards? 

Not suggesting we go to flag football, but are there some plays where we could implement a way to resolve the play without the actions ending in injury?   

[theaardvark]

As to life expectancy of players being in their 50's, are you including players that played with no helmets at all?  And players that played without concussion spotters, who were given some smelling salts and sent back in?

Rules have changes, equipment has changed, and players that play under these new rules and with this new equipment haven't reached their 50's yet, so I assume that number will continually rise.

Are pro football players expected to live to the full life expectancy of someone who never played a contact sport?  Of course not.  And neither do coal miners, or underwater welders, or any of a myriad of other professions a lot less well compensated for.

Let alone getting paid to play a game you love.

No one is forced to play football, and no one playing football does so without knowing the risks.

[DM83]

Don't put your head in the position to be the primary source of impact.
Revise helmets to increase back of the head contact absorbing padding.
Ban and eject players for a head to head initial point of contact hit.

My rugby pals say they don't lead with their head.
Current football revised tacking " safe tackle" techniques, does not emphasize the head as a weapon.

But let's face it, as a up and coming player from a destitute area of the USA, if a defensive player annihilates the offensive guy, and he's good at it and gets paid, for a few years, would you stop?  No!

Safe tackling though is not a big adjustment. Just do it.

[dd]

If the sport of football was serious about head injuries, there would be an automatic game ejection for head to head contact period. They have taken positive steps to eject those who launch and make head contact (targeting) but look at the hit by brown on Collaros a couple of weeks ago. If the league was serious about head injuries, crown should have been ejected , no questions asked, but still, cheap crap like this continues, with the players complaining afterwards he isn't a dirty player. Sorry bud, you are, and our rules still need changing to protect players from douches like yourself.

[Blue In BC]

The new NFL kick off rule is interesting. I don't like it but most NFL kick offs seem to end in touch backs anyway.

I see the logic in eliminating the high speed collisions to avoid injury but are there any stats to so show this would really work?

Returners get hurt often but so do cover guys. Obviously there are less kicking plays as a % of total plays. Players at every position get injured. Receivers and DB's are dropping in every game from violent full speed collisions.

Many injuries are somewhat self inflicted when players are diving for a ball or extra yardage. Lions receiver Hollins diving for the ball was nearly untouched for example. Should to turf at full speed.

Miami QB Tua T going for that extra yard was a freak injury aside from his concussion history. I wouldn't suggest that was a full speed hit compared to those on kick offs but certainly caused a serious problem.  A Guardian Cap wouldn't have helped in that particular instance.

[Jesse]

The new NFL kick off rule is interesting. I don't like it but most NFL kick offs seem to end in touch backs anyway.

I see the logic in eliminating the high speed collisions to avoid injury but are there any stats to so show this would really work?

Returners get hurt often but so do cover guys. Obviously there are less kicking plays as a % of total plays. Players at every position get injured. Receivers and DB's are dropping in every game from violent full speed collisions.

Many injuries are somewhat self inflicted when players are diving for a ball or extra yardage. Lions receiver Hollins diving for the ball was nearly untouched for example. Should to turf at full speed.

Miami QB Tua T going for that extra yard was a freak injury aside from his concussion history. I wouldn't suggest that was a full speed hit compared to those on kick offs but certainly caused a serious problem.  A Guardian Cap wouldn't have helped in that particular instance.

To your point about stats. there can't be any stats to show it works until they attempt it and then compare data to see if it had any affect. I assume there will be a fairly difference. Whether or not this is any better than simply removing the kick off from the game remains to be seen. I believe there will continue to be changes to it as kick-off in the NFL are pretty close to pointless right now.

As to your references to Hollins and Tua, that just comes off as whataboutism. They are 100% unrelated to return rules.

My dad broke his arm one winter slipping on ice as he went up the stairs to his house, so he started putting rock salt down. Should he stop because some other guy slipped on his stairs during the summer when there was no ice?

[Blue In BC]

To your point about stats. there can't be any stats to show it works until they attempt it and then compare data to see if it had any affect. I assume there will be a fairly difference. Whether or not this is any better than simply removing the kick off from the game remains to be seen. I believe there will continue to be changes to it as kick-off in the NFL are pretty close to pointless right now.

As to your references to Hollins and Tua, that just comes off as whataboutism. They are 100% unrelated to return rules.

My dad broke his arm one winter slipping on ice as he went up the stairs to his house, so he started putting rock salt down. Should he stop because some other guy slipped on his stairs during the summer when there was no ice?

My point is that we see more injuries at low speed than at high speed as on kick offs. Half the injuries that happen we don't even see happen because coverage is elsewhere.

A. Pickett was injured on the 1st few plays of the game today on a short play. He may have even been taken out by one of his teammates. Foot in a walking boot and on crutches afterwards.

I'm not suggesting to not do whatever possible to eliminate injuries. One of the broadcasters last night mentioned that it would be probable that every player on every team is nursing some sort of injury at this point.

[TecnoGenius]

My point is that we see more injuries at low speed than at high speed as on kick offs. Half the injuries that happen we don't even see happen because coverage is elsewhere.

A. Pickett was injured on the 1st few plays of the game today on a short play. He may have even been taken out by one of his teammates. Foot in a walking boot and on crutches afterwards.

Ya, from my memory most of the injuries this season are non-contacts, roll-intos, or jumping/diving.  Pickett was classic achilles.  The incidental/coincidental contact had nothing to do with it.

Yes, there are a few high-speed head-ons, but as a percentage of total injuries I think it's low(er).  Kenny's arm vs D helmet comes to mind as a classic head-on.

Very few injuries from kick plays, so I don't see why anyone would focus on it.

[Blue In BC]

I wonder if we see the CFL trend towards NFL / USFL rules for kick offs and punts. In those leagues there are so many touch backs or fair catches, it almost eliminates run backs from the game.

[TecnoGenius]

I wonder if we see the CFL trend towards NFL / USFL rules for kick offs and punts. In those leagues there are so many touch backs or fair catches, it almost eliminates run backs from the game.

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!  Besides switching to 4-down, it's the worst change you could possibly make.

[Blue In BC]

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!  Besides switching to 4-down, it's the worst change you could possibly make.

To be clear, I'm not suggesting or wanting that. I feel punt returns are a bigger problem to potential injury than kick offs, but have no data to support that idea.

In the NFL that's certainly the case when a returner doesn't call for a fair catch. There were a few returners that got smoke this weekend when they didn't call fair catch.

I wonder if there are any NFL stats on how many kick offs are returned and how many punts are actually returned?

[TecnoGenius]

Zach took a big hit vs EDM that put him on his butt and back and his head whipped back and whacked the turf.  He was doing the "seeing stars" thing.  I thought maybe he'd be pulled.  But we had literally no good option if Zach left, so he stayed.

I'm not a fan of the guardian cap idea, but I would 100% be for Zach having some sort of additional head-back protection.  Like something that has straps going around the front, and mega foam padding in the back.  That would mitigate any concussion problems from being thrust back, which is a very common hit for Zach.

Having a few inches of foam on the back shouldn't be very heavy, and it wouldn't impact visibility at all.  The front hits are so varied, and often in the mask/chin, so they are harder to deal with, so I'd start with the low hanging fruit of those head2turf hits.