The Good the Bad and the Ugly

[DM83]

What's going on with this thread. How come it's not up already?
Ok Calgary  beats the Bombers

The GOOD
We did nt lose in regulation time
Great comeback in the 4th
Receivers new ones all looked good once given someone to throw them the ball
Defensive guys all played very well. Competitive, few missed tackles
Punt returns , were the best they have been all year.

THE bad
Zach Collaros
Do you think he is scared?
Offensive line. Can't block anyone....no wonder some skill guys look scared
The team needs a guy for the jet sweep.who were the jet sweep guys? Even for one play, it makes the defense have to play defense in practice.

The ugly

Collaros reluctance to never throw to new guys.
The defensive coordinator.  If he were your coach would he inspire you? Hat and headphones pretty goofy looking.

[The Zipp]

Without Sergio and the special teams play we aren't even in the ball game.  They are the "great".

[The Zipp]

Winnipeg Blue Bombers head coach Mike O'Shea said QB Zach Collaros, who left tonight's loss in Calgary, will be fine and that his absence was "precautionary"

It's  good he isn't hurt worst - should he have stayed in the game ?

[Blueforlife]

Winnipeg Blue Bombers head coach Mike O'Shea said QB Zach Collaros, who left tonight's loss in Calgary, will be fine and that his absence was "precautionary"

It's  good he isn't hurt worst - should he have stayed in the game ?

He didn't stay in the game because he was hurt and the team of professionals made an educated decision based on his injury.  There is your answer.  You protect the most valuable asset to the club.

[TecnoGenius]

What's going on with this thread. How come it's not up already?

Hasn't been up yet this season.  Because it's all BAD & UGLY so far??      

Hard to have a good story with just Angel Eyes & Tuco.   

The GOOD
We did nt lose in regulation time

Post of the year right there!  Still ROTFLing.

The defensive coordinator.  If he were your coach would he inspire you? Hat and headphones pretty goofy looking.

Ya, those shots TSN did (and there were many) were not flattering.  He was starting to smack of Claybrooks in BC, with the "I'm not doing or saying anything, just standing here with a stunned look" motif.  However, joking aside, I'm sure it's just bad luck TSN caught him at those moments, after he already had the playcall in.

Younger (and shadowmaster Hall) get a break from my abuse this week: still stout against the run and clearly, slowly, solving the deep explosion problem (albeit against a low-explosion team).  They continue to out-perform their personnel: and that's a good thing.

[TecnoGenius]

Winnipeg Blue Bombers head coach Mike O'Shea said QB Zach Collaros, who left tonight's loss in Calgary, will be fine and that his absence was "precautionary"

It's  good he isn't hurt worst - should he have stayed in the game ?

No.  He's not feeling right and you have half the fanbase itching to take a look-see at Strev... you use the readymade excuse and pull Zach.  I doubt it would have turned out any differently with Zach in.

Maybe that very last pass we could have put him back in?  I dunno... Woulda coulda.

[gordo]

The Good
Sergio boots a 60 yarder for the record. With distance to spare. Guy is great.
Strev was clutch. His shot putt delivery really works.
Wally really stepped up. Loved his intensity with Strev.
Play calling got more creative with Strev.  Or he free-lanced alot.
Brady looks healthy.
Willy showed up with a couple bat downs.
Some new guys caught balls.  And looked good. Some nice YAK too.
We seem to have a kick returner. Very nice.
Game was entertaining. For me at least.
Lots of season left. Time heals all wounds (and Bombers). They will be in it at the end.

The Bad & Ugly
Zach injury.  Hate to see it. Hope it's not serious.
I'll leave the rest out. I'm still optimistic.

[gordo]

Maybe that very last pass we could have put him back in?  I dunno... Woulda coulda.

To get sacked? 

Actually then we could have kicked the FG and still been in it.

[TecnoGenius]

To get sacked? 

Actually then we could have kicked the FG and still been in it.

Haha, touche!  The only sin in OT is TO... Strevie should have eaten it.

Castillo winning it for us (with a little help from our D) would have been a fitting end to the game!

[Stats Junkie]

Not sure if this is good or bad

Farhan Lalji
@FarhanLaljiTSN - 1h
Hearing Lucky Whitehead is nearing a return to #CFL. Expecting him to sign with a western team shortly. ⁦
@CFLonTSN

Farhan Lalji
@FarhanLaljiTSN - 48m
Sounds like @Luck2fastt will be back with his original team. #Bombers A few details still to iron out.

[ichabod_crane]

That pick on OT I Could see coming a MILE AWAY live at the ballpark. CAlgary came with a blitz and Strevie panicked a bit and toss a lame duck up. Should have just rifled it to the ground or taken the sack. YOU NEVER give up the 3 in OT for anything unless maybe at the 1 yard line and 3rd down. Brain Farts just like Edmonton is doing constantly....are they in the running for the trutle derby award this season? Two homes games coming up....better get off the schneid lads or Peggers will get ornery!

[TecnoGenius]

Not sure if this is good or bad

Farhan Lalji
@FarhanLaljiTSN - 48m
Sounds like @Luck2fastt will be back with his original team. #Bombers A few details still to iron out.

This is good.  Very good!  I called it a few week ago.  Lucky may be one of the best yet still-affordable players couch-sitting.

And Lucky is a great fit for Zach who, if on point, can feather it into his bucket rather than his hands.  Lucky still can't catch with hands, and that's why he's unemployed.  So give him all bucket and gut passes.  I think we can do that.  It will also help with the sweeps and even the odd return (a two-returner look would work!).

And Lucky has always kept WPG in his heart, with his return visits to WPG and sitting with the rowdies in the Crazy Zone(TM).

Finally KW/MOS decides vets are required, 2 weeks later than the forum.  Clearly "status quo / next man up" ain't working.

I hope Lucky doesn't gouge us too badly!  He knows we're over a barrel...

[TecnoGenius]

UGLY

Holm looked like he did something to his ankle.  People noting he was toughing it out later.  Didn't seem too bad, though.  It would be brutal if he was put on IR.

[Jesse]

The Good:
- Brady looks healthy; needs some help from Buck to get him rolling.
- Collaros' injury seems to be precautionary
- The Sheahan run for a first down
- A passing TD
- Ford's first interception
- The D as a whole had their best performance
- Finally heard Willie's name
- Special teams was special (Shout out to Sergio, a couple Smith returns, and Ayers on coverage)

The Bad:
- Receivers dropping passes all over the place
- Strev throwing at everyone's ankles
- Brady with a 2.6 yard average
- OL seemed more porous than last week

The Ugly:
- No way to sugarcoat 0-4
- MOS saying all week that we call what the game sheet dictates (not going to force the run), proceeds to force the run into a run defence all game without any misdirection
- The roster/depth chart: This goes to previous years, but there has been an absolute exodus of our depth. We have no one ready to step up behind our veterans. We've wasted roster spots on 36 year old global punters and american FBs. We've relied on the Jeff's to play 95% of snaps and now Jeffcoat is gone and the one guy we brought in over the past 2 years is injured and there's no one left. The only receivers in the building have been here for a few weeks. These are catastrophic errors.

[Pete]

The good
Db's getting better, Bonds looks solid, and Ford showing strong potential
Alexander was at least visible in some deep throws(ok still not really good, he needs replaced)
Lbs stopped the run.
Punt and kickoff coverage best ive see in two years
Smith is a legitimate returner.
The bad
Dl pressure was nonexistent. Jefferson had 2 knockdowns but not close to putting pressure otherwise (teams no longer double team him) Fayid was invisible
Ugly
As mentioned Zacs focussing in on only demski and woli. Hes not reading defenses . Starting to worry that hes following bolevi's path

[dd]

Hasn't been up yet this season.  Because it's all BAD & UGLY so far??      

No doubt!!

[markf]

A question... Is our only run play up the middle? That's what it looks like to me. Seems very predictable.

And....What chance have new receivers had?

Not much...

Maybe a bit more patience with young receivers needs to be shown.

Other positions are not dealt with this way.... Example...Brady was not great at first, but was given time.

Zach..... was thought to be finished when he first got here. Maybe he can bounce back.

Problem is this o line is not as good. He does not seem to thrive under pressure.

My hunch is he will not bounce back.

Was the hit took him out a spear? Should that have been a penalty?

I don't think Lucky will add much.

[Blue In BC]

I mentioned before the game that our 1st offensive play would be a run straight up the gut. If I knew that, don't we think the Stamps had that idea as well?

We're overly predictable. Just like knowing that before Collaros was out of the game, there was no expectation for Streveler to throw a pass.

[Pigskin]

Not sure Lucky is our #1 need at this time. I would like to see us bring in a DE that can get to the QB and take some pressure off of Willy.

OL: Lofton and Dobson. The Bombers have only given up 2 sacks in the last two games, but ZC8 is under pressure all night. Is it Lofton, Dobson, or both.

[Blue In BC]

Not sure Lucky is our #1 need at this time. I would like to see us bring in a DE that can get to the QB and take some pressure off of Willy.

OL: Lofton and Dobson. The Bombers have only given up 2 sacks in the last two games, but ZC8 is under pressure all night. Is it Lofton, Dobson, or both.

I'm not sure but Collaros is taking too long to make a pass. IMO that's more on Buck and his play calling. Saw the same thing when Streveler was in at QB. 2nd and 4 and we throw a deep pass to the back or near back of the end zone.

We only made 11 pass attempts to Johnson, O. Wilson and Clercius in total with 6 receptions. OTOH, Demski had 10 thrown his way. One near int and one int to close the game.

How many of Oliveria's runs were A gap?

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

I'm not sure but Collaros is taking too long to make a pass. IMO that's more on Buck and his play calling. Saw the same thing when Streveler was in at QB. 2nd and 4 and we throw a deep pass to the back or near back of the end zone.

We only made 11 pass attempts to Johnson, O. Wilson and Clercius in total with 6 receptions. OTOH, Demski had 10 thrown his way. One near int and one int to close the game.

How many of Oliveria's runs were A gap?

Zach trying to prove he can play 3 receivers short, he doesn't even glance in the direction of any of the new receivers.  Ideally the QB is a vessel for distributing the football wherever it needs to go, Zach has significant blind spots and maybe not enough confidence to overcome them.  He lost 8 or 10 games in a row before he lost the Ti-Cat job, wonder if he's in the same funky space now he was in then.

[Blue In BC]

Zach trying to prove he can play 3 receivers short, he doesn't even glance in the direction of any of the new receivers.  Ideally the QB is a vessel for distributing the football wherever it needs to go, Zach has significant blind spots and maybe not enough confidence to overcome them.  He lost 8 or 10 games in a row before he lost the Ti-Cat job, wonder if he's in the same funky space now he was in then.

We don't know what the play calling is dictating. Are the rookies running the correct routes in the time our QB's have to decide whether to throw?

[Pete]

I don't know if its the play call whenever we get near the endzone, but calling a deep pass to the right corner is the most predictable play we do. Considering you have to throw the ball 20 extra yards makes no sense as a go to play.
Like I say I don't know what the other options to that play are, but crossing plays with a "pick" would be more effective likely.

[TecnoGenius]

The Good:
- A passing TD

It's a miracle!!  One passing TD by the Bombers since before the 2023 GC!  Woot!  Zach is back baby!  Oh... wait... who threw it again?  Drat.  I'll see myself out.

(Even the worst QBs on the worst CFL teams throw a TD nearly every game...)

[TecnoGenius]

OL: Lofton and Dobson. The Bombers have only given up 2 sacks in the last two games, but ZC8 is under pressure all night. Is it Lofton, Dobson, or both.

I'm eyeing Ko-man more and more.  And they are still getting fooled by the stunts.  And now everyone just running around Lofton... Dobson has actually been decent compared to Gray.

I'll be rewatching the CGY game with an eye on the OL again soon.  Then I'll give you specifics.  Oh ya, 5 IP calls don't help either.  Never seen anything so ridiculous.

[DM83]

What is an IP call?

[theaardvark]

Saw the photo of the "no end" call play, they had 6 on the oline, and one wide out.  Definitely not a "no end" call.  Eye in the sky should have caught that.

[LXTSN]

What is an IP call?

Illegal procedure I'd assume

[dd]

I think what happened is Wallace didn't report to the ref and umpire that he was reporting in as an eligible receiver when he came on the field. He was #61 and that's an ineligible number by rule so he has to check in declaring he is an eligible receiver and the umpire lets the defense know this. This didn't happen, bombers don't have an eligible player on Wallace's end and boom there's the call. It's a ticky tack call but players in youth league do this so why a professional football player doesn't do this is beyond me. You could tell by the stunned look on Wallace's face that he didn't know he had to report. Unbelievablely poor coaching, you always make sure the guy knows he has to report I hear it from the benches all the timed when they re sending a guy in, the bombers can't do?this?!?!

[LXTSN]

Saw the photo of the "no end" call play, they had 6 on the oline, and one wide out.  Definitely not a "no end" call.  Eye in the sky should have caught that.

I believe Wallace would have to report as eligible. I would assume not reporting was a rookie mistake that won't happen again after negating that first down!

[LXTSN]

I do think right now our biggest offensive struggle is play-calling.
We seem to have zero motion or creativity so far this season.

[markf]

"You could tell by the stunned look on Wallace's face that he didn't know he had to report. Unbelievablely poor coaching, you always make sure the guy knows he has to report I hear it from the benches all the timed when they re sending a guy in, the bombers can't do?this?!?!"

More likely he was told about reporting, and forgot.

Stunned look.... Maybe regretting the mistake?

[dd]

"You could tell by the stunned look on Wallace's face that he didn't know he had to report. Unbelievablely poor coaching, you always make sure the guy knows he has to report I hear it from the benches all the timed when they re sending a guy in, the bombers can't do?this?!?!"

More likely he was told about reporting, and forgot.

Stunned look.... Maybe regretting the mistake?

No doubt he did. Generally the jumbo tight ends are depth players and are all excited to get the chance to play and come in all amped up, I've seen it a hundred times, in fact when I see an ineglible player who forgot to report lined up as an end, I ask him if he's to report as eligible and he'd say oh ya, then I'd yell out '#61 has reported as eligible' to prevent the chintzy foul', obviously the pro refs don't do this, but should ...I just thought being a pro player he d be over that, but obviously not. Welcome to the CFL Mr Wallace!!

[theaardvark]

I do think right now our biggest offensive struggle is play-calling.
We seem to have zero motion or creativity so far this season.

Most "fancy" plays require time for them to develop.

Flea flickers, jet sweeps take time. Double reverse would get us pinned 10 yards deeper. 

The "send Demski int the pile" is a play I think is designed to take advantage of DL coming upfield in a hurry...

[TecnoGenius]

Saw the photo of the "no end" call play, they had 6 on the oline, and one wide out.  Definitely not a "no end" call.  Eye in the sky should have caught that.

Ya, and the long delay in calling it means the refs were discussing on the field and command were discussing it to ensure he didn't report... to avoid the WPG@CGY NE debacle from a few years ago.

So here's a question: why don't we task a water boy (or two) on our sidelines or up in the booth with Buck with some binoculars to watch every single "lining up" stage to ensure the both ends check in.  It's easy to see as the ends are supposed to point to the ref/line.  If they fail to do that the water boy can have it called down to Zach's helmet some new codeword and he can not do his "start motion" signal, but instead call out/signal to the ends to report, or someone can take a TO.

Sure, this happens maybe once a season for us, but it is avoidable if you task some minimum wage guys with the job.  What's it worth?  Well, in this case it's worth 1st down at a critical juncture.  Players are going to have brain-toots sometimes.

And yes: IP = Illegal Procedure.  I'm not typing out 17 letters for that penalty every time!

[dd]

The end only has to report once per series and only has to report if he has an ineligible number. So if I'm a player with a number between 50-79, I need to report. You don't need anyone checking on this, the bonehead coming into the game has to go to the umpire and tell him he's reporting. It's not that hard and that fact a pro football player 'forgot' to report tells me where his heads at. To make it really simple for the simple rotation players who can't figure this mystery out just give him an eligible number like they do with fullbacks . For Pete's  sake, and we have to think why we can't win football games. It's like Johnson the receiver waggling down the line of scrimmage offside. Let's try playing the game to win instead of being bumbling twits!!

[TecnoGenius]

The end only has to report once per series and only has to report if he has an ineligible number.

I'm not sure this is true.  Remember the previous WPG@CGY no-end fiasco where we were robbed of a much-needed win around 5 years ago where the CFL had to apologize and a ref was fired?  (I'm still livid about it: no forgiveness, no mercy!)

Ya, that was a WR wide out (Darvin?) who did check in (caught on film) and they said he didn't check in.  He didn't have an ineligible number.  And he had to check in.  In fact, you can see wide out WRs doing the "check in" hand signal almost every play.  They wouldn't do it if it wasn't required.

Maybe I'm confusing two different things though... checking in to mean "I'm on the line as an end, right?" vs "I'm telling you I'm eligible even though I'm a hoggie".  You guys can tell me if there's a difference.

But the penalty wasn't "ineligible player" (or something to that effect), it was "IP no end".  In fact, wouldn't any "ineligible player" penalty only be called if the ball was thrown to him?

I also have never heard the "only once per series" thing.  Maybe others can clarify.

As for "players should know this", ya sure, but I bet the league as a whole sees 8-15 "no end" penalties per season: about one every 2 weeks, which I'm pretty sure of because I always have a big huge laugh at the incompetent team screwing up!  I know WPG sees around 1 a season by itself, and we're pretty disciplined.  So I still stand by my idea of putting a water boy on the task, as what do you have to lose?

[dd]

There is a difference. The ends should always check with the linesman if they are on the LOS, that is NOT checking in. Checking in is reporting to the Umpire that you checking in as an eligible reciever so he can then turn and inform the defense of this. 2 totally different things. totally.

A reciever not checking if he's on the line, is a poor practice/lazy. Believe me, the linesmen want to work with the recievers to make sure you're on the LOS, but they aren't going to beg you to check with them. don't check and you're off, that's on you not the linesman. And the Darvin Adams blunder was more on Adams than the linesman. I recall the play, the waved his hand at the linesman but wasn't watching or listening to the linesman, and he wasn't on the line, boom, no end call, aint the linesman's fault it was Adams's fault all the way, as there is no linesman who will tell you you're on the line and then hit you with a flag because you weren't. just doesn't happen.

[LXTSN]

Most "fancy" plays require time for them to develop.

Flea flickers, jet sweeps take time. Double reverse would get us pinned 10 yards deeper. 

The "send Demski int the pile" is a play I think is designed to take advantage of DL coming upfield in a hurry...

They've had enough time to work through plays at this point in the season. I'm not suggesting trick plays necessarily.

There's a ton of ways you can mix it up. Play-action, motion through the backfield, screens.... It doesn't have to be that complicated but they should have more in their bag than just run up the middle or drop back to pass. We need some quick-hitter plays to keep the defence spread out. We're making it too easy on them right now.

[blue_gold_84]

They've had enough time to work through plays at this point in the season. I'm not suggesting trick plays necessarily.

There's a ton of ways you can mix it up. Play-action, motion through the backfield, screens.... It doesn't have to be that complicated but they should have more in their bag than just run up the middle or drop back to pass. We need some quick-hitter plays to keep the defence spread out. We're making it too easy on them right now.

Does Pierce even know what that is?

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

They've had enough time to work through plays at this point in the season. I'm not suggesting trick plays necessarily.

There's a ton of ways you can mix it up. Play-action, motion through the backfield, screens.... It doesn't have to be that complicated but they should have more in their bag than just run up the middle or drop back to pass. We need some quick-hitter plays to keep the defence spread out. We're making it too easy on them right now.

Both Bailey and Grant gone, that's two players that knew the depth of the playbook in regard to jet-sweeps and other running plays that could extend their knowledge over multiple years without having to start from scratch which saves time.  With rookie replacements Buck has to pare it back to the basics or start using Woli on jet-sweeps which would be a contradiction.  Maybe Lucky can take over jet-sweeps.

[DM83]

The change in personnel every week would hamper deception type plays.
Collaros missing throws is mostly on Collaros. However, that's couple big plays that were missed. He certainly has made a. Umber of throws that the lousy receivers McManus has sent to the team really are not worth keeping. I mean face it, when we as a viewer, hope the guy catches it, it's seems more like amateur football.

I am sure the coaches  are hoping guys don't screw up on alignment and procedure penalties.  If you are goin with the idea the guys are amped up, and nervous, ...that seems pretty naive.  These guys have played in big high school and university programs. In reality, if a player is jumping offsides, they should not play anywhere.  Once, well, that's your one oooops, more than that, the stage is too big for the poor guy. 

Not reporting is severe.  I mean if you have to report you go straight to the ref. Face to face get his acknowledgement, and then the huddle.

[dd]

The change in personnel every week would hamper deception type plays.
Collaros missing throws is mostly on Collaros. However, that's couple big plays that were missed. He certainly has made a. Umber of throws that the lousy receivers McManus has sent to the team really are not worth keeping. I mean face it, when we as a viewer, hope the guy catches it, it's seems more like amateur football.

I am sure the coaches  are hoping guys don't screw up on alignment and procedure penalties.  If you are goin with the idea the guys are amped up, and nervous, ...that seems pretty naive.  These guys have played in big high school and university programs. In reality, if a player is jumping offsides, they should not play anywhere.  Once, well, that's your one oooops, more than that, the stage is too big for the poor guy. 

Not reporting is severe.  I mean if you have to report you go straight to the ref. Face to face get his acknowledgement, and then the huddle.

The player not reporting blows me away. You do this in high school, let alone university football, and this guy comes in in a pro game and pulls the bonehead move, really, where do we get these guys from, mars??!!

[LXTSN]

The player not reporting blows me away. You do this in high school, let alone university football, and this guy comes in in a pro game and pulls the bonehead move, really, where do we get these guys from, mars??!!

It's a rookie mistake, but sometimes that's the best way to learn.

[theaardvark]

The player not reporting blows me away. You do this in high school, let alone university football, and this guy comes in in a pro game and pulls the bonehead move, really, where do we get these guys from, mars??!!

Not giving him an excuse, but c'mon man.  He's a raw rookie, and there are a hundred things he has going through his mind as he comes in.  He hasn't built that "muscle memory" that comes with time that you go through a bunch of actions pre-snap, post snap, etc...

And yes, its a mistake, but also a learning experience, and one that will be hard to forget.

[dd]

Not giving him an excuse, but c'mon man.  He's a raw rookie, and there are a hundred things he has going through his mind as he comes in.  He hasn't built that "muscle memory" that comes with time that you go through a bunch of actions pre-snap, post snap, etc...

And yes, its a mistake, but also a learning experience, and one that will be hard to forget.

KIDS playing peewee football know they have to report, but oh poor mr Wallace, full grown man, played university ball and he doesn't know this. Sorry, if your football IQ is less than that of a 12 year old, maybe you shouldn't be playing pro sports, it's beyomd your mental capabilities.

[theaardvark]

KIDS playing peewee football know they have to report, but oh poor mr Wallace, full grown man, played university ball and he doesn't know this. Sorry, if your football IQ is less than that of a 12 year old, maybe you shouldn't be playing pro sports, it's beyomd your mental capabilities.

Again, not giving excuses, but playing at the ;pro level is different, and there are a lot more things to remember.  Not saying he shouldn't have known to report, just saying I understand how someone could forget something, or even think that they already had reported in... 

There is a term:  "Rookie mistake".  "Rookie mistakes" are always committed by rookies who have played the sport most of their lives.  No one is immune to a brain fart occasionally.