Our Defense in 2024 - w/ Jordan Younger

[Sir Blue and Gold]

One thing I haven't seen talked about very much is the scheme of our defense in 2024. With Richie Hall out (I know he's still going to consult) and Jordan Younger taking over, there is the potential for changes whether they be tweaks or more significant.

There is no doubt that Hall's scheme was studied to death in the off-season the last few years by all teams. He always adapted, but having someone new calling plays and running the unit will invariably bring new ideas and approaches.

Hall was pretty staunch in his man only deep schemes as a base. At it's core it's a cover 5 which became man coverage for vertical routes. It usually worked well but teams had success attacking short at times. All of Hall's bad games (of which they're weren't many, but when they happened were pretty ugly) tended to break that way. It also requires someone to win along the defensive line regularly to be truly dominate. I am not sure we can realistically expect that this year.

Younger has worked with Hall since 2018 in Winnipeg and, I assume, will call a similar game. However assumptions aren't always right and if we wanted to go with Hall's scheme again wouldn't we have just retained him?

I'm interested to see how things will shake out on that side of the ball. New corners. Some changes along the defensive line. We are going to be asking a lot of Willie and Thomas (at least at the beginning of the year).

I always love watching defense but I think we'll see some different things. How are we feeling?

[theaardvark]

One thing I haven't seen talked about very much is the scheme of our defense in 2024. With Richie Hall out (I know he's still going to consult) and Jordan Younger taking over, there is the potential for changes whether they be tweaks or more significant.

There is no doubt that Hall's scheme was studied to death in the off-season the last few years by all teams. He always adapted, but having someone new calling plays and running the unit will invariably bring new ideas and approaches.

Hall was pretty staunch in his man only deep schemes as a base. At it's core it's a cover 5 which became man coverage for vertical routes. It usually worked well but teams had success attacking short at times. All of Hall's bad games (of which they're weren't many, but when they happened were pretty ugly) tended to break that way. It also requires someone to win along the defensive line regularly to be truly dominate. I am not sure we can realistically expect that this year.

Younger has worked with Hall since 2018 in Winnipeg and, I assume, will call a similar game. However assumptions aren't always right and if we wanted to go with Hall's scheme again wouldn't we have just retained him?

I'm interested to see how things will shake out on that side of the ball. New corners. Some changes along the defensive line. We are going to be asking a lot of Willie and Thomas (at least at the beginning of the year).

I always love watching defense but I think we'll see some different things. How are we feeling?

Not sure "retaining him" was in the cards.

Two reasons.

!: He's been talking retirement for a while.

2:  If we hadn't promoted Younger, he would have been scooped up by another team as a DC.

So, how much is this a change in titles only, and how much of it is actually handing over the baton?  Hall, as "consultant" may be intimately involved in the D schemes and calls, or he may be the emeritus overseer, ensuring the new DC is comfortable in his post.

[The Zipp]

Defence is going to be challenge for this team - i hope the absence of legit starting talent doesn't take the shine off of Younger.  He has his work cut out for him, this might be the weakest looking defence in the past 5 years.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

One thing I haven't seen talked about very much is the scheme of our defense in 2024. With Richie Hall out (I know he's still going to consult) and Jordan Younger taking over, there is the potential for changes whether they be tweaks or more significant.

There is no doubt that Hall's scheme was studied to death in the off-season the last few years by all teams. He always adapted, but having someone new calling plays and running the unit will invariably bring new ideas and approaches.

Hall was pretty staunch in his man only deep schemes as a base. At it's core it's a cover 5 which became man coverage for vertical routes. It usually worked well but teams had success attacking short at times. All of Hall's bad games (of which they're weren't many, but when they happened were pretty ugly) tended to break that way. It also requires someone to win along the defensive line regularly to be truly dominate. I am not sure we can realistically expect that this year.

Younger has worked with Hall since 2018 in Winnipeg and, I assume, will call a similar game. However assumptions aren't always right and if we wanted to go with Hall's scheme again wouldn't we have just retained him?

I'm interested to see how things will shake out on that side of the ball. New corners. Some changes along the defensive line. We are going to be asking a lot of Willie and Thomas (at least at the beginning of the year).

I always love watching defense but I think we'll see some different things. How are we feeling?

I don't think we'll notice much change in game plan, Younger will be using the playbook Hall passed onto him.

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Not sure "retaining him" was in the cards.

Two reasons.

!: He's been talking retirement for a while.

2:  If we hadn't promoted Younger, he would have been scooped up by another team as a DC.

So, how much is this a change in titles only, and how much of it is actually handing over the baton?  Hall, as "consultant" may be intimately involved in the D schemes and calls, or he may be the emeritus overseer, ensuring the new DC is comfortable in his post.

I think your second reason is correct. I think Hall would have stayed on if we had asked him.

"JY has obviously been on this trajectory for quite some time," O'Shea, the Bombers head coach, said during a Zoom call from the CFL meetings in Nashville, Tenn. "You just know there's going to come a time where if you don't make a move, you're going to lose him and I didn't want to get to that point.

"I'd had this conversation with Richie also over the course of time ... you're talking about two guys I have long-standing relationships with and value a lot. To be able to have both on our staff was certainly what the aim was but you can't really guarantee that. I'm just so excited Richie agree to stay on."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/bombers-younger-miller-coordinator-1.7077716

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Defence is going to be challenge for this team - i hope the absence of legit starting talent doesn't take the shine off of Younger.  He has his work cut out for him, this might be the weakest looking defence in the past 5 years.

I am not worried about the collective talent level but there are a fair number of questions:

1. How much does Bighill have left in the tank? Can we reasonably rely on him for 20+ games this year?

2. Who makes plays opposite Jefferson? If it's no one, how much success can you reasonable expect Jefferson to have?

3. Is Younger going to keep the SLB position simple for Kramdi or will he go back to a more common approach? If he does, can Kramdi do it or is that where the 'all Canadian interior defensive line' option comes into play?

4. In general, can we get enough out of our older players and can our less experienced players make the jump quickly?

[Sir Blue and Gold]

I don't think we'll notice much change in game plan, Younger will be using the playbook Hall passed onto him.

I'm sure he'll be influenced by the concepts but it's pretty unreasonable to think he's just going to go out and give his best Richie Hall impression, no?

[ModAdmin]

Jordan will take the areas he learned, and picked up, and believes will work from Richie, and he will implement his own ideas as well. Assuming JY will be the defensive person in charge, the relationship will work efficiently and well.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

I'm sure he'll be influenced by the concepts but it's pretty unreasonable to think he's just going to go out and give his best Richie Hall impression, no?

It will be interesting to see if player preferences stay the same, who chooses if Kramdi and Jake start, does Ford get the opportunity to play corner or does he start over again from the back of the bus?

[Sir Blue and Gold]

It will be interesting to see if player preferences stay the same, who chooses if Kramdi and Jake start, does Ford get the opportunity to play corner or does he start over again from the back of the bus?

I imagine Younger would have final say with input from the rest of the staff.

Player preferences probably will change especially if scheme or position responsibilities change too.

[TecnoGenius]

Two reasons.

!: He's been talking retirement for a while.

2:  If we hadn't promoted Younger, he would have been scooped up by another team as a DC.

3: To re-sign KW and Buck with pay bumps we had to come up with more coach-SMS$$ and the only way to do that was dump Hall & Boudreau for the cheaper (mainly because of seniority) Younger/Miller.

It's probably "all of the above".

[TecnoGenius]

I always love watching defense but I think we'll see some different things. How are we feeling?

I too am a D guy.  I have way more fun watching our D dominate than our O.  The pinnacle was the 2019 GC.

I'm feeling optimistic (my usual) about Younger.  I would have stuck with Hall as long as we could, but maybe "as long as we could" was now.  But so much is unknown...

I have little doubt Younger was already responsible for a ton of our D under Hall.  He probably had a lot of input even on play calling and strategy.  He certainly had a ton of input on the field level and in practice.  It should be an easy transition for the players.

You could argue the buck stops with Hall for (our D) losing the '22 and (especially) '23 GC.  There is no reason we couldn't have stopped that last, hail Mary, MTL drive.  Letting both Kelly and Cody run double-digit yards on their winning drives is not easy to excuse.  A lot of this is on Hall, for not setting up the scheme to win.  And Hall may have been losing the D locker room as a result -- if the players stop trusting the system.

Putting a fresh face in there without the losing baggage may help propel us to victory, finally, this year.  From a morale standpoint it could be critical.

As for what Younger will do: he's done a couple of pressers I've seen/read where he gives some insight and it sounds like he's a "simplifier".  He talks about there being only so many schemes / options / choices for a D play call.  He strikes me as much more of a straight-forward play caller instead of the master-obfuscator that Hall was ("Smoke and Mirrors").

Hall would often try to confuse you with what he's showing, and put pieces in really weird places to try to get the picks and force the mistakes.  It was his main emphasis.  Hall was never that good at looking at the specific opponent and coming up with the best calls to counter the play this down.  He was more a big picture, whole-game/scheme guy.

I think Younger will be more traditional and also be more of a counter-play caller.  He'll try to guess the next play and specifically tailor the scheme to that.  Which means we could get a lot more INTs and spectacular sacks.  But it also means we could get blown up by a lot more explosions.  It could be back to 2014-Bombers style of D, which was basically exactly that.  Remember how we slowly grew into "must stop the explosions"?  But it also grew us into the "less big turnovers" team...

All I want to see is a playcaller who can anticipate everything Calvillo/Maas did to hose us on that last drive and turn all of those plays into INTs.

Oh ya, and for the love of all that is holy, blow up those poopin' MTL hitch screens!  Behind the LoS preferably...

[ichabod_crane]

Is Kongbo a free agent still? Recall he was a major stud in 2019 GC win and a very good rotational DE in 2019 & 2021, but maybe he wants too much coin after his limited NFL career.

[Blueforlife]

Defence is going to be challenge for this team - i hope the absence of legit starting talent doesn't take the shine off of Younger.  He has his work cut out for him, this might be the weakest looking defence in the past 5 years.

Way to early to state any of that with a high degree of confidence.

1. Coaches / defense system will be similar
2. Younger will likely have some struggles but will also bring some new flavor to the group which could season nicely
3. Yes we have lost some stud vets but let's see who is starting before we pass too much judgment
4. We have good scouting and we always get some fresh faces that shine
5. Some of our talent on D might step up and have been waiting for this opportunity

I generally agree somewhat with your statements but believe you are being a wee bit negative.  I could see some of what you are worried about playing out early season but I expect great things from this defense as Hall and company have a legacy of consistency likely that won't be matched for decades.

Won't be #1 d but we will be solid.

I am not worried about the collective talent level but there are a fair number of questions:

1. How much does Bighill have left in the tank? Can we reasonably rely on him for 20+ games this year?

2. Who makes plays opposite Jefferson? If it's no one, how much success can you reasonable expect Jefferson to have?

3. Is Younger going to keep the SLB position simple for Kramdi or will he go back to a more common approach? If he does, can Kramdi do it or is that where the 'all Canadian interior defensive line' option comes into play?

4. In general, can we get enough out of our older players and can our less experienced players make the jump quickly?

1. Biggie likely show some signs of slowing down but will be overall pretty good
2. Will rotate and we will find someone to make plays.  It will impact Jefferson's stats a bit but we will adjust and find a way.  Will take half a season to figure this out.  Not worried about this.
3. I expect a little trial and error.  I like the idea of all cdn interior.  I also like Kramdi and think he can progress.  That said if a stud LB appears or develops we have flexibility.  Wait and see.
4.Solid crew of vets will be good.  They will help season the young players.  By labour day our new blood will be hungry and ready to take more reps and give the old guys a break.  Team culture will continue to develop and be the key.

[Blue In BC]

Is Kongbo a free agent still? Recall he was a major stud in 2019 GC win and a very good rotational DE in 2019 & 2021, but maybe he wants too much coin after his limited NFL career.

He was never a stud player. If he was some team would have signed him by now.