Blue Bombers add defensive end to roster & Jeffcoat retiring

Started by ModAdmin, February 09, 2024, 03:14:31 PM

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ModAdmin

Blue Bombers add defensive end to roster

WINNIPEG, MB., February 9, 2024 - The Winnipeg Blue Bombers today announce the club has signed American defensive end John Waggoner.

Waggoner (6-5, 267; Iowa; born: October 27, 1999, in Des Moines, IA) played four seasons at Iowa (2019-22), recording 65 tackles (31 solo, 34 assists), 11.5 tackles for loss, 4.5 sacks, one forced fumble, and three pass breakups in 41 games.

In his senior season, Waggoner made 34 tackles (16 solo, 18 assists), 6.5 tackles for loss, 1.5 sacks, and one forced fumble in 13 games. He was a four-time Academic All-Big Ten.
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

Pigskin

I like this signing. Glad to see we are bring in some good sized DL.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

bwiser

This could be the replacement for Jeffcoat who appears headed for free agency and would command a big salary that the Bombers may not have cap room for.

kkc60

Quote from: bwiser on February 09, 2024, 06:07:05 PMThis could be the replacement for Jeffcoat who appears headed for free agency and would command a big salary that the Bombers may not have cap room for.
ehhh i wouldn't go that far. we have a few DEs coming in next year. 4.5 sacks in his college career isn't promising, seems like more of a run defender with that size. could be an interesting guy to try inside and outside though.

Pete

Hes got good size but considerably slower than Jeffcoat (40 time 5.02) In the cfl the top ends are considerably faster. (Jeffcoat was 4.66 but could have slowed down with age)

Jesse

Quote from: Pete on February 09, 2024, 06:31:03 PMHes got good size but considerably slower than Jeffcoat (40 time 5.02) In the cfl the top ends are considerably faster. (Jeffcoat was 4.66 but could have slowed down with age)

I'm certainly not paying any attention to random combine times from x amount of years ago.
My wife is amazing!

kkc60

Quote from: Jesse on February 09, 2024, 06:50:02 PMI'm certainly not paying any attention to random combine times from x amount of years ago.
that's like two years ago and without a doubt the best indicator of his speed. At over 260lbs, it's a pretty realistic numbet

Jesse

Quote from: kkc60 on February 09, 2024, 07:38:39 PMthat's like two years ago and without a doubt the best indicator of his speed. At over 260lbs, it's a pretty realistic numbet

Ok, but in using it to compare to Jefferson (who's combines would have been many more years ago) and then you get into how relevant a 40 yard sprint is to DL effectiveness...

It's just not something that I personally pay much attention to.
My wife is amazing!

blue_gold_84

More competition for TC if Jeffcoat moves on.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

kkc60

Quote from: Jesse on February 09, 2024, 07:44:05 PMOk, but in using it to compare to Jefferson (who's combines would have been many more years ago) and then you get into how relevant a 40 yard sprint is to DL effectiveness...

It's just not something that I personally pay much attention to.
not too sure where you're getting at in regards to Jefferson. He ran a 4.73 at his combine, with the DE average being around 4.80. It's certainly not the most relevant metric to use for a lineman, but it certainly can reflect a players attributes.

theaardvark

Well, Jeffcoat is off the table, he has retired.

Not mad, but 'at peace': Bombers' Jeffcoat calls it a career

Paul Friesen

One year ago, after re-signing with the only CFL team he's ever known, Jackson Jeffcoat did some foreshadowing – although he didn't know it at the time.

"In negotiations, it doesn't always go the way you want," the Winnipeg Blue Bombers defensive end said that day. "If there comes a time when I don't feel like the respect is mutual, then we might go our separate ways."
Fast-forward a year, and that time has come.

After hearing almost nothing from the Bombers this off-season, Jeffcoat on Friday told me he's retiring from football, at age 33.

The range of emotions evident through our 20-minute conversation included surprise, disappointment, feeling disrespected, resignation and, finally, a sense of contentment and peace.
"I'm not mad," he said. "Because I have opportunities that don't involve beating my body up and getting paid for cheap, for lack of a better term. I'm pretty at peace."

It took him a while to get there, though, including one very dark day when he first realized that after 10 years as a pro and six seasons with the Bombers, it was over.

"Yesterday I was really in shock," is how he put it. "I didn't know what to do. I didn't know how to move. I just wanted to sleep. I couldn't. I just tried to process it all."
It all began with silence from the Bombers.

No doubt they had bigger potential free-agent fish to fry this off-season, but Jeffcoat would have at least liked to hear something.

"I don't think it was handled right," he said. "I understand it's business, nothing personal. But in business there's communication. And there wasn't any communication, really."
Jeffcoat's agent finally heard from the Bombers just before he was about to go on a vacation to Thailand, a trip he just got back from.

By then, the free-agent negotiating window was so close, his agent told the Bombers he'd explore his options this week.

Three teams were interested. At least, for a time.

"It was a pay cut," Jeffcoat said. "But I was willing to look at the offers. One said they would compete with anybody... and then they just started dropping off."
Back in November, in his final interview at season's end, Jeffcoat had said retirement was on the table. But he'd since made the decision to keep playing.

Now, he had to reconsider.

"OK, that's a sign," he said. "When things like this seem weird and they happen, and people are like, 'He's still one of the top guys in free agency,' but teams are not showing that, then it's meant to happen."
Thursday was hell.

But Jeffcoat, who describes himself as a man of faith, had been through this before: when he wasn't drafted in the NFL, and again when, after playing nine regular-season games with Washington and getting a few looks with other teams, his NFL career ended.

Each time, he trusted in himself, dug deep and bounced back.

That led to six seasons in Canada that redefined his football career.

Fighting through frustrating injuries that cost him several games most years, he won back-to-back Grey Cups, matching the two Super Bowls his dad won with the Dallas Cowboys.

As the "other" end opposite Willie Jefferson, Jim Jeffcoat's son recorded 38 quarterback sacks in 78 regular-season games for the Bombers.

That puts him eighth on the franchise's all-time list, one more than James West – and Jefferson.
Often Jeffcoat saved his best for the playoffs: in 12 games, including four Grey Cups, he got to quarterbacks 12 more times – a higher rate, even, than his more decorated Texas teammate.

His last two sacks came in the last West Final.

Still, his critics point to his injuries. Some called him expendable.

"I put my most out there. I played hard," he said. "Anybody that says they needed to move on from Jeffcoat is crazy. I definitely feel disrespected.

"But that will go. It's not a reflection of me."

The two times Jeffcoat got his hands on the Grey Cup are the two moments he'll cherish most.

But a lot of it was a blast.

As for what he'll miss the most...

"The competitiveness," he said. "The physical aspect of it, being able to impose your will against another grown man. That was fun. Hitting quarterbacks, so much fun.

"I'll miss the team. We had some good times."
Through it all, Jeffcoat has learned he's more than just a football player, a realization first forced on him when he went undrafted.

Now a second career awaits, either in commercial real estate or insurance.

He doesn't need the game.

"I enjoyed playing the game that I love. But I want to be able to have kids one day. I want to be able to play with them. I want to make sure that I'm healthy.

"I really just trusted my gut and my heart. You know what they say – when one door closes, another one opens."
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Throw Long Bannatyne

#11
Jeffcoat calling it quits.  :-[

Paul Friesen
@friesensunmedia

Surprised. Disappointed. Disrespected. Done. Jackson Jeffcoat is saying goodbye to Winnipeg, to the Blue #Bombers, to football.

Details in the following Friesen article, like Harris there was a breakdown in communication.

https://winnipegsun.com/sports/football/cfl/winnipeg-bluebombers/not-mad-but-at-peace-bombers-jeffcoat-calls-it-a-career

blue_gold_84

Well, I was certainly not expecting THAT from him.

You're going to be missed, Jackson. Thanks for everything and all the best in your retirement.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.


Pigskin

Sad to see him go, but the man's body was a wreck. I think JJ94 was making $175K last season.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

Pigskin

Do we take a run at Betts, Robertson, Oakman, Christmas(DT). All seem to be unsigned.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

theaardvark

Its been quite a long time since we haven't had the bookends here in Winnipeg.  We have had some guys come in when they've been sidelined, and Nats/GLB rotating in, but the Jeffs have been our DE's since before our GC runs.

Replacing them is going to be hard, but with our spend on O, its going to be impossible to bring in a top FA in that spot.  This is where teh scouts that constantly find us DT's need to find us a couple DE's going forward...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on February 09, 2024, 08:15:06 PMDetails in the following Friesen article, like Harris there was a breakdown in communication.

I was just going to note this.  This seems to be a pattern with how we handle players we want gone.  And I'm not sure I like it.

With AH33, at least we know there was some beefs stewing on The Mafia side.  Can we say the same about JJ?  I wasn't aware of any beefs.  So what if this is just how KW handles the unwanted?

To be fair, there is probably a good tactical reason why KW would turn off the comms.  It may help in negotiation with other re-signings, other potential incoming-FAs, and even with the snubbed player themselves should we realize we need them.

However, it does sound sucky from a human perspective, and I think it's easy to feel for JJ and his described emotions.  Did he deserve better?  How hard is it to call up these "unwanteds" before the tamper period and say "we just can't fit you into the budget this year, you best explore other options"?  Then again, I'm not a GM.

I wonder how other teams handle this...
Never go full Rider!


TecnoGenius

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on February 09, 2024, 08:24:50 PMYou're going to be missed, Jackson. Thanks for everything and all the best in your retirement.

Yes, this is simply a function of him being tub-bound for much of the last 2 seasons.  And we all were guessing he'd be even more tub-bound in 2024.  Clearly other teams thought so too, since he said all other offers were lower.  We were wondering that, and there's our answer.

It's too bad that his body was falling apart on him.  A bit strange, since DE isn't the worst of body-crushing positions, but, like Loffler, sometimes it's luck of the draw.  Makes you appreciate (or at least understand and tolerate) Willie's in-whistle body-saving techniques more.

I am very thankful to Jeffcoat, have always been a huge fan, think he was key to our cups, and think know we'll be worse without him (at least for a short while).  He got a bum deal from God and (maybe) from The Mafia.  I hope he achieves success at his next endeavor.

As to WFC: our DL never did much when JJ was out... let's hope we work this season on solving that problem.  We've been spoiled for a long time with 2 CFL-top DEs.
Never go full Rider!

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: TecnoGenius on February 09, 2024, 09:26:09 PMI was just going to note this.  This seems to be a pattern with how we handle players we want gone.  And I'm not sure I like it.

With AH33, at least we know there was some beefs stewing on The Mafia side.  Can we say the same about JJ?  I wasn't aware of any beefs.  So what if this is just how KW handles the unwanted?

To be fair, there is probably a good tactical reason why KW would turn off the comms.  It may help in negotiation with other re-signings, other potential incoming-FAs, and even with the snubbed player themselves should we realize we need them.

However, it does sound sucky from a human perspective, and I think it's easy to feel for JJ and his described emotions.  Did he deserve better?  How hard is it to call up these "unwanteds" before the tamper period and say "we just can't fit you into the budget this year, you best explore other options"?  Then again, I'm not a GM.

I wonder how other teams handle this...

Agree, I was worried about the non-action that was happening before the Schoen and Brady deals, Jeffcoat is probably not the only one feeling there should have been better communication.  Not sure it's Walters job to communicate with players directly other than through agents, I think this falls on the shoulders of the Senior Director of Player Relations Darren Cameron to keep players in the loop regardless of their status.

ichabod_crane

Speaking of What If's.....Jesse Lumsden was another player (Canuck running back) who could have been a real star in the CFL, but his body just could not take the tougher contact outside of university football. His shoulders were like glass and a good shot they always popped out! :(  He later got involved with the Canadian bobsleigh team , was a good pusher/runner and participated in two Olympics.

Horseman

Thank you JJ for your contribution to the Bombers. Good Luck in your future career. Every player and every one working in any job reaches a cross road and must make the decision on when to retire, as for athletes they get to the point they know in their hearts it is time. Good Luck JJ.

Blue In BC

Not entirely a surprise and sad to see him go. Thanks for the years of great play. Age, injuries and SMS eventually catch up with every players.

Maybe a chance to move into coaching if that's something he'd like to do.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

GOLDMEMBER

A true warrior. Blessed future JJ shoe in for future blue bomber HOFer.
I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

theaardvark

I loved it when the Jeff's were on the field, dominating OT's.  They were a dynamic duo.  But I'm not sold on the slant of this Freisen interview, I can't put this only on the Bombers, Jackson has to take some of the "blame.

Communication:

"the imparting or exchanging of information or news."

Communication is a two way street.  It sounds like Jackson's exit interview included the possibility of him retiring.  With his health issues, I do not blame Walters for not actively pursuing him, especially if he did not reach out, post exit interview, expressing an interest in playing.  Remember Darian Durant? That's scary.

The fact that he decided, during the tampering period, to explore his options, and no one made him an offer he was happy with, that says it all.  Its not that the Bombers never reached out, they did, just before the tampering window.  And he decided to "explore his options".  It doesn't say if a number was offered by the Bombers... but we all know it wasn't the $175k he took home last year for 14 games played (up from his usual 12 games).  Which, as a proud man, he would take a pay cut as disrespect.

I get that reaching out on his part would sacrifice some bargaining position, but Walters is not a douche, and would have probably negotiated with him in good faith had he come to the table earlier.  The fact that the Bombers reached out close to the tampering period shows they were interested and didn't just ignore him.  So, "communication" isn't really something you can blame the Bombers for.

Its too bad he thinks the Bombers disrespected him, after 6 years of work together, 3 or 4 of which he got top pay, even though he only played part of the seasons. 

I really think, though, if he stays in shape and takes time to heal, he could end up as a late season pick up, even for us...



Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

I have nothing but great things to say about Jackson Jeffcoat. He was nothing but a beast for us. His performance in the 2019 Grey Cup was legendary.

Parting ways is never easy, but he's an all timer in my books.
My wife is amazing!

ModAdmin

There also was a fair bit of fan criticism of JJ94's performance and missed games last year and Jackson's wife was not impressed by those comments.  Not sure if that also played into his decision to retire.  It's the "what have you done lately" syndrome - a bit unfair because Jackson put his heart and soul into playing for the Bombers over the years.
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on February 09, 2024, 10:53:23 PMI really think, though, if he stays in shape and takes time to heal, he could end up as a late season pick up, even for us...

I was just thinking that.  If he stays in shape (big if), and our pass rush is stuck at level 0 (non-existent) come vet cutdown day, WFC can come crawling back with hat in hand to JJ.  We could afford to pay him 1/4 season at 2x what he's expecting, he gets his payday and saves face and everyone is happy.

About 0 chance that happens (the 2nd part, not the first part)... but hey, we can dream.

Ideally we'll find a way to have a JJ-level pass rush DL without JJ; but I'm not too hopeful at this point.  We've all seen how Willie needs effective help from the other DL (whether DE or DT) to be the most effective.
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

And let's give him credit: he was a big time player who made big time plays in big time games(tm).  His 3 GC's were monster.  I don't recall if he had any big plays in the last one, though..?.. could be part of why we let him walk.  Always solving those post-season puzzle pieces is our Mr. Walters...

But never diminish what he did for us when healthy in '19-'22.

(Wow, check out his cfl.ca stats... '23 wasn't a drop-off at all... it was basically a near-record year for him.  And only 4 games missed?  Maybe cutting him was purely a money move -- darn SMS.)

(Double wow, he was here since '17, never played for another team... a Bomber-for-lifer... maybe he did deserve more respect.  We gonna do the same to Biggie and Willie one day??  Yikes... not great for future player morale and retention.  Need to show the hardcore lifers some love!)
Never go full Rider!

Waffler

I look at it as they were just not sure what they can do, waiting for Schoen and Oliveira. There's a 20 page thread about that. Turns out they sign both and there can't be much left, so what are they going to say to Jeffcoat? By the time we know where we are he is already testing the waters of free agency. Perhaps they were going to talk after the tampering window closes. I don't know.

The thing it has in common with Harris is that the Bombers are probably unsure about his health going forward. What they accomplished until now is not in dispute. Jeffcoat played great when he played but he probably also led the team in practices missed last year.  I think of injured guys that played in Grey Cups, Collaras 2 years ago, Schoen and Bighill, they did not play near what they can healthy and if you are honest it was not good enough. It's the only thing I can think of since we show in every other way we want the same team back. Not sure about that approach, time will tell, but they say if you're not getting better you are getting worse. I see other teams getting better and would not be surprised if the Western final is in BC this time.
Buried in the essentially random digits of pi, you can find your eight-digit birthdate. (Is that a wink from God or just a lot of digits?) - David G. Myers
__________________________________________________
Everything seems stupid when it fails.  - Fyodor Dostoevsky

GOLDMEMBER

Quote from: ModAdmin on February 10, 2024, 01:47:26 AMThere also was a fair bit of fan criticism of JJ94's performance and missed games last year and Jackson's wife was not impressed by those comments.  Not sure if that also played into his decision to retire.  It's the "what have you done lately" syndrome - a bit unfair because Jackson put his heart and soul into playing for the Bombers over the years.
What are you saying? Are we supposed to not criticize players on here because if there wives will come on here and be unhappy with the constructive criticism? :-\
I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

GOLDMEMBER

Jeffcoat's comments are scathing

If the BB ghosted him that isn't right.

I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

ModAdmin

Quote from: GOLDMEMBER on February 10, 2024, 02:49:13 PMWhat are you saying? Are we supposed to not criticize players on here because if there wives will come on here and be unhappy with the constructive criticism? :-\

Not saying it is wrong to criticize players' performances. Just pointing out that, in this case, that family of said player did not appreciate some of the comments and that may have had some bearing on his retirement decision.
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

Pigskin

I don't recall anyone criticizing JJ94 for his play or commitment to the team. He's one of the best DEs in the CFL. I think most of the talk was about his injury probably. Only played 78 games out of a possible 104. So basically 25% of his career was in the tub. Good Luck JJ94 with your retirement.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

The Zipp

The pool is pretty shallow for CFL experienced D Lineman...Oakman still out there...overall the number of dominant D lineman signed with teams is pretty low.

I still think (and I know it's revisionist theory) but if Walter's signed Lemon last season we win the Grey Cup. 

Jesse

Quote from: GOLDMEMBER on February 10, 2024, 03:14:42 PMJeffcoat's comments are scathing

If the BB ghosted him that isn't right.



How are they scathing? He's a little disappointed he wasn't higher on our priority list.

Let's not make this bigger than it really is.
My wife is amazing!

dd

The solution is simple, go get Oakman and move on. The guy is a young, upcoming beast and would look very good in blue and gold!!

Jesse

Quote from: dd on February 10, 2024, 07:26:19 PMThe solution is simple, go get Oakman and move on. The guy is a young, upcoming beast and would look very good in blue and gold!!

I think the solution is to find rookies playing for the minimum.
My wife is amazing!

dd

You're right, the piggie bank is empty, so we'll rely on a rook to come in and make an impact, which is a long shot at best. And we didn't get any stud DT coming in to get pressure from the interior.

The days of pressure from both sides getting to the Qb are over, and our secondary is going to be put to the hot seat now more than ever.

GOLDMEMBER

Quote from: dd on February 10, 2024, 07:26:19 PMThe solution is simple, go get Oakman and move on. The guy is a young, upcoming beast and would look very good in blue and gold!!
I would love to see Oakman here but if they sign him thus preventing us getting say a Castillo then no. We need a great kicker still.
I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: GOLDMEMBER on February 10, 2024, 08:09:35 PMI would love to see Oakman here but if they sign him thus preventing us getting say a Castillo then no. We need a great kicker still.

Surprised Castillo has not been signed yet, don't see many other options for him in the CFL, but maybe he's considering other leagues.

theaardvark

Dlinemen seem to get to spped in the CFL a lot quicker than Olinemen. 

D is about disruption, disorder, disharmony.  Its an individual effort, but is enhanced over time by knowing how much you can "cheat" on your duties or have to adapt because of the teammates around you.

Oline is a ballet of synchronized effort.  Olines gel over time, as they figure out their place and steps in the flow of each play.  Knowing the play of the guy on either side of you is very important to your execution.

Bringing in rookie Dlinemen shouldn't be anywhere near as hard as Olinemen.  I am confident in our scouts to fill the vacant D spots as they have always done.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on February 10, 2024, 08:36:21 PMSurprised Castillo has not been signed yet, don't see many other options for him in the CFL, but maybe he's considering other leagues.

Or considering the Jeffcoat way...  it all depends on his non-football career path.

Right now, its a buyers market for P/K.  Liram coming back into the league means 10 kickers for 9 jobs. 

Castillo might just wait for the market to change, due to retirement, performance or injury.  No reason for him to rush to sign a team friendly deal.  I hate the fact, but he's smart to wait until his price is met, or until there is a spike in demand.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Pigskin

Oakman 6'9"/Jefferson 6'7" the twin towers. I also think Pete Robertson still mite be out there.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

The Zipp

Quote from: Pigskin on February 10, 2024, 09:17:30 PMOakman 6'9"/Jefferson 6'7" the twin towers. I also think Pete Robertson still mite be out there.

Is pete the guy that headbutted ZC?

Throw Long Bannatyne

#46
Quote from: The Zipp on February 10, 2024, 11:14:12 PMIs pete the guy that headbutted ZC?

Yes Sir.  Zach may not approve.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: theaardvark on February 10, 2024, 08:43:11 PMOr considering the Jeffcoat way...  it all depends on his non-football career path.

Right now, its a buyers market for P/K.  Liram coming back into the league means 10 kickers for 9 jobs. 

Castillo might just wait for the market to change, due to retirement, performance or injury.  No reason for him to rush to sign a team friendly deal.  I hate the fact, but he's smart to wait until his price is met, or until there is a spike in demand.

A very reliable FG kicker is something the Bombers can't afford not to have. I don't think they would gamble their season on an unproven unknown, too much at stake.

Blueforlife

Quote from: Pigskin on February 10, 2024, 06:23:19 PMI don't recall anyone criticizing JJ94 for his play or commitment to the team. He's one of the best DEs in the CFL. I think most of the talk was about his injury probably. Only played 78 games out of a possible 104. So basically 25% of his career was in the tub. Good Luck JJ94 with your retirement.
People complained about him, his injuries and his play at times.  Many last year where very concerned about of defensive line.

Jeffcoat departure will leave a hole. I have always been a huge fan.  I would prefer to develop than sign a stud.  If a stud or prospect is available at a reasonable price I'm down.  I'm also happy to see what we can find at camp.  Could save a pretty penny if we could find a fresh face here (from camp).
Sometimes you need a fresh start

TecnoGenius

Quote from: The Zipp on February 10, 2024, 06:46:30 PMI still think (and I know it's revisionist theory) but if Walter's signed Lemon last season we win the Grey Cup.

I'm not sure about that...  I think Sankey hurt us more than Lemon.  Stopping Brady (and Demski) runs was more critical to our loss than the odd sack/pressure.  Though no doubt we would have fared better had they not had Lemon also.  Looking realistically at that game, we really were like a hair away from winning, so really any little thing may have put us over the top.

It's hard to say.  Surely no-Ento = no-GC, but Ento wasn't a late pickup we had a shot at.  I think it was MTL's O that won that game, not MTL's D (strangely enough given the hype was the opposite).  And our O going soft in the late 4th (that's on us).

In both loss years I think if we had been the team forced into 3 downs all the way (down 4+: forced TD) last that we would have won.  It would have forced us to play boldly.  Giving the other team the 3-down situation is what lost the games.  When we're in the '24 GC, I hope we aren't down by 0-3: I want to be down 4-7.  Or up 2 scores.  Period.  No more of this close garbage, because clearly the braintrust doesn't have the guts to close.
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: dd on February 10, 2024, 07:26:19 PMThe solution is simple, go get Oakman and move on. The guy is a young, upcoming beast and would look very good in blue and gold!!

Quote from: Jesse on February 10, 2024, 07:29:43 PMI think the solution is to find rookies playing for the minimum.

You guys said it... no moolah.  A hidden, existing gem only we spotted last season is the only other option (~$100k).  In all likelihood we roll with the apprentice from last season in any open positions.  Time to step up.  Luckily we have a decent track record of success with this (a la the yearly parade & shuffle at DT).

Maybe some overstocked teams will be shedding good but affordable players throughout the season we can keep an eye on.  Might need more of an eye for cuts and talent than in previous years.
Never go full Rider!

Pigskin

Fox has only 5 games of CFL experience. 2 with us and 3 with BC. Where Walker had 19 games of experience, before he took over as our starting DT last season. Watched Fox a lot last year at practice. He seems to have a good motor, and moves well.   

2021: 7 games, 8 DTs, 1 sack.
2022: 12 games, 12 DTs, 1 sack.
2023: 17 games, 37 DTs, 5 sacks.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

GOLDMEMBER

In the end it is a bit sad to see JJ feel the need to have those remarks on social media. I'd love to be a fly on the wall during the Walters/JJ conversation.
I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

kkc60

Quote from: Pigskin on February 10, 2024, 09:17:30 PMOakman 6'9"/Jefferson 6'7" the twin towers. I also think Pete Robertson still mite be out there.
both of those names are certainly intriguing. Oakman and Jefferson on one side of the line with Haba and Lawson on the other could be a mismatch

Pigskin

Sounds like Winnipegger, Mason Bennett is back with Hamilton for another year. Two teams made him offers, but not enough to make him change his address. Sad, he's much better then our Bennett.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

BLUEBOMBER

Sad to see Jeffcoat go but he is not irreplaceable. He was getting injured quite often and it wouldn't make sense to pay him a big salary for playing just half the season.

Jockitch

As a big Jeffcoat fan it is sad to hear of the retirement but do wish him the best going forward 
BOMBERS ARE GREY CUP " CHAMPS "
               
          HUSTLE & MUSCLE

theaardvark

Quote from: BLUEBOMBER on February 12, 2024, 06:36:28 PMSad to see Jeffcoat go but he is not irreplaceable. He was getting injured quite often and it wouldn't make sense to pay him a big salary for playing just half the season.

To be fair, he played 2/3rds of the season most years... but yeah.  Hard to pay a premium salary, even if he did show up for the playoffs (which he got paid extra for).

If he would have exited a little differently, I think he might have gotten a late season injury/performance call, and he could have had a long rest to recuperate his issues, and come in fresh.  Not sure if that call gets made after his interview.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Throw Long Bannatyne

#58
Quote from: BLUEBOMBER on February 12, 2024, 06:36:28 PMSad to see Jeffcoat go but he is not irreplaceable. He was getting injured quite often and it wouldn't make sense to pay him a big salary for playing just half the season.

I don't see this as a problem, he was being paid a premium when healthy and his play equaled that of a premium player every game he played.  When not healthy he was put on the 6 game and his salary did not count against the cap. 

The Bombers are no longer cash poor, they are cap restrained, so spending money outside the limiting cap is not a problem.  Placing him on the 6-game for one more season provides a great opportunity to find his replacement.  The scouts failed to find his equivalent last season or any of the previous seasons he's been moved to the 6-game, this is not Jeffcoat's fault.  His contribution is going to be extremely hard to replace with an ELC player, especially with the additional loss of Walker inside.

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on February 12, 2024, 07:48:54 PMI don't see this as a problem, he was being paid a premium when healthy and his play equaled that of a premium player every game he played.  When not healthy he was put on the 6 game and his salary did not account against the cap. 

The Bombers are no longer cash poor, they are cap restrained.  Placing him on the 6-game for one more season provides a great opportunity to find his replacement.  The scouts failed to find his equivalent last season or any of the previous seasons he's been moved to the 6-game, this is not Jeffcoat's fault.  His contribution is going to be extremely hard to replace with an ELC player, especially with the additional loss of Walker inside.

I don't think Jeffcoat was ever on the 6 game... definitely not last year as he only missed 4 games, and the previous years it was 6 games per year, but I do not think they were consecutive, so, yes, every penny we paid him went against the cap, and that's hard to swallow for a premium salary.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_gold_84

What's noteworthy is 2023 was Jeffcoat's healthiest season (14 GP) since his rookie season in 2017 (16 GP).
#forthew
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Don't be a Rich.

TecnoGenius

I'm 4 games in to my rewatch of 2023, and I wanted to note that Haba actually was looking good and making plays.  I had forgotten about that as he was getting dissed later in the season when we all wanted Jeffcoat back and comparing the DL with/without Jeffcoat.

I'm not sure Haba will ever be a Jeffcoat, but maybe we'll get lucky and he'll be good enough to still allow Willie to do his thing?

Also lost in all of this Hansen: maybe he becomes a bit more critical in FA at this juncture?  He didn't do squat after his return in 2023, but he may have still been recovering.  If he still gets a bigger-than-normal-GLOB salary in '24, perhaps we simply can't afford it?  Still, it's nice to use up a free-bingo GLOB spot at a position we'll be struggling at (DE).

Ignoring our DE desperation for a moment, for my money I'm keeping/dressing Maruo over Hansen.  What we do a P will determine our options on the 2nd GLOB.
Never go full Rider!

Blue In BC

Quote from: TecnoGenius on February 12, 2024, 10:23:01 PMI'm 4 games in to my rewatch of 2023, and I wanted to note that Haba actually was looking good and making plays.  I had forgotten about that as he was getting dissed later in the season when we all wanted Jeffcoat back and comparing the DL with/without Jeffcoat.

I'm not sure Haba will ever be a Jeffcoat, but maybe we'll get lucky and he'll be good enough to still allow Willie to do his thing?

Also lost in all of this Hansen: maybe he becomes a bit more critical in FA at this juncture?  He didn't do squat after his return in 2023, but he may have still been recovering.  If he still gets a bigger-than-normal-GLOB salary in '24, perhaps we simply can't afford it?  Still, it's nice to use up a free-bingo GLOB spot at a position we'll be struggling at (DE).

Ignoring our DE desperation for a moment, for my money I'm keeping/dressing Maruo over Hansen.  What we do a P will determine our options on the 2nd GLOB.

I'm guessing we don't re-sign Hansen or we would have done it by now? Maruo is not longer on the roster. I wonder why they made that move to PR to end the season for him.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

dd

Quote from: TecnoGenius on February 12, 2024, 10:23:01 PMI'm 4 games in to my rewatch of 2023, and I wanted to note that Haba actually was looking good and making plays.  I had forgotten about that as he was getting dissed later in the season when we all wanted Jeffcoat back and comparing the DL with/without Jeffcoat.

I'm not sure Haba will ever be a Jeffcoat, but maybe we'll get lucky and he'll be good enough to still allow Willie to do his thing?

Also lost in all of this Hansen: maybe he becomes a bit more critical in FA at this juncture?  He didn't do squat after his return in 2023, but he may have still been recovering.  If he still gets a bigger-than-normal-GLOB salary in '24, perhaps we simply can't afford it?  Still, it's nice to use up a free-bingo GLOB spot at a position we'll be struggling at (DE).

Ignoring our DE desperation for a moment, for my money I'm keeping/dressing Maruo over Hansen.  What we do a P will determine our options on the 2nd GLOB.
If Im an OC scheming against Willie, I'd double team him and block headup on the rest of our D line and our pass rush goes to zero in a hurry. The key to our pass rush was BOTH Jeffcoat and Jefferson coming at the Qb hard and both demanded double teaming or you paid the price. Not so anymore.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Blue In BC on February 12, 2024, 10:30:30 PMI'm guessing we don't re-sign Hansen or we would have done it by now? Maruo is not longer on the roster. I wonder why they made that move to PR to end the season for him.

Ah, that seems to have made Maruo disappear, as he's not in the FA lists either.  I guess that answers that as to PR->disappear != FA.

Maruo was going nowhere but PR after Hansen came back.  No free GLOB AR spot.  If we ditch the Sheehan Experiment(TM) in '24 then I'd love to have Maruo back.  Double-especially if Hansen walks.  I could easily argue Maruo would have been more useful in the GC than Hansen.

Maruo did a ton of reps on D and was pretty good.  I'd say at least as good as any of our NAT MLB/WLBers.  Assuming he wants to keep playing in the CFL, I have no idea why we wouldn't sign him.  I guess he might want a small bump above GLOB ELC.  Ok.  MOS seemed to like him, too.
Never go full Rider!

Blue In BC

Quote from: TecnoGenius on February 13, 2024, 01:25:52 AMAh, that seems to have made Maruo disappear, as he's not in the FA lists either.  I guess that answers that as to PR->disappear != FA.

Maruo was going nowhere but PR after Hansen came back.  No free GLOB AR spot.  If we ditch the Sheehan Experiment(TM) in '24 then I'd love to have Maruo back.  Double-especially if Hansen walks.  I could easily argue Maruo would have been more useful in the GC than Hansen.

Maruo did a ton of reps on D and was pretty good.  I'd say at least as good as any of our NAT MLB/WLBers.  Assuming he wants to keep playing in the CFL, I have no idea why we wouldn't sign him.  I guess he might want a small bump above GLOB ELC.  Ok.  MOS seemed to like him, too.

I'd be interested to see Maruo return. In theory he'd still be on an ELC. Whether either we want Hansen back still seems to be a question. I'd think some effort will be made to replace Sheehan but that may not be successful.

Just a guess but we draft 3 more Global kicking specialists. I would have thought Liegghio as a punter might have been a choice but he's not a free agent now.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

Hansen wasn't interested in a global salary once he had his 2 years in, and I'm not sure the Bombers felt he earned the big increase they got him, so I would not be surprised if we've seen the last of him in the CFL.  Sad, because he was a favourite and quite the ST stud and wild on cheetah.  Not sure if it was nagging injuries that prevented him from returning to form, but whatever it was, he certainly wasn't the player that would blow things up in his first few years.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Blue In BC

The global draft was reduced to just 3 rounds in 2023. That's not a very deep pool and we've given up on a few we carried on our PR for a few years and last year.

2019 Grey Cup Champions

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: theaardvark on February 13, 2024, 05:02:00 PMHansen wasn't interested in a global salary once he had his 2 years in, and I'm not sure the Bombers felt he earned the big increase they got him, so I would not be surprised if we've seen the last of him in the CFL.  Sad, because he was a favourite and quite the ST stud and wild on cheetah.  Not sure if it was nagging injuries that prevented him from returning to form, but whatever it was, he certainly wasn't the player that would blow things up in his first few years.

Hansen's big increase probably brought him up to minimum wage for rookies, he's been at the bottom tier of the wage scale for 3 years.

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on February 13, 2024, 05:47:12 PMHansen's big increase probably brought him up to minimum wage for rookies, he's been at the bottom tier of the wage scale for 3 years.

Pretty sure it was foe considerably more than min wage, I remember seeing it was min for the first year, and then a raise for the second with an additional bump to make up for not being able to pay him in year one due to the Global restriction still being in effect.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

ichabod_crane


Throw Long Bannatyne

#71
Quote from: theaardvark on February 13, 2024, 07:48:59 PMPretty sure it was foe considerably more than min wage, I remember seeing it was min for the first year, and then a raise for the second with an additional bump to make up for not being able to pay him in year one due to the Global restriction still being in effect.


The first 3 seasons Hansen played, Global players were limited to contracts of $54k, $11k below league min. for all other first year players.  With the new CBA in 2023 Globals were bumped up to league min. of $70k, Hansen was extended on a 1-year deal in 2023 and Bombers may have upped him in the vicinity of $80k.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: ichabod_crane on February 13, 2024, 09:06:28 PMFA tracker says Hansen signs with the Argos.

It's a good move for both.  We'll always remember him for dismembering the Ticat returner without touching him... Thanks for your service Hansen!  Good luck in TOR.

Now, since filling GLOB roster spots is mandated (not sure on the count anymore... 2 dressing? 3 total?), we'll need to keep Maruo (as one of the few who can do anything), probably Sheehan, and do we risk filling that 3rd spot with a GLOB rookie?  Or do we continue on with someone like Machino?

You know what would be really handy... a GLOB FB...
Never go full Rider!