If the Bombers lose Dru Brown

Started by bwiser, December 12, 2023, 10:25:50 PM

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Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: TecnoGenius on December 17, 2023, 04:39:47 AM
Yup Pigskin... you're giving away too much info!!  The uberfans who sleep on printed copies of the roster can figure out your puzzle.  You've given us enough clues over so many months  ;) ;) ;)

Lawler probably received a signing bonus, but he would not receive any payment for the games he missed.  This will be an important earning year for Kenny making up for money lost last season.

theaardvark

There are always the "restructured" contracts that frontload signing bonuses to reduce overall cap hits.  They only work for players you are pretty sure will play the whole season.  There are a few durable players that meet those requirements, hopefully that helps a little with the cap, and that Walters avails himself of the option.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Pete

Structuring a deal for schoen say 3 years at 175,  250,250 might work as lawlers deal will be up




theaardvark

Or, you can offer Schoen $250, with $175 as a signing bonus...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: theaardvark on December 17, 2023, 06:52:27 PM
Or, you can offer Schoen $250, with $175 as a signing bonus...

Pretty sure signing bonuses are considered within the salary cap, so not sure what advantage you're suggesting the team would find.  For the player it's money upfront non-dependent on performance, but the payout can also be the reason they get cut.

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 17, 2023, 07:44:48 PM
Pretty sure signing bonuses are considered within the salary cap, so not sure what advantage you're suggesting the team would find.  For the player it's money upfront non-dependent on performance, but the payout can also be the reason they get cut.

$250 with $175 signing bonus yields a better take home than $300k without the bonus.  Bonuses are taxed completely different in the US.  If the player is not one you are worried about spending most of his time in the tub (no SMS relief on bonuses for 6 game IR), then you can make these kinds of deals and "save" SMS by not having to pay as much in total.  There have been years when many of our stars did this, restructured existing deals lower with more bonus. Bryant was one of those, but I'm not sure he'd be one I'd take the chance on this year.

Yes, there is the risk if you pay out a signing bonus that the player might not earn it, either through injury, or worse, getting cut.  So you only do it with guys you are confident will earn the deal, and will stay out of the tub.  Many of our younger FA's would fit that bill...

Plus, getting cash in hand, regardless the tax implications, is always an incentive. 

You rarely see an NFL contract that isn't signing bonus heavy.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Sir Blue and Gold

#51
Quote from: theaardvark on December 17, 2023, 08:07:14 PM
$250 with $175 signing bonus yields a better take home than $300k without the bonus.  Bonuses are taxed completely different in the US.  If the player is not one you are worried about spending most of his time in the tub (no SMS relief on bonuses for 6 game IR), then you can make these kinds of deals and "save" SMS by not having to pay as much in total.  There have been years when many of our stars did this, restructured existing deals lower with more bonus. Bryant was one of those, but I'm not sure he'd be one I'd take the chance on this year.

Yes, there is the risk if you pay out a signing bonus that the player might not earn it, either through injury, or worse, getting cut.  So you only do it with guys you are confident will earn the deal, and will stay out of the tub.  Many of our younger FA's would fit that bill...

Plus, getting cash in hand, regardless the tax implications, is always an incentive. 

You rarely see an NFL contract that isn't signing bonus heavy.

This didn't pass the logic test so just did some Googling and I don't believe it's true. The IRS considers company bonuses ?supplemental income,? they are taxed just like any other income you make. https://www.cnbc.com/select/how-company-bonus-is-taxed/

I do believe there may be some savings for American players due to laws related to earning income in Canada but having an American primary residence but that probably wades into "real accountant knowledge" territory.

Blue In BC

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on December 18, 2023, 05:15:47 PM
This didn't pass the logic test so just did some Googling and I don't believe it's true. The IRS considers company bonuses ?supplemental income,? they are taxed just like any other income you make. https://www.cnbc.com/select/how-company-bonus-is-taxed/

I do believe there may be some savings for American players due to laws related to earning income in Canada but having an American primary residence but that probably wades into "real accountant knowledge" territory.


It's a primary reason why some signing bonus's are so big.
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theaardvark

It has something to do with signing bonuses only being taxed in the home state, but game cheques being taxed in the state/province they are earned in. 
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: theaardvark on December 19, 2023, 12:22:47 AM
It has something to do with signing bonuses only being taxed in the home state, but game cheques being taxed in the state/province they are earned in. 

I've heard repeatedly there is an advantage to receiving much of the salary as a bonus, so you may be correct, less tax.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on December 19, 2023, 12:22:47 AM
It has something to do with signing bonuses only being taxed in the home state, but game cheques being taxed in the state/province they are earned in. 

Maybe.  Just a guess, but perhaps the tax is paid where you earned the money.  If you're sitting at home in Atlanta and WFC pays you, they probably pay you the full amount and you must remit USA tax on it as locally-in-USA earned income.  And that tax would be at the much much MUCH lower USA rate.  Whereas money earned while you're in WPG has tax withheld and paid to MB/CAN.

I have no idea how the all-year-Winnipeggers (like Willie & Biggie) would be taxed on the bonus, though.  You'd think since they were both in Canada and >6mo Canada-livers they wouldn't be able to escape the Canada taxman.

I have long-term full-year living-in-Canada USA friends and they certainly get tax withheld and pay all the MB/CAN tax.  The only thing the USA has to do with it is you have to file with them and pay tax on anything weird that might fall out of USA deductions, like RRSPs.

I'm sure navigating all of this is 100% aided by experts @WFC, and is one of the things players are talking about when they say at pressers WFC makes it all easy and smooth.
Never go full Rider!

theaardvark

Quote from: TecnoGenius on December 19, 2023, 03:56:10 AM
Maybe.  Just a guess, but perhaps the tax is paid where you earned the money.  If you're sitting at home in Atlanta and WFC pays you, they probably pay you the full amount and you must remit USA tax on it as locally-in-USA earned income.  And that tax would be at the much much MUCH lower USA rate.  Whereas money earned while you're in WPG has tax withheld and paid to MB/CAN.

I have no idea how the all-year-Winnipeggers (like Willie & Biggie) would be taxed on the bonus, though.  You'd think since they were both in Canada and >6mo Canada-livers they wouldn't be able to escape the Canada taxman.

I have long-term full-year living-in-Canada USA friends and they certainly get tax withheld and pay all the MB/CAN tax.  The only thing the USA has to do with it is you have to file with them and pay tax on anything weird that might fall out of USA deductions, like RRSPs.

I'm sure navigating all of this is 100% aided by experts @WFC, and is one of the things players are talking about when they say at pressers WFC makes it all easy and smooth.


Making a change in Lawlers deal, or signing Schoen, they can take advantage of these better tax rates, if they live in low tax states.  Not sure the tax rates in Kansas or Cali, of if they still live there.  Floridiand Nevada are low tax states.... 
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

VictorRomano

#57
Quote from: theaardvark on December 17, 2023, 08:07:14 PM

Yes, there is the risk if you pay out a signing bonus that the player might not earn it, either through injury, or worse, getting cut.  So you only do it with guys you are confident will earn the deal, and will stay out of the tub.  Many of our younger FA's would fit that bill...

Not a fan of big signing bonuses.  It hasn't been that long since Bombers signed Darian Durant, and he took the bonus money then bailed on us before the season started.  Fool me once for $70k.....

blue_gold_84

Quote from: VictorRomano on December 19, 2023, 07:54:05 PM
Not a fan of big signing bonuses.  It hasn't been that long since Bombers signed Darian Durant, and he took the bonus money then bailed on us before the season started.  Fool me once for $70k.....

I don't think Schoen would sign a shiny new contract here and then decide to retire before turning 28 years old.

He's also not a petulant turd like Durant is.
#forthew
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