2024 Blue Bombers Free Agency

Started by ModAdmin, November 25, 2023, 03:13:14 AM

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ModAdmin

Free Agent Round Up

...The Blue Bombers' list of prospective free agents features 35 names, including the entire starting offensive and defensive lines, three starting receivers, five players who made starts in the secondary, ace return man Janarion Grant, kicker Sergio Castillo and - just to punctuate the point - Canadian Football League rushing champ and top homegrown product, Brady Oliveira.

There's also this: GM Kyle Walters, along with his assistants in Danny McManus and Ted Goveia, are also working on expiring contracts.

Yowzers.....

https://www.bluebombers.com/2023/11/24/free-agent-round-up-2/
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

Jesse

Well, I just hope we start hearing about some signings sooner rather than later.
My wife is amazing!

Blue In BC

Let the re-signing begin with Walters very soon. There is work to be done.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Lincoln Locomotive

Other teams have quickly announced signings and we're worried about signing our GM and assistants....not sure much will happen until this is resolved
Bomber fan for life

Jesse

Quote from: Lincoln Locomotive on November 25, 2023, 04:03:27 PM
Other teams have quickly announced signings and we're worried about signing our GM and assistants....not sure much will happen until this is resolved

We were playing for longer than they were. They?re schedules are a week or two ahead of ours.
My wife is amazing!

ModAdmin

Official CFL list of free agents from each CFL team.

https://www.cfl.ca/fa24/
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

Lincoln Locomotive

Quote from: Jesse on November 25, 2023, 05:22:53 PM
We were playing for longer than they were. They?re schedules are a week or two ahead of ours.
true that....fair enough.   I just hope this gets resolved fairly quickly
Bomber fan for life

J5V

Quote from: Lincoln Locomotive on November 25, 2023, 09:32:15 PM
true that....fair enough.   I just hope this gets resolved fairly quickly
Agreed. KW has done an amazing job getting personnel in here since he took over from Mack. We need him to continue to do that job.
Go Bombers!

Blue In BC

Rough count of 268 potential free agents across the CFL including outs. There are possible replacements at every position if it comes down to that.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

Kyle Walters and his crew have done an amazing job of navigating the $SMS issues and recruiting, more than the average number of players have come through our system and moved on to play significant roles on other teams. Yet they have managed to replace them and keep our team competitive.

Wade needs to get them back under contract as soon as possible.  I am hoping that its just a matter of dotting the t's and crossing the i's ...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

Well, I would expect to hear something one way or another this week about our GM situation.
My wife is amazing!

blue_gold_84

Quote from: Jesse on November 26, 2023, 10:11:45 PM
Well, I would expect to hear something one way or another this week about our GM situation.

Would be nice to get that sorted out in short order. I can't imagine much else could get done until Walters' contract situation is dealt with.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

Blue In BC

#12
It's the same every off season. Big list of potential free agents. IDK if we have any SMS left from 2023. Regardless we can begin re-signing players with signing bonus's paid in early 2024 if there is none left from 2023.

As usual I put the priority on the Canadians as the most difficult to replace and helps continuity.

Obviously Oliveria is the main priority but that falls squarely into his decision about looking towards the NFL. After that I think all of the Canadian OL in no particular order as the most critical.

On defence I'd name Nichols, Jefferson and Jeffcoat as the highest priorities.

By my count we have 17 starters listed as potential free agents and several strong specialists or rotation players.

Let the work begin now that Walters is back on board. There is lots of time but if there is any 2023 SMS money left, use it or lose it before the end of Dec.

If we lose Buck Pierce to the Riders we might see some players choose to follow him. I'm counting on him staying in Winnipeg.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

You have to wonder if Buck's status might affect some of the FA's decisions to sign early.  I hope not. 

I can't see a few of our players having long term goals, maybe one or two years until retirement.  Moving to a new team/city doesn't seem likely, so we may see some players on Bighill type deals, where they stay for less.  And who knows how many are currently working here or have post career opportunities here.  That can make a big difference in how much $SMS you ahve available.

I'd like to see as many of our present players return, but we all know that we are going it lose some.  Luckily there is no one names Sayles needing to be re-signed ;)

We are deep in many positions, and can lose a player here or there.  DLine might be an issue, but I can't see the Jeff's leaving unless someone really backs up the truck. 

DB's, LB's are deep. WR deep, Oline deep.  QB, well, if Dru gets a starting offer and doesn't come back, I'm sure we will have plenty of competition for the #2 spot, and I can't see Prukop going anywhere, he knows he's got a good gig here. 

With Walters and company back, I think we'll be just fine.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

Quote from: theaardvark on November 28, 2023, 06:48:27 PM
You have to wonder if Buck's status might affect some of the FA's decisions to sign early.  I hope not. 

I can't see a few of our players having long term goals, maybe one or two years until retirement.  Moving to a new team/city doesn't seem likely, so we may see some players on Bighill type deals, where they stay for less.  And who knows how many are currently working here or have post career opportunities here.  That can make a big difference in how much $SMS you ahve available.

I'd like to see as many of our present players return, but we all know that we are going it lose some.  Luckily there is no one names Sayles needing to be re-signed ;)

We are deep in many positions, and can lose a player here or there.  DLine might be an issue, but I can't see the Jeff's leaving unless someone really backs up the truck. 

DB's, LB's are deep. WR deep, Oline deep.  QB, well, if Dru gets a starting offer and doesn't come back, I'm sure we will have plenty of competition for the #2 spot, and I can't see Prukop going anywhere, he knows he's got a good gig here. 

With Walters and company back, I think we'll be just fine.

I can't think of too many guys who could be pulled out.

Dru Brown is possible, but I don't expect him back anyway, so whatever. Maybe a guy like Bailey if he's offered an increased opportunity/pay day, but Bailey is a loud proponent of not wanting to leave our culture. Maybe one of our OL shakes loose if they offer a pay day?
My wife is amazing!

Blue In BC

Quote from: Jesse on November 28, 2023, 07:12:32 PM
I can't think of too many guys who could be pulled out.

Dru Brown is possible, but I don't expect him back anyway, so whatever. Maybe a guy like Bailey if he's offered an increased opportunity/pay day, but Bailey is a loud proponent of not wanting to leave our culture. Maybe one of our OL shakes loose if they offer a pay day?

The thing about the Riders is there is likely a massive roster overall. They also have 36 players on their potential free agent list. I'd think a large number will be given an apple an a roadmap.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Pigskin

Interesting: A buddy just sent me ZC8 GC stats.

2019: 17/23  170 yards,  0 TDs, 0 INTs.
2021: 21/32  240 yards,  2 TDs, 2 INTs
2022: 14/23  183 yards,  0 TDs, 1 INT.
2023: 19/23  236 yards,  0 TDs, 1 INT.

Total: 71/101, 819 yards, 2TDs,  4 INTs.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: Pigskin on November 28, 2023, 07:22:58 PM
Interesting: A buddy just sent me ZC8 GC stats.

2019: 17/23  170 yards,  0 TDs, 0 INTs.
2021: 21/32  240 yards,  2 TDs, 2 INTs
2022: 14/23  183 yards,  0 TDs, 1 INT.
2023: 19/23  236 yards,  0 TDs, 1 INT.

Total: 71/101, 819 yards, 2TDs,  4 INTs.

Interesting how?
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

Pigskin

No passing TDs in the last two GCs. And, only 2 in 4 GCs.

Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

theaardvark

Quote from: Jesse on November 28, 2023, 07:12:32 PM
I can't think of too many guys who could be pulled out.

Dru Brown is possible, but I don't expect him back anyway, so whatever. Maybe a guy like Bailey if he's offered an increased opportunity/pay day, but Bailey is a loud proponent of not wanting to leave our culture. Maybe one of our OL shakes loose if they offer a pay day?

Brown is the number one loss.  But like you say, expected.

Oline, SSK can offer any of them a pay upgrade. and we have more Oline than we can field, so we could lose starters or backups to more money and/or more playing time,  Bailey, not going anywhere.  But guys like Augustine, BOO, and even Schoen can be pried away with playing time/pay increases. 

We could lose D players as well, Buck was the OC, but no doubt has relationships with players on all three phases.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

Quote from: theaardvark on November 28, 2023, 07:57:34 PM
Brown is the number one loss.  But like you say, expected.

Oline, SSK can offer any of them a pay upgrade. and we have more Oline than we can field, so we could lose starters or backups to more money and/or more playing time,  Bailey, not going anywhere.  But guys like Augustine, BOO, and even Schoen can be pried away with playing time/pay increases. 

We could lose D players as well, Buck was the OC, but no doubt has relationships with players on all three phases.

The OL at risk of leaving is Dobson if he's not going to get starter time.

Schoen is guy who we're at risk to losing to FA, but that's to whoever the highest bidder/best situation is, could be anyone if we can't retain him.

BOO might leave us for more playing time, I don't think Sask is really in the market for receivers though. I think they like their guys.

There's no one I can really think of that we want to keep that would leave with Buck. If they leave, it's simply a budget/playing time thing and they more on to where ever the best opportunity is.
My wife is amazing!

Pigskin

Quote from: Jesse on November 28, 2023, 08:23:23 PM
The OL at risk of leaving is Dobson if he's not going to get starter time.

Schoen is guy who we're at risk to losing to FA, but that's to whoever the highest bidder/best situation is, could be anyone if we can't retain him.

BOO might leave us for more playing time, I don't think Sask is really in the market for receivers though. I think they like their guys.

There's no one I can really think of that we want to keep that would leave with Buck. If they leave, it's simply a budget/playing time thing and they more on to where ever the best opportunity is.

I believe Dobson is still under contract for 2024. I can't see him going anywhere this season.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

dd

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on November 28, 2023, 07:27:57 PM
Interesting how?
He?s thrown twice as many picks as TDS and in 3 of the 4 games, didn?t throw any TDs

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: Jesse on November 28, 2023, 08:23:23 PM
The OL at risk of leaving is Dobson if he's not going to get starter time.

Schoen is guy who we're at risk to losing to FA, but that's to whoever the highest bidder/best situation is, could be anyone if we can't retain him.

BOO might leave us for more playing time, I don't think Sask is really in the market for receivers though. I think they like their guys.

There's no one I can really think of that we want to keep that would leave with Buck. If they leave, it's simply a budget/playing time thing and they more on to where ever the best opportunity is.

Buck to Sask. or not, Brown should look at his best option to find quick success, no QB can overcome an O-line that can't block effectively and rebuilding a good O-line from scratch can take many years.  Sask. O-line is at ground zero, I don't know if they have any solid pieces in place.

I hope Brown signs for 2 years for good pay, goes to F.A., then comes back when Zach is ready to call it quits.  Like Lawler, he'll realize everything he's missing as soon as he plays elsewhere.

Big Daddy

Quote from: dd on November 29, 2023, 12:20:56 AM
He?s thrown twice as many picks as TDS and in 3 of the 4 games, didn?t throw any TDs

Stats are stats, that's it.  You can pull any correlations you want, doesn't mean there is cause.

He is 1 for 2 in games throwing under 200 yds, 1 for 2 in games over 200 yards.
He is 1 for 3 in games throwing at least one TD, 1 for 1 when he throws a TD pass.
He is 2 for 2 when TD:INT ratio is 1:1, 0 for 2 when worse than even.

And he is 2 for 2 when Andrew Harris played for us, and 0 for 2 without him.  Does anyone really believe AH was the deciding factor for us NOT winning either of the last 2 GCs? 

The sample size is too small to really draw anything from his specific stats.  Nothing astounding here in these stats other than in all four GC games his stats weren't all that impressive.  Yet we have 2 for 4 championships with that, which tells me how much football is a team game.

Lincoln Locomotive

Quote from: Big Daddy on November 29, 2023, 03:07:39 AM
Stats are stats, that's it.  You can pull any correlations you want, doesn't mean there is cause.

He is 1 for 2 in games throwing under 200 yds, 1 for 2 in games over 200 yards.
He is 1 for 3 in games throwing at least one TD, 1 for 1 when he throws a TD pass.
He is 2 for 2 when TD:INT ratio is 1:1, 0 for 2 when worse than even.

And he is 2 for 2 when Andrew Harris played for us, and 0 for 2 without him.  Does anyone really believe AH was the deciding factor for us NOT winning either of the last 2 GCs? 

The sample size is too small to really draw anything from his specific stats.  Nothing astounding here in these stats other than in all four GC games his stats weren't all that impressive.  Yet we have 2 for 4 championships with that, which tells me how much football is a team game.
Bomber fan for life

blue_gold_84

Quote from: dd on November 29, 2023, 12:20:56 AM
He?s thrown twice as many picks as TDS and in 3 of the 4 games, didn?t throw any TDs

That still doesn't address how those stats are interesting relative to the 2024 free agency period.

It's a mediocre stat line but the team is 2-2 in those four games.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on November 29, 2023, 01:13:06 PM
That still doesn't address how those stats are interesting relative to the 2024 free agency period.

It's a mediocre stat line but the team is 2-2 in those four games.

I think the stats are very relevant, shows Zach did not have his best games in the GC and the pressure of the moment gets to him.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on November 29, 2023, 04:48:29 PM
I think the stats are very relevant, shows Zach did not have his best games in the GC and the pressure of the moment gets to him.

That has no relation to the 2024 free agency period.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

dd

Quote from: Jesse on November 28, 2023, 08:23:23 PM
The OL at risk of leaving is Dobson if he's not going to get starter time.

Schoen is guy who we're at risk to losing to FA, but that's to whoever the highest bidder/best situation is, could be anyone if we can't retain him.

BOO might leave us for more playing time, I don't think Sask is really in the market for receivers though. I think they like their guys.

There's no one I can really think of that we want to keep that would leave with Buck. If they leave, it's simply a budget/playing time thing and they more on to where ever the best opportunity is.
BOO has shown very well in his limited play8ng time and I don?t understand why we didn?t give him more opportunity to play and sit Woli. I think he ll catch on somewhere and be very productive, just wish it was with us.

blue_or_die

#30
Quote from: dd on November 29, 2023, 05:22:51 PM
BOO has shown very well in his limited play8ng time and I don?t understand why we didn?t give him more opportunity to play and sit Woli. I think he ll catch on somewhere and be very productive, just wish it was with us.

You don't sit a reliable vet 5th receiver for someone who's less of a known commodity at a position out of the spotlight regardless of upside. And I say this as a BOLO fan.
#Ride?

blue_gold_84

https://www.cfl.ca/2023/11/29/cfl-cas-top-30-pending-free-agents-9/

A lot of big names on that list, with Oliveira in the top spot.

Other Blue Bombers: Schoen (4), Jefferson (13), Houston (20), Hardrick (26), Brown (27).
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on November 29, 2023, 06:57:06 PM
https://www.cfl.ca/2023/11/29/cfl-cas-top-30-pending-free-agents-9/

A lot of big names on that list, with Oliveira in the top spot.

Other Blue Bombers: Schoen (4), Jefferson (13), Houston (20), Hardrick (26), Brown (27).

Brown should be #1 on that list based on team interest.

Pigskin

Brady, Schoen, Brown, and Bailey. I can't see us sign more then two of these guys.

Brady will give the NFL a shot, but will be back and in Blue and Gold.
Schoen needs to be locked down on a 2-3 year deal. Could be the best WR in the CFL.
Brown wants to start, and unless the Bombers are trading ZC8 that's not happening here. 
I don't think Bailey takes a hair cut this year. Have to decide Bailey or Schoen, can't see us signing both.
And then there's Lawler at $300K??

Leake, would be an excellent pickup. He could replace McCrae and the often injured Grant.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on November 29, 2023, 07:39:29 PM
Brown should be #1 on that list based on team interest.

Has any team declared an interest in him?
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on November 29, 2023, 07:39:29 PM
Brown should be #1 on that list based on team interest.

The kid with potential comes in behind every established all star, lol.
My wife is amazing!

dd

Quote from: blue_or_die on November 29, 2023, 06:55:12 PM
You sit a reliable vet 5th receiver for someone who's less of a known commodity at a position out of the spotlight regardless of upside. And I say this as a BOLO fan.
We know Wolitarskys capabilities and upside, we don?t know BOO s, he?s younger and more athletic. I d give him a chance to show us his talent vs dress a guy who catches the 10 yard out. If push came to shove I d keep BOO

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: theaardvark on November 29, 2023, 10:33:23 PM
Has any team declared an interest in him?

They can't officially do that until free agency opens, which is in Feb..

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Pigskin on November 28, 2023, 07:34:24 PM
No passing TDs in the last two GCs. And, only 2 in 4 GCs.

Not concerned.  The Bailey TD in 2019 should have counted, so there's one more.  And we had Strev throw the TD in '19.

Zach is clearly not asked to throw the big TDs.  We really only made 1 TD passing shot in the MTL GC... the INT.  And just like in the TOR GC, the INT would have been the difference between winning and losing.

Our game plan is clearly to pound it in.  Arguably that Lawler INT shot should have been more pounding, or some wacky misdirection Lapo-esque play.  That series was too predictable.  Pound pound pound pound 30YL EZ shot INT.

I think we (Buck/MOS) hamstring Zach in big games.  He's capable of airing it out early and often and getting big 60Yers in stride but we simply don't let him.  Ya, there's a chance there is a go route on many plays and Zach shies away, but my money is on Zach being told to play it safe.  The saddest part is we know all this and yet we got picked off in the MTL GC.  That should not have happened.  Should have pounded it or put it up way at the back where only Lawler could get it, not some late crossing FS or HB.
Never go full Rider!

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Big Daddy on November 29, 2023, 03:07:39 AM
And he is 2 for 2 when Andrew Harris played for us, and 0 for 2 without him.  Does anyone really believe AH was the deciding factor for us NOT winning either of the last 2 GCs

You don't want to ask me that question!  Does AH get 5-7Y on that final run on our last (real) series in the GC, instead of the 0Y stuff that Brady did?  AH, when he was here, in post-season games, would turn those 0Y stuffs into 5Y, especially in grind-out time to seal the win.

If we had 2nd & 5 on that final drive then we have the whole book to get the other 5, and we proved all night we were great at 2nd & medium.  Then Zach doesn't take the sack and we bleed another 60s off the clock and have a chance at another 1st down.

Not saying AH-aged-now could have done it, but AH-when-he-was-here likely does.  It's a bit of a Brady-letdown to me to cap his season off with that failure.  But not his failure alone: Buck shouldn't have run it on 1st right there.  The game was right their in our hands and the whole O blew it.  I guess MTL wanted it more.
Never go full Rider!

J5V

Quote from: TecnoGenius on November 30, 2023, 02:48:28 AM
Not concerned.  The Bailey TD in 2019 should have counted, so there's one more.  And we had Strev throw the TD in '19.

Zach is clearly not asked to throw the big TDs.  We really only made 1 TD passing shot in the MTL GC... the INT. 
That reminds me ... on that INT, I was not real happy with Lawler's effort there. Isn't he supposed to be the guy to come down with those 50-50 balls? How does he not at least prevent the INT on that play?
Go Bombers!

Doublezero

Regardless of where Dru Brown signs next season (I hope it's the CFL and Winnipeg) how much will he be paid?
There's much speculation there will be multiple bids for his very obvious talent.
Based on this list of top 15 CFL QBs in 2023, where do folks see Brown, a first-year starter, in 2024?

https://3downnation.com/2023/04/17/the-cfls-15-highest-paid-quarterbacks-for-2023-season/

As there might be a bidding war, I see him falling somewhere between Vernon Adams Jr ($350,000) and Taylor Cornelius ($432,000).
It's an interesting list, BC got fair value out of VAJ, I'd say and Cornelius, among others, way overpaid obviously.
If it were not for the fact that Cornelius is guaranteed 50% of his salary in 2024 - I could see Elks going hard after Brown and just cutting Cornelius altogether.


Just gimme the rock.

dd

Quote from: J5V on November 30, 2023, 10:03:02 PM
That reminds me ... on that INT, I was not real happy with Lawler's effort there. Isn't he supposed to be the guy to come down with those 50-50 balls? How does he not at least prevent the INT on that play?
My thoughts exactly. Sure Zack SHOULD have thrown it to where either Lawler catches it or nobody does, BUT he didn?t, yes the Als player made a great play on the ball but Lawler should have been in there trying to knock the ball away, the same way th Als D pried the ball out of BOs hands. The Als simply made plays where we didn?t and boom game over

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: Doublezero on November 30, 2023, 10:56:45 PM
Regardless of where Dru Brown signs next season (I hope it's the CFL and Winnipeg) how much will he be paid?
There's much speculation there will be multiple bids for his very obvious talent.
Based on this list of top 15 CFL QBs in 2023, where do folks see Brown, a first-year starter, in 2024?

https://3downnation.com/2023/04/17/the-cfls-15-highest-paid-quarterbacks-for-2023-season/

As there might be a bidding war, I see him falling somewhere between Vernon Adams Jr ($350,000) and Taylor Cornelius ($432,000).
It's an interesting list, BC got fair value out of VAJ, I'd say and Cornelius, among others, way overpaid obviously.
If it were not for the fact that Cornelius is guaranteed 50% of his salary in 2024 - I could see Elks going hard after Brown and just cutting Cornelius altogether.

$432,000 was max. money for Cornelius, hard money was $392,000 and I honestly can't see him getting paid that as he lost the starting job half way through the season.  There must have been some conditions tied to that payment and he probably failed to achieve most of them.  The Elks better find a way out of that contract as it will curtail them from signing any free agents.  Super dumb.

TBURGESS

I see him more like Arbuckle $130K-230K.
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

Jesse

Quote from: TBURGESS on December 01, 2023, 03:18:46 PM
I see him more like Arbuckle $130K-230K.

Impossible to predict unless we know if he's being signed as a starter or as a back-up with bonuses built in for starts.
My wife is amazing!

J5V

Quote from: dd on November 30, 2023, 10:59:43 PM
My thoughts exactly. Sure Zack SHOULD have thrown it to where either Lawler catches it or nobody does, BUT he didn?t, yes the Als player made a great play on the ball but Lawler should have been in there trying to knock the ball away, the same way th Als D pried the ball out of BOs hands. The Als simply made plays where we didn?t and boom game over
A 50-50 ball should go to the guy being paid a helluva lot more than the other. ;-)
Go Bombers!

buckzumhoff

We need a real good kick returner or two anda punter that kicks high like Calgary has. I think we lost alot of yards on punts and kickoffs. We probably had more yardage on offense than any other team be ause we had to move the ball so far

dd

Quote from: J5V on December 01, 2023, 08:38:52 PM
A 50-50 ball should go to the guy being paid a helluva lot more than the other. ;-)
Exactly. Our big time player did not make the big play in the big game. We had better not lose schoen to free agency when he paid that guy big bucks, if someone must go due to cap issues, it would be him

Cool Spot

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 01, 2023, 01:52:49 AM
$432,000 was max. money for Cornelius, hard money was $392,000

Taylor Cornelius got $432k last year? Off the top of my head, I can't think of a single other player who was paid so much to deliver so little (based on their output as well as their history).

Throw Long Bannatyne

#50
Quote from: Cool Spot on December 02, 2023, 04:45:35 AM
Taylor Cornelius got $432k last year? Off the top of my head, I can't think of a single other player who was paid so much to deliver so little (based on their output as well as their history).

Not likely, at most he would have been paid $392,000, because he certainly didn't achirve any bonus benchmarks, but I take your point, he was vastly overpaid.  Somebody in Edmonton must realize by now, Jones is exceptionally terrible with money. 

dd

Quote from: Cool Spot on December 02, 2023, 04:45:35 AM
Taylor Cornelius got $432k last year? Off the top of my head, I can't think of a single other player who was paid so much to deliver so little (based on their output as well as their history).
Absolute crime of the century!!! He's not even a good backup let alone starter. This signing should have cost Jones his job

theaardvark

Jones is not afraid to make questionable decisions.  He took the chance that Corny would pan out, and he'd be a genius for tying him up cheap.  Thing is, looks like Jones as a D guy is not a great judge of O talent.  Remember when he signed an elite WR and tried to turn him into a DB?

Not sure if Corny has a deal still for 2024, but you can bet he's cut or renegotiated before he gets one more $.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Sec223

Obviously BO is a great "CFL" back. But if anyone on here watches much NFL he's no where near being an NFL back. He would need to be a lot faster and get juiced up. Bravo for him to try. Why not ? Perhaps just trying to drive up his offers here ?

Jesse

Quote from: Sec223 on December 03, 2023, 10:53:56 AM
Obviously BO is a great "CFL" back. But if anyone on here watches much NFL he's no where near being an NFL back. He would need to be a lot faster and get juiced up. Bravo for him to try. Why not ? Perhaps just trying to drive up his offers here ?

It has obviously been his dream. He went to the Canada Prep Academy and then onto UND with the intention of being drafted in the NFL.

Now he's coming off a 2000 yard season, which there's no guarantee he'll ever hit again. He's hoping the tape can earn a look see somewhere.

That said, he gets tackled from behind by CFL defensemen. The biggest flaw to his game is the one thing he would really need to get a look in the NFL. He won't make special teams or be a returner, or have the flexibility to run out wide.  It is his life and right to take his shot and I wish him the best, but I think his best long-term prospects will bw with the Bombers. Spend a career in Winnipeg setting records will create local options in his post-football career.
My wife is amazing!

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: Jesse on December 03, 2023, 03:31:04 PM
It has obviously been his dream. He went to the Canada Prep Academy and then onto UND with the intention of being drafted in the NFL.

Now he's coming off a 2000 yard season, which there's no guarantee he'll ever hit again. He's hoping the tape can earn a look see somewhere.

That said, he gets tackled from behind by CFL defensemen. The biggest flaw to his game is the one thing he would really need to get a look in the NFL. He won't make special teams or be a returner, or have the flexibility to run out wide.  It is his life and right to take his shot and I wish him the best, but I think his best long-term prospects will bw with the Bombers. Spend a career in Winnipeg setting records will create local options in his post-football career.

Not very many players have the great opportunity to capitalize on their hometown connection like he does, and Brady has done a good job of promoting that advantage through his causes.  If he leaves for a football career elsewhere that stepping stone to a post football career in Wpg. will diminish.

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 03, 2023, 06:23:27 PM
Not very many players have the great opportunity to capitalize on their hometown connection like he does, and Brady has done a good job of promoting that advantage through his causes.  If he leaves for a football career elsewhere that stepping stone to a post football career in Wpg. will diminish.

I think the opposite might be true, or at least as likely. 

By having any success in "the show" it will build his rep. 

He will always have a home here, both on the Bombers and in Winnipeg.  I wish him success either way... but obviously the preferred path keeps him here at home, like Jon Cornish has done in Calgary. 
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Throw Long Bannatyne

#57
Quote from: theaardvark on December 04, 2023, 01:04:55 AM
I think the opposite might be true, or at least as likely. 

By having any success in "the show" it will build his rep. 

He will always have a home here, both on the Bombers and in Winnipeg.  I wish him success either way... but obviously the preferred path keeps him here at home, like Jon Cornish has done in Calgary. 

Does kicking around PR lists for 2-3 years constitute success?  Not in my opinion.

Jesse

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 04, 2023, 01:53:06 AM
Doesn't kicking around PR lists for 2-3 years constitute success?  Not in my opinion.

Not in mine, either.

Imagine if Milt stuck on with the Bengals in the 90's after his first couple of seasons. Would anyone remember him? Or Kyries Hebert, he was great for us but then spent the majority of his career  being an NFL teamer before having a second life with the Als. Does he have any opportunities here?

I know Brady's a local kid, but you have to have a local presence in order to capitalize on it.
My wife is amazing!

theaardvark

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 04, 2023, 01:53:06 AM
Does kicking around PR lists for 2-3 years constitute success?  Not in my opinion.

PR in the NFL vs. star in the CFL.  BO20 has already done just about all he can do for everything except lifetime numbers, and he could bounce around on NFL PR's for a couple year, come back and still make hall of fame numbers. 

Any player that is satisfied not chasing the "show" is less successful than someone who does.  In My Humble Opinion.  The only way you are getting on an AR in the NFL is by getting on a PR first.  And if he gets onto an AR, gets his games in, gets his NFL pension/benefits, he can come back and finish his career here.  Doug Brown did 3 years chasing the dream, and came back to a 10 year career here.  Brady's a few years older than Doug was when he went south, but no reason he can't do something similar.  Did Doug Brown's time in the NFL hurt his status?
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Pete

#60
 Not sur
e if Brady's skill set transfers to the Nfl, in that here he is able to physically impose his will on defenses. which hes unlikely to do there

dd

#61
I think he?s wasting his time, but it?s his dream so go get it, he will get rude awakening though, he is nowhere near quick enough to be an nfl back, he never really outruns his would be tacklers up here, and down there everybody is bigger, faster and stronger, so there won?t be any bully ball down there

Throw Long Bannatyne

#62
According to the following John Hodge article, only 5 CFL RB's have signed NFL contracts in recent history and most of them never progressed beyond PR status.  Kory Sheets, William Stanback, Jerome Messam, Lache Seastrunk, and James Butler all took their shot.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/12/how-realistic-are-canadian-rb-brady-oliveiras-nfl-aspirations/

Not liking Brady's chances and hoping for a quick return.

Blue In BC

We're due to announce a few more signings before Christmas IMO. Some deals may have been worked out and not officially announced. Bombers are a bit notorious about spacing out off season news.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: Blue In BC on December 13, 2023, 04:40:18 PM
We're due to announce a few more signings before Christmas IMO. Some deals may have been worked out and not officially announced. Bombers are a bit notorious about spacing out off season news.

Yep, pretty sparse with their announcements so far, I believe they have to use any unspent 2023 money before Dec. 31, so hope for one or two more signings before year end.

Pete

#65
if you had three free agents you would look at realistically being able to sign. who would they be? And who would they replace to make room?
my choices would be:
Mason Bennett  replacing Thomas
Dedrick Mills if Olivera isn't here for training camp
Lanier to replace Jeffcoat

Blue In BC

#66
Quote from: Pete on December 15, 2023, 04:03:12 PM
if you had three free agents you would look at, who would they be? And who would they replace to make room?
my choices would be:
Mason Bennett  replacing Thomas
Dedrick Mills if Olivera isn't here for training camp
Lanier to replace Jefferson


There are nearly 280 free agents ( 245 non Bombers at the moment ) and that's the best you can come with?

Ouellette, Pickett, Adeleke, Beverette, Betts, McManis and Bede just to name a few. I'd always be looking at top Canadians first but you could build an entire roster with the potential players on the list.  Some very good import talent might be available as well.

So it's a domino effect situation based on who we lose and need to replace. If we lose Oliveria I'd certainly look at Ouellette but he may also be looking at the NFL or a boatload ( see what I did there ) of cash. The reality is that 80% of the free agents will re-sign with their current team. Beyond that we don't know current SMS for each player or their expectations on a new contract.



Did you mean replace Jeffcoat with Lanier? Jefferson has already re-signed.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

Like every year, most of the players heading to FA will re-sign with their present teams. 

There will be a few notable departures, players seeking greener pastures or greener contracts.  When Lawler was let go in EDM, they were free to sign Lewis.  So Ellingson and Harty sign in MTL.  There will be shuffling, for sure.

Last year during the free agency period (according the the CFL tracker), about 120 players re-signed with current teams, and about 60 moved. 

Bombers re-signed 16, and 3 moved   (Couture, Ellingson and Sayles)


We had a far above average rate of retaining players.  And with our head office staying intact, no reason the beliive that will change this year.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Pete

Quote from: Blue In BC on December 15, 2023, 04:19:11 PM
There are nearly 280 free agents ( 245 non Bombers at the moment ) and that's the best you can come with?

Ouellette, Pickett, Adeleke, Beverette, Betts, McManis and Bede just to name a few. I'd always be looking at top Canadians first but you could build an entire roster with the potential players on the list.  Some very good import talent might be available as well.

So it's a domino effect situation based on who we lose and need to replace. If we lose Oliveria I'd certainly look at Ouellette but he may also be looking at the NFL or a boatload ( see what I did there ) of cash. The reality is that 80% of the free agents will re-sign with their current team. Beyond that we don't know current SMS for each player or their expectations on a new contract.



Did you mean replace Jeffcoat with Lanier? Jefferson has already re-signed.
your right i meant Jeffcoat(corrected it, thanks), and i was looking at free agents that we had a shot of signing which narrows down the list greatly. also by indicating the moves required to free the cap space. Mcmanis.Beverette, Oulette, Pickett. Betts are all pipe dreams.

Blue In BC

Quote from: Pete on December 15, 2023, 06:52:18 PM
your right i meant Jeffcoat(corrected it, thanks), and i was looking at free agents that we had a shot of signing which narrows down the list greatly. also by indicating the moves required to free the cap space. Mcmanis.Beverette, Oulette, Pickett. Betts are all pipe dreams.

You can never tell. McManis from Calgary to Toronto in 2022. Pickett moved from the Als in 2023. Betts moved to the Lions in 2022 from the Eks. Awe moved from the Lions to the Stamps last year.  Lawler moved from the Elks back to the Bombers in 2023.

You could say the same about the Bombers losing Couture to the Lions and Sayles to the TiCats last year.

It all comes down to who do we lose that we then end up with some SMS and a specific need.

In the case of the Argos IMO they are going to lose some top players as a result of Kelly moving from an ELC to the highest paid player in the CFL. Something has to give.

Once we hit free agency we'll see who are actually free agents and who we might be interested in acquiring. 
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

Quote from: Blue In BC on December 15, 2023, 08:22:26 PM
You can never tell. McManis from Calgary to Toronto in 2022. Pickett moved from the Als in 2023. Betts moved to the Lions in 2022 from the Eks. Awe moved from the Lions to the Stamps last year.  Lawler moved from the Elks back to the Bombers in 2023.

You could say the same about the Bombers losing Couture to the Lions and Sayles to the TiCats last year.

It all comes down to who do we lose that we then end up with some SMS and a specific need.

In the case of the Argos IMO they are going to lose some top players as a result of Kelly moving from an ELC to the highest paid player in the CFL. Something has to give.

Once we hit free agency we'll see who are actually free agents and who we might be interested in acquiring. 

I don't think we will lose anyone that actually improves our SMS position.  Most of our potentially lost players were great value last year (Schoen, Brown, Oliveria, Houston, Nichols, Kramdi, Walker, etc), and replacing them with an equivalent in freeagency is going to be as tough as re-signing them.

Some will come back with a big raise.  But some we will lose.  We may see some SMS relief if we see some retirements.  And some players on thier last contracts might settle for less to stay.

We are not the only ones needing to sign players that were good value last year, but our recruiting was so successful, we are in a worse situation than most that way.  Lets just hope "next man up" continues.

Walters is going to earn every cent of his new deal.

Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Pete

Quote from: Blue In BC on December 15, 2023, 08:22:26 PM
You can never tell. McManis from Calgary to Toronto in 2022. Pickett moved from the Als in 2023. Betts moved to the Lions in 2022 from the Eks. Awe moved from the Lions to the Stamps last year.  Lawler moved from the Elks back to the Bombers in 2023.

You could say the same about the Bombers losing Couture to the Lions and Sayles to the TiCats last year.

It all comes down to who do we lose that we then end up with some SMS and a specific need.

In the case of the Argos IMO they are going to lose some top players as a result of Kelly moving from an ELC to the highest paid player in the CFL. Something has to give.

Once we hit free agency we'll see who are actually free agents and who we might be interested in acquiring. 
the thing is those teams for the most part had excess cap space, the biggest downfall with having a team laden with vets it gives you very little room to go after those names.  Another factor is what we are paying Zac, its why we couldn't afford to keep Sayles, its also why those teams with qb friendly contracts could sign them. BC/Argos/Edm/Mtrl
all had that last year. (between 200-300k difference) As you say this year Toronto will be interesting but Mcmanis, Oakman, Pickett will be highly sought after (especially by Sask with Corey Mace now in place. which may mean Roberson and Lanier become available)
the only way we can compete for them is some major cutting of our vets which you have to know will not happen with OShea

Now ...if we were to go completely off the grid and replace Collaros with Brown you could sign 2-3 of them but that would take tremendous cojones to do

Blue In BC

Quote from: theaardvark on December 15, 2023, 08:42:11 PM
I don't think we will lose anyone that actually improves our SMS position.  Most of our potentially lost players were great value last year (Schoen, Brown, Oliveria, Houston, Nichols, Kramdi, Walker, etc), and replacing them with an equivalent in freeagency is going to be as tough as re-signing them.

Some will come back with a big raise.  But some we will lose.  We may see some SMS relief if we see some retirements.  And some players on thier last contracts might settle for less to stay.

We are not the only ones needing to sign players that were good value last year, but our recruiting was so successful, we are in a worse situation than most that way.  Lets just hope "next man up" continues.

Walters is going to earn every cent of his new deal.



We may lose or need to lose an OL or two to make SMS room for others we choose to sign. Oliveria, Augustine and Briggs all were near $100K so we're going to gain some ground. Gauthier and Thomas aren't at an ELC level either. So there will be some SMS gain.

Some players may be lost whether we want to keep them or not, including some of those you mentioned.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Blue In BC

Quote from: Pete on December 15, 2023, 09:40:46 PM
the thing is those teams for the most part had excess cap space, the biggest downfall with having a team laden with vets it gives you very little room to go after those names.  Another factor is what we are paying Zac, its why we couldn't afford to keep Sayles, its also why those teams with qb friendly contracts could sign them. BC/Argos/Edm/Mtrl
all had that last year. (between 200-300k difference) As you say this year Toronto will be interesting but Mcmanis, Oakman, Pickett will be highly sought after (especially by Sask with Corey Mace now in place. which may mean Roberson and Lanier become available)
the only way we can compete for them is some major cutting of our vets which you have to know will not happen with OShea

Now ...if we were to go completely off the grid and replace Collaros with Brown you could sign 2-3 of them but that would take tremendous cojones to do

I don't think for a minute that we replace Collaros but getting him to take $100K less is not out of the question. Him accepting is the problem.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

ModAdmin

Quote from: Blue In BC on December 15, 2023, 10:16:03 PM
I don't think for a minute that we replace Collaros but getting him to take $100K less is not out of the question. Him accepting is the problem.

It would be a hard sell.  He still is a top ranked QB in the league.  In 2023 #2 to Adams Jr. in passing yards and #1 in QB efficiency. 
consistently good for the last several ears.
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

dd

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 12, 2023, 08:12:01 PM
According to the following John Hodge article, only 5 CFL RB's have signed NFL contracts in recent history and most of them never progressed beyond PR status.  Kory Sheets, William Stanback, Jerome Messam, Lache Seastrunk, and James Butler all took their shot.

https://3downnation.com/2023/12/12/how-realistic-are-canadian-rb-brady-oliveiras-nfl-aspirations/

Not liking Brady's chances and hoping for a quick return.

This whole BO going to try the nfl thing is laughable. Go ahead and try it but you ll find out the hard way you?re too small, too slow and no where near elusive enough to be in the nfl, and hopefully the experience gives him some perspective on where he is in the RB talent pool in the big pond. He won?t even make a PR

Throw Long Bannatyne

#76
Quote from: theaardvark on December 15, 2023, 08:42:11 PM
I don't think we will lose anyone that actually improves our SMS position.  Most of our potentially lost players were great value last year (Schoen, Brown, Oliveria, Houston, Nichols, Kramdi, Walker, etc), and replacing them with an equivalent in freeagency is going to be as tough as re-signing them.

Some will come back with a big raise.  But some we will lose.  We may see some SMS relief if we see some retirements.  And some players on thier last contracts might settle for less to stay.

We are not the only ones needing to sign players that were good value last year, but our recruiting was so successful, we are in a worse situation than most that way.  Lets just hope "next man up" continues.

Walters is going to earn every cent of his new deal.

It would be a shame to lose Walker as the "next man up" ain't ready yet, they dressed Fox so little we have no idea if he's an adequate replacement or just a placeholder.  Another unheralded player I worry about losing is Kramdi, they invested 2 years in his development and he finally advanced to becoming an important Natl. starter on defence.   I think many teams would cherish him as a versatile ratio option and very good ST contributor. It would be such a pity if the first choice he makes is to sign with an Eastern club just to be closer to his family in Montreal.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Looks like the Viking took notice of Evan Holm's great season, if he catches on with the Vikes he'll be living his best dream, being a native of Minnesota.

CFL All-Star, #Bombers DB Evan Holm working out with the Minnesota @Vikings.

Two picks, two sacks, all coming in the second half of his breakout sophomore pro season.
The Minnesota-native turns 26 in April.

GOLDMEMBER

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 20, 2023, 05:22:43 PM
Looks like the Viking took notice of Evan Holm's great season, if he catches on with the Vikes he'll be living his best dream, being a native of Minnesota.

CFL All-Star, #Bombers DB Evan Holm working out with the Minnesota @Vikings.

Two picks, two sacks, all coming in the second half of his breakout sophomore pro season.
The Minnesota-native turns 26 in April.
it would really suck to lose him!
I LOSHT MY MEMBER IN AN UNFORTUNATE SHMELTING ACCSHIDENT!

theaardvark

The fact that we are losing DB's to the NFL is a testament to our scouts and coaches... I really hope we can retain Younger.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: theaardvark on December 21, 2023, 03:14:11 PM
The fact that we are losing DB's to the NFL is a testament to our scouts and coaches... I really hope we can retain Younger.

I think he's the heir apparent to Hall whenever he decides to retire. Younger will be a fantastic DC, IMO.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

Pigskin

BA, Houston, Hallett and Exume left to sign. Are the Bombers interested in signing Rose?
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: Pigskin on December 21, 2023, 06:31:02 PM
BA, Houston, Hallett and Exume left to sign. Are the Bombers interested in signing Rose?

I wouldn't be shocked if they let Rose walk simply due to numbers - both roster and SMS.
#forthew
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Don't be a Rich.

blue_or_die

The Rose situation reminds me of Chris Randall. Great for a time and then hit a best before date and we let him walk. I could see him also ending up in Ottawa, too.
#Ride?

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on December 21, 2023, 06:32:27 PM
I wouldn't be shocked if they let Rose walk simply due to numbers - both roster and SMS.

TBD, depending on who stays and who leaves, they may lose Holm, Darby and Houston, Lawrence status seems to be in limbo as well, neither on the roster or listed on the FA list.

Blue In BC

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 21, 2023, 08:27:25 PM
TBD, depending on who stays and who leaves, they may lose Holm, Darby and Houston, Lawrence status seems to be in limbo as well, neither on the roster or listed on the FA list.

Lawrence ended the season on the PR, thus automatically becoming a free agent. You may be right about Rose if we lose Holm to NFL if we are unable to re-sign Houston as well. Doubt we see Darby back in 2024.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

blue_gold_84

I still can't figure out what went down with Darby.
#forthew
лава Україні!
Don't be a Rich.

Blue In BC

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on December 22, 2023, 01:08:19 PM
I still can't figure out what went down with Darby.

IMO he was struggling with a lingering injury of some sort. That said he will be hard pressed to be re-signed.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

Quote from: Blue In BC on December 22, 2023, 03:25:14 PM
IMO he was struggling with a lingering injury of some sort. That said he will be hard pressed to be re-signed.

If it was injury related, he can be resigned without signing bonuses and come to camp healthy to win a spot.  If it was not injury related, then I can't see him coming back.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Blue In BC

Quote from: theaardvark on December 22, 2023, 03:45:30 PM
If it was injury related, he can be resigned without signing bonuses and come to camp healthy to win a spot.  If it was not injury related, then I can't see him coming back.

I brought this up earlier. He finished the season on the IR and would have been a potential free agent at best. However, he is no longer showing on any version of the roster which suggests he was released outright earlier?

I suppose it could be an error in the roster or potential free agent list. He is listed on the potential free agent list but that contradicts the roster list.

IMO he is no longer with the team and free to sign elsewhere at any time.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

DM83

Holm should stick in the NFL.  He has NFL speed and can actually tackle.
Rose should go away.  His play last year was below average, and seemed like he wanted to avoid contact. I think he never recovered from his injury of a couple years ago.

Alexander near a retirement age could do that or still play.  He was awesome last yr, as a safety.
Bombers defense came around last season. I think they used the season as practice.  The team roster on defense, minus Holm, should be a great group to return.

If I were the other players, I would look to resign here.  The low cost of living should be an attraction for guys, who partner up to rent or buy a house. The stadium is superb, and the personnel knows what football is all about.

We have a great team. Minus two plays in both Grey Cup losses, is the only thing needed to be done differently.  Everyone is still competent.  Schoen is awesome for the CFL.  Too slow for the NFL, but boy would he look good for so many struggling teams.  How about Kansas City and replace that loser # 19.

Shoen could say in the CFL and play on any team.  He just wouldn?t have as good a QB as he has in Wpg. However,  money could be better from somebody else who had salary cap room.

Brady could play in the NFL, but as a backup.  He would get equal money as he would make someone?s roster.  Everyone seems to rotate their running backs, so he could get a shot as a situational player.

Football is all about dominating the opponent. He would not have a chance in the NFL, as all rosters have hungry defensive guys, who are athletically superior.  However, again, put him behind an offensive line that are road graders, and he would do well.