Lions/Bombers PreGame Discussion - Noise Welcome to the Lions

[3rdand1.5]

Regardless how we line up the front we need to keep VAJ uncomfortable, whether it is by pressure/knockdowns, confusing coverages, tight coverages, whatever works.

He literally sliced and diced Calgary up last week and when it wasn't there he took off and used his legs, and was able to use his legs without taking any hits. We cannot let him get that comfortable. He didn't force deep balls, he took short and intermediate, he dumped off to Mizel, he danced in the pocket when it started to collapse, he moved his launch points, and made many tight on point throws.

We all know that bad VAJ is in there somewhere, we need to get his alter ego out somehow....remember bad VAJ snapping and swinging a helmet at Biggie, that is the version of him we want to see, we want unhinged Vernon this week......

The Lions are a really good team, but not good enough to overcome unhinged VA

I am not over concerned with the BC defence, unless Zach has a really bad game, as mentioned many times they have great speed but are a little smaller, they are chippy and aggressive and will take penalties. I think the book is out on Betts he has amazing burst, but a good tackle can take him out at least at first, to Betts credit he doesn't give up and on extended or broken plays he gets back to the play really well.

Everyone wants us to "bullyball" them and I am sure we will, but I would love to see us aggressive outta the gate if it's there! IMO Kenny is due a BIG game, this is why he came back, this is what he wants, I want to see him feel it early.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Regardless how we line up the front we need to keep VAJ uncomfortable, whether it is by pressure/knockdowns, confusing coverages, tight coverages, whatever works.

He literally sliced and diced Calgary up last week and when it wasn't there he took off and used his legs, and was able to use his legs without taking any hits. We cannot let him get that comfortable. He didn't force deep balls, he took short and intermediate, he dumped off to Mizel, he danced in the pocket when it started to collapse, he moved his launch points, and made many tight on point throws.

We all know that bad VAJ is in there somewhere, we need to get his alter ego out somehow....remember bad VAJ snapping and swinging a helmet at Biggie, that is the version of him we want to see, we want unhinged Vernon this week......

The Lions are a really good team, but not good enough to overcome unhinged VA

I am not over concerned with the BC defence, unless Zach has a really bad game, as mentioned many times they have great speed but are a little smaller, they are chippy and aggressive and will take penalties. I think the book is out on Betts he has amazing burst, but a good tackle can take him out at least at first, to Betts credit he doesn't give up and on extended or broken plays he gets back to the play really well.

Everyone wants us to "bullyball" them and I am sure we will, but I would love to see us aggressive outta the gate if it's there! IMO Kenny is due a BIG game, this is why he came back, this is what he wants, I want to see him feel it early.

Just re-watched the thrilling week 18 BC/Wpg. game last night, the Bombers did a very good job of limiting Adams running (3-21) and kept him under pressure all game long, much better than the Stamps did this past weekend.  Fact is they overwhelmed the BC O-line for much of the night, they can't handle Jeffcoat, Willie or Rickie Walker up the middle all that well. 

That game was too close for comfort but if the Offence can clean up some of their gaffes and put points on the board when they need to, it should be a clear win for Wpg.

[Pigskin]

Practice starts at 11:50. Think I am going to try and get to this one.  

[Pete]

I would think we would keep a linebacker down the middle so as to have our ends force Adams up the middle, also BC likes to run that quick pass play down the middle early to Cottoy or when they are in a 2nd and 7-10 yards.

[northof30]

Is Shoen out for certain?

[Jesse]

Is Shoen out for certain?

Nope.

[dd]

Watching every CFL game for the last 10 years is my source.  YMMV and you're welcome to your opinion.  They let everything go a bit looser in the big games.  They just do.  I study & slow-mo all potential off-sides, and they call them looser in playoffs.  I study & slow-mo all potential IPs, and they call them looser in the playoffs.  They definitely allow more hand-fighting and contact by the DBs.  Holds are allowed just that little bit longer than normal before being flagged.

Everything just gets that little bit more leeway.  The booth will say more of their patented "it's good they're just letting the boys play".

Maybe compare the flag count in DF and GC games compared to the reg-season games?  That would be non-anecdotal evidence.

I'm not saying Ambrosie calls the refs ahead of time and says "less flags guys" (though that is possible as a hint/nudge): what I'm saying is each ref crew talks amongst themselves ahead of each game and has a little chat.  Can the head ref say "guys this is an important game and we want to be absolutely sure before we call a game-changing penalty"?  Absolutely.  Do I have any inside source and know this for a fact?  Absolutely not.  The good refs take pride in what they do, and they don't want to look like fools throwing chintzy flags in a GC.

My ?opinion? is based on 35 years of reffing football. I personally know 3 officials who are currently working cfl games and have had many discussions with them on the intense and rigorous process they go through every week doing games and the post game evaluation process. What you?re suggesting is absolutely ridiculous. A foul is a foul in football, always has been always will be. This ain?t hockey where refs tuck their whistles in their pocket in the heat of the moment. If it?s a foul and it impacts the play, it?s called, whether it?s preseason or playoffs.

[TecnoGenius]

If it?s a foul and it impacts the play, it?s called, whether it?s preseason or playoffs.

Then maybe that is the cause of what I see, and we're saying the same thing.  Maybe during the reg season they throw more flags on things that don't "impact the play".  We call those "iffy" or "chintzy" and they happen many times every week.  Maybe in the post-season they keep those flags in their pockets unless it really really "impacts the play".  Maybe it's that the less-capable (lots of iffy flag) refs do a lot of reg season games and only the top tier get to do the post-season.

It could also be the teams that go deeper into the playoffs are more disciplined in general, or they make an extra effort to be disciplined in the post-season.  However, you could disprove that quickly by finding a "hot head" team in the past that goes deep in the playoffs.  (Any come to mind?)

Maybe it's some combo of all the above.

[TecnoGenius]

What type of scheme do you run if you are the DC Hall?

I would make them run. They don?t do it well, but as we saw VAJ can run when need be.

There's no such thing in football as "making them run".  You strive to take away the run and make them pass.  No one ever tries to take away the pass and make them run!  The run is the easier, and virtually "risk free" play.  If you give them the space they'll just run for 10Y every down.  In contrast, when they pass there's a million things that can go wrong.

But it's an interesting thought because BC sucks so bad at the run... but it's not something Hall will try to do.  He'll make sure he takes the run away.  He'll give 1 or 2 10Y runs up should BC pretend they have a run game and then shut it down.  That's his M.O.

The bigger question is do we take away the run and deep ball and force them to dink & dunk?  That's the usual Hall scheme.  We can't take away all 3: you generally have to give something up to shut down the other 2.  But BC proved they can 10Y pass you to death without missing a beat, all the while your D is getting gassed.

I expect Hall to give up the normal 10Y passes and wide outs on their side of the field.  But critically we must find a way to shut that down on our side of the field.  I'll be severely disappointed if we just let them 10Y march down the field every drive for VAJ to QB draw it into the EZ from 12Y out.  We have to change up our plan from our normal M.O.

As such I would expect a lot more man coverage than we usually see.  Or interesting zone/man combos.

The only other option is our O scores on every drive too.  But that might be asking too much, and is a dangerous scenario.

We are the better, and far more balanced team.  BC basically has the pass, with no run, bad KR, and a questionable D.  If we play steady, smart Bomber ball with some good twists by Hall/Buck then we are virtually guaranteed a win.  The harder job will be the following week vs TOR.

P.S. The best thing BC can do is suddenly have a #1 CFL run game appear out of their caboose and run it down our throats all night while we have no answer because we didn't prep for it.  Of course this would mean the entire BC reg season was a feint and trick.  That would be quite the feat.  However, it would virtually guarantee BC a win vs us, and they did spend their entire FA and season doing nothing but planning to beat WPG.

[TecnoGenius]

Hatcher is the main threat.  Rhymes has massively fallen off on production, maybe slower, maybe not reading holes as well, hands declining.  Hollins is probably the #2.  Don't sleep on McInnis: boy has he improved.  And Cottoy is sure-handed and so big you can't whack the ball out with a timing hit.

Put our best man on Hatcher.  And according to MOS, our best man is Nichols.

P.S. I find it interesting Campbell benched Lucky for the WSF.  Smart move.  I suspect that will continue.  Lucky is probably being cut in FA.  His lack of hands finally caught up with him.  And if he can't return anymore, he may not get a job anywhere.

[Waffler]

Whitehead will be 32 next year and reportedly makes 200k. I could see him somewhere else but it has to be for less money. He is not as durable as you'd like and his hands are not good. The other side of the coin is that he is just one season removed from 1,000+ yards. I see him as a bit of a "clout or an out" kind of guy, if I can borrow a baseball term. What he does bring is excitement and that would work in a market that needs to draw fans.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Whitehead will be 32 next year and reportedly makes 200k. I could see him somewhere else but it has to be for less money. He is not as durable as you'd like and his hands are not good. The other side of the coin is that he is just one season removed from 1,000+ yards. I see him as a bit of a "clout or an out" kind of guy, if I can borrow a baseball term. What he does bring is excitement and that would work in a market that needs to draw fans.

Yep, Whitehead is a Lions fan favourite but he's pretty lucky if they're paying him more than Nic Demski for what he's contributed, he's not in the top 10 receivers in the league in terms of ability. I could see him moving on unless he accepts his role as a sometimes guy at a lower salary but don't believe he would be a main guy on any team.  The Lions are deep at receiver and have the luxury of using the position as a ratio flex with Cottoy and McInnes, which is another reason Lucky isn't starting.

[The Zipp]

from ed tait:

Today
@Wpg_BlueBombers
practice: no sign of Dalton Schoen; Nic Demski was out here, but not in helmet.

[Blue In BC]

from ed tait:

Today
@Wpg_BlueBombers
practice: no sign of Dalton Schoen; Nic Demski was out here, but not in helmet.

It's a 3 practice + walk through week. Neither needs significant practice so I still have some hope both play and will get some reps later this week.

[3rdand1.5]

Apparently Tait also tweeted that Parker is in for Rose?