We need a Pass rush !!

[Blue In BC]

According to Blue in BC on the Bombers forum. Not according to a two-time winning Grey Cup head coach who is second all-time in Bombers head coach wins and was a HoF player.

Not that I really care but your comments approach a personal attack level. If you can't be part of an actual conversation then why bother responding at all?

There are a bunch of people asking and discussing this same topic.

We lost the game against the Redblacks. Posters commented that the DL was exhausted as one of the reasons for losing. Not the only one but an important one. Bighill looked gassed when Crum ran by him as an example.

Wear and tear is cumulative on players and rotation is important. Not only across the entire schedule but during each game. I hope we don't lose Jeffcoat or Jefferson for part of any game. However if we do, we'll see how that works out with the likes of Briggs, Cole or Jackson taking significantly more reps.

[Jesse]

Of course it would help. But there's an opportunity cost and that's where most people get crossed up because evaluating the difference between the benefit of more DL rotation verses a special teamer is really hard if you aren't a coach.

We're starting 10 LBs. This is getting ridiculous. Every other team has more bodies along the DL.

You want to talk about opportunity cost? Because we're apparently investing much more into our ST but not seing any results from it. Our ST continues to be a liability.

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Not that I really care but your comments approach a personal level. If you can't be part of an actual conversation then why bother responding at all?

There are a bunch of people asking and discussing this same topic.

We lost the game against the Redblacks. Posters commented that the DL was exhausted as one of the reasons for losing. Not the only one but an important one. Bighill looked gassed when Crum ran by him as an example.

Wear and tear is cumulative on players and rotation is important. Not only across the entire schedule but during each game. I hope we don't lose Jeffcoat or Jefferson for part of any game. However if we do, we'll see how that works out with the likes of Briggs, Cole or Jackson taking significantly more reps.

You provided an opinion as fact:

A player that rotates with a starter on the DL is going to see more reps and be more critical than an extra ST player

I am simply telling you that your "fact" is not universally shared and clearly the actual experts (our very successful coaches) disagree.

People look at a depth chart and notice the clunky stuff:

We have less people on the DL!
We have an American fullback!

But they don't appreciate that the trade-offs are probably worth it because they don't understand them. No one is saying that a rotation isn't important. But there is a calculated tradeoff happening here.

[Sir Blue and Gold]

We're starting 10 LBs. This is getting ridiculous. Every other team has more bodies along the DL.

You want to talk about opportunity cost? Because we're apparently investing much more into our ST but not seing any results from it. Our ST continues to be a liability.

If our ST is a weak spot do you think we should start more defensive ends and tackles? Or could we, just maybe, be asking our highly talented and paid defensive ends to shoulder more load while we try and straighten that out for the stretch run?

[pdirks67]

Tied for second.

Decided to omit that point since Toronto has had more byes than games so far this year. 

[theaardvark]

Pretty sure we chetah a lot, with LD's on the DL, even S on the line... 5 comes interior, 9 moves to DE... there is a lot of stuff happening along the dline...and Ritchie Hall has to scheme with the assets he's given.

I have no issues with how the roster sits at any time.  Each player has their purpose.

[Blue In BC]

You provided an opinion as fact:

I am simply telling you that your "fact" is not universally shared and clearly the actual experts (our very successful coaches) disagree.

People look at a depth chart and notice the clunky stuff:

We have less people on the DL!
We have an American fullback!

But they don't appreciate that the trade-offs are probably worth it because they don't understand them.

Posters are smarter than you give credit.

If we are to take anything / everything the coaches do as making total sense, then why do we need a discussion board.

As you see in the post below yours regarding ST's . If our DL becomes more dominant ( partially by keeping fresh rotation ) then possibly field position due to poor returns or poor coverage becomes less of an issue. Stopping opponents from longer drives off sets some ST problems.

We want our highly paid DE's to survive the season. Playing most snaps for 18 games is not a great recipe. Jeffcoat in particular has had a history of not playing an entire season.

I wonder if anyone has snap counts for our DL?

We just added Gauthier back this week and he'll improve our ST's.

In any case many feel our ST's are a problem in nearly all aspects. Returns, coverage and punting. Defaulting to O'Shea knows more is a pretty easy road to take.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Cole takes reps on D, watch the game and see. He's got 8 DT and a couple of forced fumbles. He's had pass knockdowns. Poor example.

Our defense was at its best when we have had 7-8 players rotating in on the dline. Jeffcoat has a long injury history. How comfortable would you be if he goes out and Bennett has to take all his snaps? What if Walker gets hurt and its just Lawson and Thomas taking snaps at DT?

Agreed, breaking Jefferson or Jeffcoat or wearing them out mid-season would be a costly mistake for the coaching staff to make. Key players have to be managed better to be in condition to perform their best for the playoffs, for example without a healthy Grant the Bombers stand much less chance of winning the G.C..

[Blue In BC]

Pretty sure we chetah a lot, with LD's on the DL, even S on the line... 5 comes interior, 9 moves to DE... there is a lot of stuff happening along the dline...and Ritchie Hall has to scheme with the assets he's given.

I have no issues with how the roster sits at any time.  Each player has their purpose.

Briggs purpose is to chase an opponent but not arrive in time. He's having a horrible season. Every time he's on the field for defence I expect a big play by the other team.

[Blue In BC]

Agreed, breaking Jefferson or Jeffcoat or wearing them out mid-season would be a costly mistake for the coaching staff to make. Key players have to be managed better to be in condition to perform their best for the playoffs, for example without Grant the Bombers stand much less chance of winning their 3 G.C..

+1 part 1 quote.

+1 part 2 quote.

I would also point out that when we had Haba, he dressed and was part of the DL rotation. Perhaps Fox or Garbutt are not as good a choice. If that's the case are we looking for alternatives on our PR or waiting for Haba to come off the IR? Or both?

By the way, when we had Haba, we didn't dress Jackson.  Haba had 9 DT's and 3 sacks in 6 games.

That is a FACT in support that a player that takes significant rotation on our DL is more important than an ST player in Jackson. Noting that O'Shea made both decisions. Which one was the most right? I don't know when Haba returns but I'd guess Jackson then comes off. Who is available at a given time comes into the equation. This may relate to the 2 DL on our PR not good enough or not ready enough at the moment.
It was
All of that would be fine if we saw Jackson making more of a contribution. How many times was he on the field in the last game? Would an extra DL have seen more reps as the alternative? It was and remains the question, regardless of whether Cole sees some reps as well.

[RebusRankin]

Doug Brown has questioned the lack of dlineman on the roster on multiple occasions on CJOB. Guess he doesn't count because he's not a very successful coach.

[Blue In BC]

Doug Brown has questioned the lack of dlineman on the roster on multiple occasions on CJOB. Guess he doesn't count because he's not a very successful coach.

Lol

[blue_gold_84]

Since when is Doug Brown an expert on coaching or roster decisions?

Decided to omit that point since Toronto has had more byes than games so far this year. 

Ah, that is a valid point.

[Jesse]

If our ST is a weak spot do you think we should start more defensive ends and tackles? Or could we, just maybe, be asking our highly talented and paid defensive ends to shoulder more load while we try and straighten that out for the stretch run?

I think rostering guys just to be special teamers is not working and not worth their roster spots.

So maybe, just maybe, we should ask our highly paid starters to take some snaps there as well.

Then we have the added bonus of rostering extra Dlineman so we reduce wear, tear, and injury risk to our very important starters. Might also slip in Parker for some depth in the secondary as well as a returner who doesn't bobble the ball every time he touches it.

[theaardvark]

So, rostering Castillo, Benson and Sheahan should be cut because they are "just special teamers".

Everyone else who plays on special teams contributes elsewhere.  Some as starters, others as backups.

Mr. Seal is not just a specail teamer.  He is a rotational FB, sometimes a TE, backup LS, and is naturally a DE.  Why they have slotted him in primarily on O, not sure.  Pretty straightforward duties I guess.  CFL DE is different than NCAA DE, fr sure, yard off the ball, etc... but I would like to see him get a shot at rotational DE...