Winnipeg Jets Discussion - 2023/2024 Season

Started by ModAdmin, August 15, 2023, 06:30:57 PM

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theaardvark

Quote from: Pigskin on May 29, 2024, 11:29:02 PMSorry, I was talking about Dillon, do you know what he's asking for?

We don't but I am sure Chevy does.  I know there was a lack of communication between Dillion and Chevy originally, have to wonder if the change in coaching might change the viewpoint from Chevy.
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_gold_84

#forthew
лава Україні!
What a wretched timeline.

dd

We need to spend some $$ on some solid D men. Schmidt and Pionk are minor leaguers and Stanley and Dillon aren't far behind. Morressey is the only legit D man I'd keep the others are either expendable or tradeble.

I'd keep Monaghan and tifolli sheiffle and Connor, Lowry and ehlers, won't be disappointed if all others are gone

blue_gold_84

Schmidt: nearly 700 NHL games played.
Pionk: nearly 500 NHL games played.
Dillon: nearly 900 NHL games played.

Three defensemen with nearly 2100 combined NHL games played who just played on the top defensive team of the 2023-24 season. But yeah, they're minor leaguers... LOL

The ignorant, incoherent gems from the usual suspects are always good for a morning chuckle.
#forthew
лава Україні!
What a wretched timeline.

theaardvark

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on June 03, 2024, 01:15:34 PMSchmidt: nearly 700 NHL games played.
Pionk: nearly 500 NHL games played.
Dillon: nearly 900 NHL games played.

Three defensemen with nearly 2100 combined NHL games played who just played on the top defensive team of the 2023-24 season. But yeah, they're minor leaguers... LOL

The ignorant, incoherent gems from the usual suspects are always good for a morning chuckle.

Pretty sure he means they are playing at a level that is more suited for the minor leagues.

And I pretty much agree.  Schmidt and Pionk have not been playing commensurate to $6mil contracts, for sure.

Dillion has played better and more consistent, but as you point out, 900 games is a lot of miles, he's not getting any younger.  I was originally disappointed that they did not prioritize his resigning, but upon reflection, we need to get younger...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: theaardvark on June 03, 2024, 02:19:20 PMPretty sure he means they are playing at a level that is more suited for the minor leagues.

I don't care what he means. It's still inaccurate to say, not to mention completely ignorant and disrespectful. One lousy playoff round where the entire team fell apart against a more playoff-seasoned opponent doesn't erase the successful results and accomplishments of a 82-game regular season.
#forthew
лава Україні!
What a wretched timeline.

theaardvark

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on June 03, 2024, 05:06:19 PMI don't care what he means. It's still inaccurate to say, not to mention completely ignorant and disrespectful. One lousy playoff round where the entire team fell apart against a more playoff-seasoned opponent doesn't erase the successful results and accomplishments of a 82-game regular season.

Schmidt is playing the worst hockey of his career, bad enough to be in the pressbox for a good part of the year on a team that was struggling defensively.

I loved Pionk just after the trade, but he too seem to be a cough up machine, and not playing his best game of late.

Dillon played well enough to a second pairing guy and was a great mentor to Samberg, but as the season wore on, and before his injury, it looked like father time was catching up.  I was all for resigning him thinking he was the same age as Demelo, I did not realize how old he is, actually 1/2 year older than Schmidt.

$16 mil tied up on those three players last year.  Saving 4mil on Dillon helps resign Demelo who will be getting a raise from the $3mil deal he's had for the last 4 years. 

Monahan should be welcomed back, hopefully in the $2-3mil range after signing for $2mil last year. 

Still have $3mil worth of Wheeler on the books for next year.  Buy out Schmidt would mean $2.7 this year and $1.6 next year, which is far better than $6mil this year.  Free's up $3.3 mil cap this year.

Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: theaardvark on June 03, 2024, 08:18:04 PMSchmidt is playing the worst hockey of his career, bad enough to be in the pressbox for a good part of the year on a team that was struggling defensively.

I loved Pionk just after the trade, but he too seem to be a cough up machine, and not playing his best game of late.

Dillon played well enough to a second pairing guy and was a great mentor to Samberg, but as the season wore on, and before his injury, it looked like father time was catching up.  I was all for resigning him thinking he was the same age as Demelo, I did not realize how old he is, actually 1/2 year older than Schmidt.

Ugh. Not this again.

So, just to paraphrase:
Schmidt's 2023-24 season was the worst of his career. [CITATION MISSING, UNAVAILABLE]
Pionk is a "coughup machine" who hasn't played his best lately*. [CITATION MISSING, UNAVAILABLE]
Dillon is an old man who can't keep up**. [CITATION MISSING, UNAVAILABLE]

* by lately, does that mean the first round?
** he was doing just fine until his freak hand injury

The suggestion that the team should buy out at least one blue liner without adequate replacement or at least attempting a trade is beyond short-sighted; it would immediately weaken a roster that currently has only four NHL-calibre defensemen under contract.

There are options to explore before making a reactionary suggestion like the team buying out a piece or pieces of an already thin blue line.

The best part is how you present no numbers (outside of contract money), statistics, or data to substantiate any of that nonsense above. This is the same incorrigible, conjecture-filled stuff you've been doing in these Jets threads for at least a few years now.
#forthew
лава Україні!
What a wretched timeline.

theaardvark

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on June 03, 2024, 08:52:18 PMUgh. Not this again.

So, just to paraphrase:
Schmidt's 2023-24 season was the worst of his career. [CITATION MISSING, UNAVAILABLE]
Pionk is a "coughup machine" who hasn't played his best lately*. [CITATION MISSING, UNAVAILABLE]
Dillon is an old man who can't keep up**. [CITATION MISSING, UNAVAILABLE]

* by lately, does that mean the first round?
** he was doing just fine until his freak hand injury

The suggestion that the team should buy out at least one blue liner without adequate replacement or at least attempting a trade is beyond short-sighted; it would immediately weaken a roster that currently has only four NHL-calibre defensemen under contract.

There are options to explore before making a reactionary suggestion like the team buying out a piece or pieces of an already thin blue line.

The best part is how you present no numbers (outside of contract money), statistics, or data to substantiate any of that nonsense above. This is the same incorrigible, conjecture-filled stuff you've been doing in these Jets threads for at least a few years now.

How many prospect D do we have, and when are we expecting them to level up?

We expect Ehlers to be traded with a top 4 D coming back. If we resign Demelo, then:

Morrisey, Demelo
Samburg, Ehlers trade

Bottom pair /  of your choice of Stanley, Copabianco, Salmonnson, Heinola, or even an easy to afford FA signing or two.

Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_gold_84

#954
Quote from: theaardvark on June 05, 2024, 01:11:49 AMHow many prospect D do we have, and when are we expecting them to level up?

Do you expect me to answer this question? I'm working with the same outsider information as any other fan.

Quote from: theaardvark on June 05, 2024, 01:11:49 AMWe expect Ehlers to be traded with a top 4 D coming back. If we resign DeMelo, then:

Morrissey, DeMelo
Samberg, Ehlers trade

Bottom pair /  of your choice of Stanley, Capobianco, Salomonsson, Heinola, or even an easy to afford FA signing or two.

We can't assume anything trade-wise at this stage. So, trying to build a six-man blue line corps based on that is risky and reckless.

And none of those three bolded have proven they're NHL ready just yet.
#forthew
лава Україні!
What a wretched timeline.

Pigskin

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on June 05, 2024, 01:28:45 PMDo you expect me to answer this question? I'm working with the same outsider information as any other fan.

We can't assume anything trade-wise at this stage. So, trying to build a six-man blue line corps based on that is risky and reckless.

And none of those three bolded have proven they're NHL ready just yet.

Agree, and we have to sign Cap and Heinola before we can start penciling them in.
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

theaardvark

Quote from: blue_gold_84 on June 05, 2024, 01:28:45 PMDo you expect me to answer this question? I'm working with the same outsider information as any other fan.

We can't assume anything trade-wise at this stage. So, trying to build a six-man blue line corps based on that is risky and reckless.

And none of those three bolded have proven they're NHL ready just yet.

Quote from: Pigskin on June 05, 2024, 05:08:01 PMAgree, and we have to sign Cap and Heinola before we can start penciling them in.


Capabianco has had a cup of coffee in the NHL and was an all star in the I.  Heinola as well.  Signing them will not be costly.

Like I said, if not them, there are plenty of third pairing D that will cost us less in FA than the saving we get from buying out Schmidt/Pionk and probably improve the play.  And if any of our present guys manage to win a spot, even better.

Our D is going to centre on Morrissey, Demelo and Samberg.  And if you get a top 2 or 4 Dman back for Ehlers, you have a solid top 4.  Third pairing/7th man should not include $12mil in Pionk/Schmidt.

Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Pigskin

#957
Quote from: theaardvark on June 05, 2024, 06:51:55 PMCapabianco has had a cup of coffee in the NHL and was an all star in the I.  Heinola as well.  Signing them will not be costly.

Like I said, if not them, there are plenty of third pairing D that will cost us less in FA than the saving we get from buying out Schmidt/Pionk and probably improve the play.  And if any of our present guys manage to win a spot, even better.

Our D is going to centre on Morrissey, Demelo and Samberg.  And if you get a top 2 or 4 Dman back for Ehlers, you have a solid top 4.  Third pairing/7th man should not include $12mil in Pionk/Schmidt.



Right now all we have for sure is Morrissey, Samberg,  Pionk, and Schmidt. No one else is signed. 
Don't go through life looking in the rearview mirror.

blue_gold_84

Quote from: theaardvark on June 05, 2024, 06:51:55 PMLike I said, if not them, there are plenty of third pairing D that will cost us less in FA than the saving we get from buying out Schmidt/Pionk and probably improve the play.  And if any of our present guys manage to win a spot, even better.

Name some, then. This half-baked buyout proposal is your idea after all.

And "probably improve the play" is nothing more than useless conjecture.

The Jets were the best defensive team in the NHL this past season. I can only surmise you didn't pay enough attention during that time or you're fixating on the first round loss to the Avs. In either case, it's not a reasonable approach.
You've singled out two players for a team's failures*, which is reminiscent of two years ago when Scheifele and Wheeler were on your "Jets I Irrationally Dislike" list.

* which occurred in the playoffs

Quote from: theaardvark on June 05, 2024, 06:51:55 PMOur D is going to centre on Morrissey, Demelo and Samberg.  And if you get a top 2 or 4 Dman back for Ehlers, you have a solid top 4.  Third pairing/7th man should not include $12mil in Pionk/Schmidt.

DeMelo remains unsigned. I hope he sticks around, but you don't "centre" a defense corps around 2-3 players without adequate depth, and even less so around ifs or trades that haven't yet come to pass.
#forthew
лава Україні!
What a wretched timeline.

theaardvark

There is rational behind the players you call :Jets I irrationally dislike".

No one on this forum can deny MS55 in 2023-24 is NOT the MS55 we saw in 2022-23.  There was rationale for my dislike. This year, with his return to form, I like MS55 and am very glad we signed him long term. Not sure if it was in his headspace, or if BW26 moving on had anything to do with it, but he is a welcome leader on this team now.

Buying out BW26 was a move no one on this forum can dispute was a good move.  His time here was over, and his year in New York proves it was the right move.  Not denegrating his career here, he was a true Jet and a leader through tough times, but it is a business, and he was no longer an asset.  It was a good move to pay him NOT to play here.

I can't see buying out both Schmidt and Pionk.  I can wish for it, but its not going to happen.  But one will have value somewhere else, maybe packaged into the Ehlers deal and eating some of the cap hit.  As long as that cap hit retention does not exceed the cost of buying him out.

So buy one out, trade one and use the savings to pick up one journeyman D.  I don't know the rest of the league, but there will be guys available who might want to spend their last year on a contender.  Guys that will play as good or better than Schmidt/Pionk at half the cost. Guys that the rest of the bench won't look up at the press box and see a guy sitting there and think "We're paying him $6 million to sit up there?"

I am sure there are D men out there coming off their "last big contract" like Myers that still want to play and will sign for a fraction of the $6 mil Schmidt and Pionk are making, and give us everything Schmidt did last year.  And let one or two of our young D get a chance to develop to the next level before we lose more of them to organizations who will give them a chance.  Kovacevic would look decent in a Jets uniform right now...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.