Official Game Day Thread - Winnipeg vs Toronto Grey Cup November 20, 2022

[Horseman]

I want to give credit to Dave Foxgrove and his entire reffing crew in the GC game. They did a tremendous job as there were no iffy calls, all the penalties called were correct and fair, there was not one call that made anyone question it. Congrats to them for the great job. Plus, after sleeping on the game, I have to say Tor was the slightly better team yesterday and earned that win, congrats to the Argos. For the Bombers, flush the result and start working now for next year.

[Foxhound]

I'm worried. The Toronto Argonauts have never lost a Grey Cup Game to the Winnipeg Blue Bombers:

11 December 1937 - Winnipeg 3 at Toronto 4
10 December 1938 - Winnipeg 7 at Toronto 30
1 December 1945 - Winnipeg 0 at Toronto 35
30 November 1946 - Winnipeg 6 at Toronto 28
29 November 1947 - Winnipeg 9 at Toronto 10
25 November 1950 - Winnipeg 0 at Toronto 13

But the Argonauts this year won't have home field advantage. Will this be the critical factor jeopardizing their win streak?

So the Bombers had to wait a whopping 72 years for a chance to make it right and what did they do?

20 November 2022 - Winnipeg 23 Toronto 24 at Regina

They made it worse despite the change of venue!



Face it. The Argos have the number of the Bombers at Grey Cup time. When they want to win the Cup, it's the Bombers that they call.

Either that or just too many Bomber fans got too deep into the cups and lost focus on the only Cup that truly mattered:

Focus! That's going to be the key. I want all Blue Bomber fans to be fully focused on the game rather than being passed out drunk in some snowbank. So stay off the sauce.

Sad.

[dd]

I want to give credit to Dave Foxgrove and his entire reffing crew in the GC game. They did a tremendous job as there were no iffy calls, all the penalties called were correct and fair, there was not one call that made anyone question it. Congrats to them for the great job. Plus, after sleeping on the game, I have to say Tor was the slightly better team yesterday and earned that win, congrats to the Argos. For the Bombers, flush the result and start working now for next year.

There?s nothing like the sting of defeat to motivate you. 2023 will be our year

[bomb squad]

I want to give credit to Dave Foxgrove and his entire reffing crew in the GC game. They did a tremendous job as there were no iffy calls, all the penalties called were correct and fair, there was not one call that made anyone question it. Congrats to them for the great job. Plus, after sleeping on the game, I have to say Tor was the slightly better team yesterday and earned that win, congrats to the Argos. For the Bombers, flush the result and start working now for next year.

They did earn the win. They even lost their starting qb for the final quarter but still managed to win it with their greenhorn backup. And it's not like they snuck up on everybody. They had a solid year.

Totally agree on the reffing too.

[theaardvark]

They did earn the win. They even lost their starting qb for the final quarter but still managed to win it with their greenhorn backup. And it's not like they snuck up on everybody. They had a solid year.

Totally agree on the reffing too.

Not sure "losing their starting QB was a negative...  fresh legs, more dynamic (but until then unproven) QB that we had no film on... nor had probably practiced for... I think the QB change actually gave them the win.  We had MBT figured out and pinned down most of the game...

But getting the "W", regardless of how, is earning it...

[wpg#1]

The empty seats at the game was an embarrassment rider fans. Seriously, there were a lots of empty seats because disgruntled rider fans wanted to make a point to management. It was horrible. That?s all I can say !

[dd]

I don't know.If they were making a point to management. I think they thought that riders were going to be in the grey cup and couldn't unload their.tickets

[theaardvark]

Lots of empty seats, just as many on Stubhub at face plus the weeks before... I don't think there were many "walk ups" for a frigid GC game. 

What is surprising is that after not being able to sell them, they did not use them.  After tossing $400+ away, why not just go? 

I don't think paying for tickets and then not using them is a signal being sent to the team...

[wpg#1]

Lots of empty seats, just as many on Stubhub at face plus the weeks before... I don't think there were many "walk ups" for a frigid GC game. 

What is surprising is that after not being able to sell them, they did not use them.  After tossing $400+ away, why not just go? 

I don't think paying for tickets and then not using them is a signal being sent to the team...

It was sold out. They tried to re-sell their tickets, and since they couldn't they just didn't show up. There were a few tickets for sale that weren't re-sell during the weeks leading up to the game, but the stadium was essentially sold out.
They just stayed home and watched the game. They call themselves the best fans, and yet they stayed home on a day that was not all that cold. I was there !

[TecnoGenius]

I didn't get a chance, due to all the travel and then a big work week, to do my rewatch(es) and big play breakdown of the GC game until now.  Ya, and a little bit of "don't want to watch it again" feelings, too.  But I did, and there's lots that stands out.  It was actually a game of surprising plays, and even a lot of good stuff from our team.  Here's my final breakdown:

2Q9:15 Ellingson clutch 2nd down conversion on the too-many-men-TOR play: this is some superb coaching and execution: watch the replay, Ellingson goes scramble rules but they've pre-planned that he'll fake going deep and Ellingson goes completely blind and the instant he turns to look at Zach the ball is on its way for the falling-rail pass.  We didn't see that in-season, this was something new, and it was beautiful.

2Q1:06 Demski 15 yards on 1st down with half YAC and beats Muamba and many others in the open field.  Great play design and call, and superb execution by Demski.  Best O play of the game?  These are the plays we needed all night, and mostly didn't get.

3Q10:15 Zach magic with 6 on 6 and pressure city and great scramble-awareness by Schoen.  Best Zach play of the game.  But even though it's fun, it's a product of a bad O scheme, poor OL protection, and no heat outlet for Zach.

3Q5:38 Brady's best run of the night on the draw.  Another great one at 4Q8:08 on 2nd&4.

3Q0:00 Clements plus Sayles make the huge 2nd&2 stop on AH.  Best defensive play of the game?  That's one hard stop to make.

4Q14:50 Might be Grant's best return TD ever, Argos left and right, real close in, dodging them all like they're standing still, working the perfect path through, where a slight miscalculation gets him tackled.

4Q13:22 Another great Sayles play stuffing AJ at the LoS, otherwise it's a big AJ romp.  Beautiful block-shedding a square tackle.

4Q11:26 Prukop throwing an INT: horrific decision by Prukop.  I'm pretty sure he has the mandate to run unless the WR is wide open.  Instead he throws into what's effectively double coverage, and he horribly underthrows because he doesn't have an arm like Zach.  If he puts 5 more yards on that, our guy has a step and catches it over his shoulder and it might be a TD.  I would say blame Buck, but I'm sure Prukop was under strict instructions to be smart.

4Q6:11 Pretty sure that blindside block by TOR on Cadwallader during Leake's big return is a foul.  Forceful hit back to Argo deadline.  Seems to have rattled his brains, too.  The game starts to fall apart.  You notice who saved the day again?  Gauthier: the king of the kick return saves.  Dude always anticipates an escape and picks the perfect angle.  In any event, we didn't take Leake seriously and he burned us with our awful lane setup.  To think that Parker was thaaaaat close to stopping him at zero yards.

4Q5:52 Willie has to do his once-a-game offsides.  To be fair, I watched the frames and that RT was starting to lean back at exactly the same time, but his movement wasn't enough to trigger an IP before Willy was deep enough.  I feel Willie may have been suckered there.  However, he needs to be more aware and watch the ball, not the RT.

4Q5:37 Kelly's game-winning run for 19.  If Willie hadn't taken the offsides then he likely doesn't make a first down, but who knows.  Biggie and whatever DBs were free were playing too far back expecting a pass. Clements was the spy for AJ, so I don't blame him.  But we all know Kelly is a young, running QB so why aren't we spying him?  Why did we have Biggie vacate like that on a running QB?

4Q3:44 Why is only Parker tasked with sealing the edge on AJ's TD?  What is Hall doing with our LBs? Everyone knows it's a run play on 1st and we stuff the box for a gap run with no contain?  Heck, Kelly could have probably run that himself.  Embarrassing breakdown at every level.

4Q2:58 Zach's INT: he didn't see Muamba drop back.  Not sure TOR ever used that scheme before so Zach probably thought (because of film study) no one would be there.  Zach gets tricked every once in a while, and this was a bad time to get tricked.  However, in a GC he needs to make those reads and spot what the MIKE is doing.  Not like Muamba is a lithe, skinny wallflower that can go unnoticed.  And why are we going for a 22 yard pass on 1st&10 with 3 minutes to go?  Tons of time to play Bomber ball, and TOR was giving up a ton of space for the under passes.

4Q2:07 Nick Hallett's FG block is sublime.  He almost had it on the previous PAT.  He had 1/10s longer this time, or he was 1/10s faster, and he gives us the extra life we don't deserve.  Just like we play "Leggs looked wide left" on his blocked kick, Bede looked wide right on his.  Maybe you can't tell squat about "wide" on these blocks.  Might just be optical illusions.

4Q0:56 Zach's pass knocked down by Edwards.  This was a critical play and we severely botch it.  Buck doesn't think Brady can get us 4 (we can sneak for the extra 1) if we put the heavy package in?  We're already in FG range.  Why not run it?  Ok, so you're passing now, why is Zach staring down intended Demski? TOR obviously has film studied our hot route and we have nothing in the bag of tricks to mix things up? Greg was more open with less heat on that side, but he's crossing at 10 yards out when we only need 5.  If he routes out 10 then hustles back for a quick pass to make 5, we have 1st down.  Also, Zach could have pump-faked the jumpers.  Or why not go deep there?  It's cover zero, man coverage, Zach's favorite.  Why not do a corner or post to Schoen or Demski?  So many things here and we go for the easily defended play and TOR showed us the box-heavy look so we knew there was contain that could pass-knockdown.  If anyone is to blame here, it's Buck.

4Q0:52 Blocked FG.  This is 100% on Boudreau and Sayles.  This FG must be made or we lose the game.  There is no concern whatsoever for stopping Banks from returning.  We must make a FG or rouge.  So why do we have 5 OL in and then Sayles off the LT?  Sayles!?  We dressed 7 hoggies.  Why don't we have Dobson on that left side making sure no one gets through.  What does Sayles know about stopping kick-rushers?  Who decided this formation?  Heads should roll.  If a real hoggie is off Bryant's left arm, we make that FG.

To make matters worse, Sayles is the slowest off his mark on the snap, and he thinks he needs to block some imaginary ghost to his left and tries to arm-bar the massive DL who is putting his whole life in that one moment.  All the other hoggies are blocking the correct guys, and doing it well, because TOR overloaded the left side.

[TecnoGenius]

Techno Overview:

It was a sloppy game by both sides.  Yes, it was a lot colder than the thermometer said (I was there).  But nearly everything we saw was lacklustre.

TOR out-physicalled us, out coached us, out playcalled us, out-hungered us, out LoS'd us.  Not by a ton, but by enough that they got a few extra downs, a few extra yards, a few extra defensive stops, a few extra knockdowns and INTs than we did.  I don't think they were the better team, but they were the better team that day.

If Bede had made more FGs (missing 3!) and TOR had taken less penalties, they would have creamed us.  We really played that poorly compared to them.

The game was even on "breaks" and "luck".  Every time we got a gimmee, they'd get a similar one later. Every time someone scored, the other would score back.  No one ever really pulled ahead and put their stamp on the game.

All of WPG's worst fears almost came to pass: that the GC would be decided on a Leggs FG.  Perhaps it's better that we'll never know if that FG was going to go in.  In my heart, I think he makes it (flags were blowing to the right at that moment, so any slight-left would be correct).  And then our D may have gotten a 45s stop if they learned to account for the running QB.

But after a complete rewatch I realize that it was our coaches and coordinators that let us down.  Buck was very vanilla (ex-the Prukop pass) and not making good decisions.  Hall didn't prep our guys for the possibility of Kelly, and had horrible schemes on the AJ TDs.  Letting teams run in TDs on us in the post-season?  Unheard of.  We don't do that.  Make 'em pass it.  Boudreau's bad scheme on the final gasp was the final nail in the coffin.  How much all of this was due to input on MOS, who knows.  But the buck stops with him.

As for Leggs, you can't blame him.  The other kicker blew 9 points, I think all 3 from 36?  That's basically the same as PAT distance.  Leggs blew 2 PAT plus the blocked FG. This isn't on Leggs.  Even if we went to OT, 50/50 chance TOR pulls it out anyway.

The saving grace is this may go down as a "classic" GC.  Sitting back and trying to detach yourself as a WPG fan, you can see how that 4th Q was wild, exciting, nail-biting, and very entertaining.  TOR fans (all 16 of them) must be ecstatic and will watch this as many times as I did the 2019 GC.  So in that sense I'm glad for the CFL.  But it is painful as we sleep-walked our way to the big sure-thing threepeat.

Now I look forward to revenge in 2023.

[Lincoln Locomotive]

Thanks Techno....agree with pretty every thing you posted there.   I also thought the turning point was Kelly coming in because MBT wasn't having a great game and was his inconsistent self.....Kelly comes in and moves the ball.    We had no film on him whatsoever and he took advantage of it.   Also didn't help that JJ was out to help contain him either.  Toronto seemed to be finding ways to keep us in the game and yet we allowed them to block a game winning field goal to end the game!
   
I agree I think we should have run the ball on that 2nd and a sort 5.    It would likely have gotten us closer even if we didn't make it and then there's always Prukop to come in on a third down short yardage play.....which we've made all season.   That would have also used up most of the clock and allowed us to kick with only seconds on the clock.    Perhaps we needed to be more patient there and trust in what had been successful all season.   

For the sake of argument lets say we make that kick and go up by 2....there's still 44 seconds on the clock and plenty of time for the Argos to counter with their own FG shot.....

However.....it didn't happen and yes Toronto was the better team on this day as were their coaches.   They made two plays more than we did with the pass knockdown AND the blocked FG back to back.