Illegal low block

Started by TecnoGenius, June 25, 2022, 11:05:33 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

TecnoGenius

3Q8:13 some HAM D upends Gray with a low block to his knees.  Gray is beyond the LoS.  Play is a screen behind LoS.

Ref calls "illegal low block".  Suits says "cut block".  Penalty is 10 yards.

Looking at the rules, I'm not sure what the foul was, or if it even was a foul.

(2019 rule book)
Section 2, Article 9 "cut block" doesn't apply because it wasn't "in a backfield position", wasn't on a "kick return play" and Gray almost certainly wasn't a "potential pass receiver on the LoS".

Article 12 Blocking Below the Waist doesn't apply because that is only for kicks.

Not Article 8 Chop Blocking because Gray wasn't "engaged".

Maybe Article 6 Clipping?  The hit was slightly "in the back plane", but only by 10 or 20 degrees.  But (c) should apply which makes this a non-foul.  "Shall not be called if... (c) The opponent could see the blocker approaching and deliberately turned the body in order to be contacted from behind".  Gray swivelled his hips to avoid the hit when he saw it coming.

I think they got it wrong.  I think it's a non-foul?

I'd hate to be a ref trying to decipher and apply Article 6 Clipping on the fly.  Talk about a quagmire.  I think they got 6 right except forgot about (c).

We got lucky as that kept the drive alive.  Shame on Orlando on not knowing the rulebook well enough to moan to the refs.
Never go full Rider!

Stats Junkie

Good call

Quote from: 2022 Rule BookArticle 4 - Illegal Block
It shall be illegal for a player of either team to block an opponent below the waist except when the block occurs in an area between the tight ends or tight end position, within 2 yards of the defensive side of the line of scrimmage extending back to the initial position of the quarterback or kicker. A player initiating a block below the waist in this area must be positioned in this zone at the snap of the ball for the block to be legal.
PENALTY: L10

NOTE: If such an illegal low block also meets the criteria for an Unnecessary Roughness penalty such as but not limited to Clipping, Blocking Below the Waist, Crackback Blocking, Chop Blocking, Cut Blocking or Peel Back Blocking the player shall be penalized only for the Unnecessary Roughness penalty.
Twitter: @Stats_Junkie
Threads: statsjunkie71

dd

Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 25, 2022, 11:05:33 PM
3Q8:13 some HAM D upends Gray with a low block to his knees.  Gray is beyond the LoS.  Play is a screen behind LoS.

Ref calls "illegal low block".  Suits says "cut block".  Penalty is 10 yards.

Looking at the rules, I'm not sure what the foul was, or if it even was a foul.

(2019 rule book)
Section 2, Article 9 "cut block" doesn't apply because it wasn't "in a backfield position", wasn't on a "kick return play" and Gray almost certainly wasn't a "potential pass receiver on the LoS".

Article 12 Blocking Below the Waist doesn't apply because that is only for kicks.

Not Article 8 Chop Blocking because Gray wasn't "engaged".

Maybe Article 6 Clipping?  The hit was slightly "in the back plane", but only by 10 or 20 degrees.  But (c) should apply which makes this a non-foul.  "Shall not be called if... (c) The opponent could see the blocker approaching and deliberately turned the body in order to be contacted from behind".  Gray swivelled his hips to avoid the hit when he saw it coming.

I think they got it wrong.  I think it's a non-foul?

I'd hate to be a ref trying to decipher and apply Article 6 Clipping on the fly.  Talk about a quagmire.  I think they got 6 right except forgot about (c).

We got lucky as that kept the drive alive.  Shame on Orlando on not knowing the rulebook well enough to moan to the refs.

You cannot hit a player below the knees outside the close line play area. It was a low hit and rightfully should be called as they will blow guys knees out. To me, it should be a major foul, given the danger to the players knees, but as is, is a 10 yd penalty.

TecnoGenius

Thanks Stats!  I was looking in the wrong Rule section.

You found it in:
Rule 4 Scrimmage, Section 3 Interference

I was looking in:
Rule 7 Fouls & Penalties, Section 2 Major Fouls

I have one problem with using R4 S3 A4 though: article 1 there says the "general definition" is "Interference takes place when a player obstructs, blocks, screens or charges towards an opponent... in such a manner that prevents the opponent's approach to the ball carrier... or ball."

If the general definition of interference in A1 applies to the specific A4 Illegal Block portion, then what we saw with Gray does not apply.  No one was stopping Gray from getting to the ball carrier.  Gray was the one doing the blocking.  The HAM guy was just trying to get through to the carrier and/or knock Gray out of the equation.  Gray was not moving towards the carrier, and thus not prevented from moving towards the carrier.

If A4 stands on an island, separate from the general definition in A1, then yes, it would apply in this situation.  And yes, that would mean any time any player on any side hits below the wiast outside "the box" it's a foul.

It's not something you often see.  I recall it maybe once before in the last 4 years?

I fully understand why it might be or should be illegal, like dd says, blowing out knees.  But, as usual, the rulebook is convoluted.  If your guys read of it is right, then the ref did properly recognize both rules and did apply (c) to exclude the hit from being a 15-yarder!

Thanks again for finding the correct section in the rulebook.  I knew there had to be more there!
Never go full Rider!