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Author Topic: Official Game Day Thread - Ottawa at Winnipeg, June 10, 2022  (Read 8121 times)
PloenFan
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« Reply #210 on: June 19, 2022, 07:16:40 PM »

On the play where Collaros ran for a first down, took a head shot from the Ottawa player, and was removed from the game by the league injury spotter,
do we know why there was no penalty call on the Ottawa player ?  According to the CFL play by play, the next play was a procedure call on us, but there doesn't seem to be any record of a penalty against Ottawa.

https://www.bluebombers.com/games/6212/ottawa-redblacks-vs-winnipeg-blue-bombers/#playbyplay

134      2   10   W33   Rush   (01:39) Z. COLLAROS Run (10 yds), Tackle: F. GRIFFIN, Collaros removed by injury spotter   17   16
135      1   10   W43   N/A   (01:33) Penalty: Procedure, General called on Winnipeg (J. HARDRICK) (5 yds.) - No Play   17   16

https://cfldb.ca/rulebook/fouls-and-penalties/major-fouls/

According to the CFL rules:
Article 4 ? Unnecessary Roughness
A player shall be penalized for any act of unnecessary roughness against an opponent, including but not limited to:

Piling by a player who, in an unnecessarily rough manner, falls upon the ball carrier after the play has been terminated. Any player in possession of the ball, who falls to the ground without contact and is not attempting to advance the ball, may only be touched down and may not be contacted in any other manner,
Contacting an opponent Out of Bounds in an unnecessarily rough manner,
Contacting the passer in an unnecessarily rough manner (see Rule 7, Section 2, Article 4),
Unnecessary roughness against the punter, kicker or the ball holder on a place kick,
Grasping an opponent's face guard,
Using the helmet as the initial or primary point of contact to butt, ram, spear, or deliver a blow to an opponent who is in a vulnerable position, including but not limited to, a passer, a receiver in the act of catching a pass, a ball carrier in the grasp of another tackler or a ball carrier on the playing surface not attempting to advance,
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TBURGESS
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« Reply #211 on: June 19, 2022, 09:46:24 PM »

The blow wasn't helmet to helmet and Collaros was still attempting to advance by sliding helmet first.

However... (g) Delivering a blow to an opponent in the neck or head is also part of the unnecessary roughness rule, so it could have been called.

I noticed in our last game that we punched a player in the helmet to force him out of bounds. No penalty. We also grabbed a facemask bringing a player down and no penalty.

In last nights game a DB lit up a receiver and he definitely hit him in the head with his shoulder. No penalty.

The league needs definitive, binary calls for UR. Either call everything in the rule book or change the rules.
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Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.
DM83
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« Reply #212 on: June 19, 2022, 10:48:39 PM »

It's a stupid poorly written and interpreted rule.
Inconsistent at best.

Change to " initial primary contact with the front of the helmut against a defenceless player is A personal Foul."
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TecnoGenius
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« Reply #213 on: June 20, 2022, 02:07:57 AM »

In last nights game a DB lit up a receiver and he definitely hit him in the head with his shoulder. No penalty.

The league needs definitive, binary calls for UR. Either call everything in the rule book or change the rules.

Adeleke laid the wood on that receiver.  We had a play like that last season where I think Alexander lit up Begelton mid-flight and spun him around and we got 15-yarded for that.  I think it's because Begelton writhed around on the turf for a good while.  The Alexander hit was far cleaner than the Adeleke hit -- no head involved at all.

I hate to say it, but all O players need to be coached on how to writhe around when they take a big whack.  Free 15 yards.  But of course, they have to come out for 3 plays if they writhe too long.

CFL has started calling it based on the apparent injury (like they are doing for RTP).  I think that's just stupid because they it becomes a writhing contest.  Once the flag is thrown they get up and are perfectly fine (re: Fajardo).

Yes, they need more consistency and better written rules.  Otherwise the rule basically becomes "no savage hit".  And the DBs/FSs for sure know when they are going to lay a savage hit.
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Never go full Rider!
dd
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« Reply #214 on: June 20, 2022, 02:20:10 AM »

The blow wasn't helmet to helmet and Collaros was still attempting to advance by sliding helmet first.

However... (g) Delivering a blow to an opponent in the neck or head is also part of the unnecessary roughness rule, so it could have been called.

I noticed in our last game that we punched a player in the helmet to force him out of bounds. No penalty. We also grabbed a facemask bringing a player down and no penalty.

In last nights game a DB lit up a receiver and he definitely hit him in the head with his shoulder. No penalty.

The league needs definitive, binary calls for UR. Either call everything in the rule book or change the rules.
The league needs better, more consistent officiating period. In addition to the above examples of poor officiating, how about the number of receivers on a waggle are offside, it?s ridiculous!! I was taught to establish the neutral zone with your feet, focus on the nose of the ball, and if a reciever obstructs your sight line to the ball, they are offside. Not sure what the  linesmen or linewoman are watching, but they are missing a ton of offsides and it?s embarassing
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gordo
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« Reply #215 on: June 20, 2022, 02:35:21 AM »

On the play where Collaros ran for a first down, took a head shot from the Ottawa player, and was removed from the game by the league injury spotter,
do we know why there was no penalty call on the Ottawa player ?  According to the CFL play by play, the next play was a procedure call on us, but there doesn't seem to be any record of a penalty against Ottawa.

https://www.bluebombers.com/games/6212/ottawa-redblacks-vs-winnipeg-blue-bombers/#playbyplay

134      2   10   W33   Rush   (01:39) Z. COLLAROS Run (10 yds), Tackle: F. GRIFFIN, Collaros removed by injury spotter   17   16
135      1   10   W43   N/A   (01:33) Penalty: Procedure, General called on Winnipeg (J. HARDRICK) (5 yds.) - No Play   17   16

https://cfldb.ca/rulebook/fouls-and-penalties/major-fouls/

According to the CFL rules:
Article 4 ? Unnecessary Roughness
A player shall be penalized for any act of unnecessary roughness against an opponent, including but not limited to:

Piling by a player who, in an unnecessarily rough manner, falls upon the ball carrier after the play has been terminated. Any player in possession of the ball, who falls to the ground without contact and is not attempting to advance the ball, may only be touched down and may not be contacted in any other manner,
Contacting an opponent Out of Bounds in an unnecessarily rough manner,
Contacting the passer in an unnecessarily rough manner (see Rule 7, Section 2, Article 4),
Unnecessary roughness against the punter, kicker or the ball holder on a place kick,
Grasping an opponent's face guard,
Using the helmet as the initial or primary point of contact to butt, ram, spear, or deliver a blow to an opponent who is in a vulnerable position, including but not limited to, a passer, a receiver in the act of catching a pass, a ball carrier in the grasp of another tackler or a ball carrier on the playing surface not attempting to advance,

Your yellow highlighted bit didn't happen on that play.  No penalty.
If a guy gets his bell rung and spotters pull him out it doesn't necessarily mean there was a penalty on the play.

Bigger issue is Zach needs to run more intelligently if at all.  But that was debated already after game 1. 
Did you notice we played game 2 already?   Grin Cool
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DM83
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« Reply #216 on: June 20, 2022, 03:38:33 PM »

Zac makes us win!  However, I am really concerned about his safety.
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Throw Long Bannatyne
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« Reply #217 on: June 20, 2022, 04:19:52 PM »

Adeleke laid the wood on that receiver.  We had a play like that last season where I think Alexander lit up Begelton mid-flight and spun him around and we got 15-yarded for that.  I think it's because Begelton writhed around on the turf for a good while.  The Alexander hit was far cleaner than the Adeleke hit -- no head involved at all.

I hate to say it, but all O players need to be coached on how to writhe around when they take a big whack.  Free 15 yards.  But of course, they have to come out for 3 plays if they writhe too long.

CFL has started calling it based on the apparent injury (like they are doing for RTP).  I think that's just stupid because they it becomes a writhing contest.  Once the flag is thrown they get up and are perfectly fine (re: Fajardo).

Yes, they need more consistency and better written rules.  Otherwise the rule basically becomes "no savage hit".  And the DBs/FSs for sure know when they are going to lay a savage hit.

I think the issue with a few of B.A.'s clean hits last season was that he used excessive force, much like Loffler used to.  Destroying a receiver in a vulnerable position is no longer going to be allowed, no matter how clean the contact, it's going to draw a flag.
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Pete
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Posts: 322


« Reply #218 on: June 20, 2022, 06:02:56 PM »

Based on the success of the Bombers defence last year, teams are trying to ramp up their physicallity. My issue isnt with the solid one on one hits.. its with the second and third player coming in with eccessive force when the offensive player is alreay on his way down. I think that results in more injuries that the one on one.
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