CBA negotiations

Started by theaardvark, May 06, 2022, 02:56:55 PM

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Blue In BC

I still think the nationalized Americans was a bad idea. I'm anti ratio but this isn't going to get those nationalized players on the field or reduce turnover.

My preference was always to just add 2 more DI's for depth behind starting imports. The net result of that would be to eliminate 2 Canadians from the roster.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Jesse

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on May 24, 2022, 02:01:06 PM
You are right. He did JUST move here. But he did move here. Which means he is much more of a full time resident than a whole bunch of nationals on our roster. I prefaced the whole thing by saying it's not a good way to evaluate status, but even if you do, it's wrong.

It's a nonsense thing for us to try and argue as there's no way for either us to prove anything, but I can pretty confidently say that Canadians generally live in Canada and Americans generally live in America.

With the usual amount of moves that people make given family, career opportunities, etc.

***As an aside, we want to reward Americans who stay long term (both those who stay in the league and those who move here full time). That was one of the good things about the CBA.
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Blue In BC

Quote from: Jesse on May 24, 2022, 02:09:41 PM
It's a nonsense thing for us to try and argue as there's no way for either us to prove anything, but I can pretty confidently say that Canadians generally live in Canada and Americans generally live in America.

With the usual amount of moves that people make given family, career opportunities, etc.

***As an aside, we want to reward Americans who stay long term (both those who stay in the league and those who move here full time). That was one of the good things about the CBA.


I fail to see how Americans are rewarded for long term stay with a team in the new CBA. That's an illusion IMO. Money talks and if a player reaches free agency, being a nationalized player isn't going to change that.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Jesse

Quote from: Blue In BC on May 24, 2022, 02:13:49 PM

I fail to see how Americans are rewarded for long term stay with a team in the new CBA. That's an illusion IMO. Money talks and if a player reaches free agency, being a nationalized player isn't going to change that.

The ratio changes slightly devalue Canadian players and increases the value of the "nationalized" American.
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Waffler

Quote from: Jesse on May 24, 2022, 02:21:18 PM
The ratio changes slightly devalue Canadian players and increases the value of the "nationalized" American.

Yes, it is an erosion that would be sought to be built on in the next contract.
Buried in the essentially random digits of pi, you can find your eight-digit birthdate. (Is that a wink from God or just a lot of digits?) - David G. Myers
__________________________________________________
Everything seems stupid when it fails.  - Fyodor Dostoevsky

Jesse

And honestly, whether you are for are against the ratio - with the players or against them - the new nationalized rules and the 51/49 split was stupid and confusing and everyone is better off if they simplify it.
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theaardvark

Apparently, rookies (mostly INT) were not allowed to vote... as per the union's decision. 

So, that could have made it a lot easier for the NATs to defeat the CBA...

Its a real shame that the CFL gives the players the best deal ever, and they shoot themselves in the foot and start looking greedy and start playing the birth certificate card...

Saw a tweet about how silent O'Shea and Miller are, guys who would might not have had the opportunity to have the careers they did were it not for their passports. 

Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Waffler

Quote from: theaardvark on May 24, 2022, 03:21:54 PM
Apparently, rookies (mostly INT) were not allowed to vote... as per the union's decision. 

How could you though? Many of these guys are cut and home in 2 or 3 weeks.
Buried in the essentially random digits of pi, you can find your eight-digit birthdate. (Is that a wink from God or just a lot of digits?) - David G. Myers
__________________________________________________
Everything seems stupid when it fails.  - Fyodor Dostoevsky

theaardvark

Quote from: Waffler on May 24, 2022, 03:40:17 PM
How could you though? Many of these guys are cut and home in 2 or 3 weeks.

I guess it depends on whether they have to pay CFLPA union dues while they are in TC.  If dues don't kick in until they make a roster, you are correct.  But if they are paying dues, they get a vote. 

We know how Americans are about taxation without representation... they had some hub-bub in Boston a while back about that...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Jesse

Quote from: theaardvark on May 24, 2022, 03:48:30 PM
I guess it depends on whether they have to pay CFLPA union dues while they are in TC.  If dues don't kick in until they make a roster, you are correct.  But if they are paying dues, they get a vote. 

We know how Americans are about taxation without representation... they had some hub-bub in Boston a while back about that...

I'm 95% sure none of that happens until they make the roster and collect game cheques.
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Tee42

Quote from: theaardvark on May 24, 2022, 03:21:54 PM
Apparently, rookies (mostly INT) were not allowed to vote... as per the union's decision. 

So, that could have made it a lot easier for the NATs to defeat the CBA...

Its a real shame that the CFL gives the players the best deal ever, and they shoot themselves in the foot and start looking greedy and start playing the birth certificate card...

Saw a tweet about how silent O'Shea and Miller are, guys who would might not have had the opportunity to have the careers they did were it not for their passports. 



If it was the best deal ever.   Why did the get another offer so quickly? Games?

Jesse

Quote from: Tee42 on May 24, 2022, 03:59:40 PM
If it was the best deal ever.   Why did the get another offer so quickly? Games?

The two aren't mutually exclusive. It's a comprehensive document and there's obviosly a lot of pressure on both sides to not delay the season anymore.
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Blue In BC

#327
Quote from: Jesse on May 24, 2022, 02:21:18 PM
The ratio changes slightly devalue Canadian players and increases the value of the "nationalized" American.

I've covered this in great detail in earlier posts. Imports are already starting. 16 of them + the QB for nearly every team. That leaves the DI's and most of those aren't on the roster for 3 years. Needing to nationalize one of those that's already starting changes nothing since there is a requirement to start 8 instead of 7. Bryant, Hardick, Bighill, Wilson, Alexander, Bailey, are going to be replaced by a Canadian due to an in game injury because the DI's don't generally fill those spots. Even if they did, they aren't more 3+ year nationalized imports. Next game an import off the PR would be activated.

In the case of the Bombers, Grant could qualify in 2023 if he stays with the team. The other DI's in 2022 could be Mourtada a 2nd year DT ( if not replaced by a rookie this season ) and a rookie DE.

In 2021 we had Brown and and a few imports that played a game or two. Now gone because veteran DI's if a team does roster them is a short term rental not a long term plan.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Blue In BC

News about the new proposal. A small raise the the salary cap leaves possible room at the end of the season for returning players from NFL for example. Everybody else already has a contract.

This new proposal has eliminated the clause allowing three ?nationalized Americans? to replace Canadian players for up to 49 percent of plays in a game. It also includes a small raise to the salary cap.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

theaardvark

Sounds like the NATS got their ratio back, and a small ratification bonus... probably a vote tonight and game on Friday...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.