CBA negotiations

Started by theaardvark, May 06, 2022, 02:56:55 PM

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gobombersgo

Quote from: Jesse on May 15, 2022, 01:43:58 AM
I believe the host team has to buy the game from the league.
Sure but that's just a formality as all teams buy the game. I know the cost used to be around 3 million.

If it's a deal breaker maybe the players can ask for the cost of the game to go up to 3.5m (using the number as an example) and the players split up the 500k.

TecnoGenius

All good points.  If players can capture % of ticket revenue and there's big inflation, ticket prices will rise with inflation.  I noticed the single-ticket prices were already up a lot vs 2019.  I guess the player risk looks greater because the time frames being discussed are so long.  Who knows what will be going on in 5 years.  Do they have to lock in such a long term CBA?  Can't they just haggle on a short-term one (like 3 years)?

So no word on today's results yet?  Are they still talking?
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theaardvark

Quote from: TecnoGenius on May 15, 2022, 12:12:11 AM
CFLPA should publicly release their position, too.  The league position seems reasonable.  If CFLPA holds out, we should know why.  I'm sure they would have their (good) reasons.


The CFL makes the offer to the union... this is basically their offer.  Unless teh PA is putting together a counter, they don't have "a position".  There is an offer on the table that the PA members have to vote on.
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theaardvark

Quote from: gobombersgo on May 15, 2022, 02:30:05 AM
Sure but that's just a formality as all teams buy the game. I know the cost used to be around 3 million.

If it's a deal breaker maybe the players can ask for the cost of the game to go up to 3.5m (using the number as an example) and the players split up the 500k.

The reason the team "buys" the game from the league is to assure the league has the cash to pay the players the playoff bonuses... they are already splitting more than a 2.5 million from the GC revenue.

"This payment comes from revenue from the playoff and Grey Cup games and a minimum of $469,200 is paid to 46-man rosters of 3 teams (2 semi-finalists, 1 bye) for each of the division semi-finals ($938,400 total), $331,200 to 2 teams for each of the division finals ($662,400 total) and $1.104 million for the Grey Cup.  Oct 22, 2021"
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CFLPA directs players with seven of nine CFL teams to commence strike on Sunday: The Canadian Football League Players? Association (CFLPA) bargaining committee has informed the CFLPA membership under contract with seven of nine clubs? https://3downnation.com/2022/05/14/cflpa-directs-players-with-seven-of-nine-cfl-teams-to-commence-strike-on-sunday/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
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Blue In BC

#111
I don't get what the CFLPA isn't getting that they want? I was actually quite surprised on the all the new things the players were getting.

What am I missing?  Best guess is they want the effective date for 2022 and not 2023. After losing the 2020 season and part of 2021, I don't think that's a reasonable position. The 7 year deal might be the sticking point but there is a lot of money going forward.

A strike may result in another shortened season. Pre season may be toast which is bad for the teams and rookies.

Roster cut down for another 10 players would have been Tuesday. Unfortunately those players probably just lost any opportunity to make a real impression. May as well send them home today with the other cuts that were scheduled for yesterday.

All in all it's a depressing outcome.

2019 Grey Cup Champions

Jesse

Quote from: Blue In BC on May 15, 2022, 01:10:34 PM
I don't get what the CFLPA isn't getting that they want? I was actually quite surprised on the all the new things the players were getting.

What am I missing?  Best guess is they want the effective date for 2022 and not 2023. After losing the 2020 season and part of 2021, I don't think that's a reasonable position. The 7 year deal might be the sticking point but there is a lot of money going forward.

A strike may result in another shortened season. Pre season may be toast which is bad for the teams and rookies.

Roster cut down for another 10 players would have been Tuesday. Unfortunately those players probably just lost any opportunity to make a real impression. May as well send them home today with the other cuts that were scheduled for yesterday.

All in all it's a depressing outcome.



1. They think the league is hiding money

2. If the league wants to add padded practices back, they need to increase healthcare.
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Blue In BC

#113
Quote from: Jesse on May 15, 2022, 02:50:16 PM
1. They think the league is hiding money

2. If the league wants to add padded practices back, they need to increase healthcare.

1. Even if that was true, the new offer is a significant increase to previous SMS. Many teams are public companies and financial records are available.  Nothing to see here. It's obvious that attendance has dropped from earlier times.

If they think the league is hiding money, where do they think this money is coming from. The TV deal was already in place and known amount.

2. CFL had padded practices for decades. Canadian health care is not an issue. Veterans injured in TC go on IR with full pay.  Rookie imports in TC are not as protected but this is nothing new in the 100 years the CFL has existed. If an import makes the roster and is injured he goes on IR at full pay and are protected.

Like any business, healthcare benefits are part of the total package. Wages versus benefits is a question that comes up in any union situation.

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Dave Naylor
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The @CFLPA is expected to hold a town hall meeting today at which they will provide more information and direction to their membership on Day 1 of the strike.#CFL #CFLPA
6:27 AM ? May 15, 2022
"You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one." - John Wooden

theaardvark

I've seen tweets about how the league has money, that half the teams are owned by billionaires.  This information may be true, but billionaires owning teams means they can break even or even lose a little and not hurt their owners.  The majority of teams are not owned by billionaires, and many have a lot of red ink, and some have gone bankrupt in our recent memory.

It seems like players think there are people getting rich off their pain, effort and potential injury.  The fact that the league has offered as much as they have is astounding to me.  This deal, as it sits, will put some teams in trouble.  The league is optomistic about the future rebound the economics of the sport, and I hope they are right.

If the sticking point is padded practice and extended health care, they need to get it done.  The league should be all over extending healthcare, because it is only an actual cost for Int players returning to the states.   And it could be very easy to strike a deal with Blue Cross or some such to cover those players.  NAT's and GLB's (not residing in the US) are covered by gov't healthcare.

Either back off on padded practices, or step up on healthcare.  With everything else you've offered up, doing the right thing on healthcare should be the easiest decision of the negotiations.  Especially with the Hefney precedent.  We don't want/need a repeat of that.  How the CFL left this out of their offer is befuddling.

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Tiger

Per 3DownNation - CFLPA leaked communication

CFL has take it or leave it stance and ends negotiations
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Blue In BC

#117
I found this over on Lionbackers. Kiss a full season goodbye. If this is the position of the CFLPA it's not going to get resolved soon. I'm surprised the CFL offered as much as they did. I wasn't in favour of a 7 year deal but shorter deal if no rev share fix, doesn't fix a perceived problem by the CFLPA. 

Barking up the wrong tree IMO.


The 3 sticking points for @CFLPA:
- @CFL wants 12 padded practices. PA wants improved health & safety package if they?re to agree
- Revenue sharing needs to include all revenue. Not selected buckets. Statements need to be audited.
- Term of deal (if rev share doesn?t get fixed)
2019 Grey Cup Champions

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on May 15, 2022, 05:16:01 PM
If the sticking point is padded practice and extended health care, they need to get it done.

Adding back a few (or even many) padded practices just takes us back to the way we were a few short years ago.  Why this would be a big problem is beyond me.

1. Play quality and scoring went down precisely when they reduced/dropped padded practice.  Not proof of causation, but it's easy to put 2 & 2 together.  It would seem the league agrees as they did a complete 180 on this now that they are emphasizing scoring.

2. 2021 had the worst rash of achilles and other injuries the CFL has ever seen in TC.  Zero padded practices.  I doubt the return of padded practice will affect injury rate compared to 2021.  In other words, if you want better health coverage, it should be its own demand, not tied to pads or not.

CFL needs pads back.
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TBURGESS

12 Padded practices shouldn't be a sticking point. That's less than 1 a week.

Revenue sharing is ridiculous when at least some teams are losing money and the CFL is propping up teams. Share a % of net income and you're sharing nothing. Sharing a % of gross income and you're making the problem worse for the owners and teams. That's a hill for management to die on.

Term of the deal seems too long to me. I'm sure that management would bend on that one.
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