CFL contemplating 4 major changes to CFL '22

Started by Lake Winnipeg, March 19, 2022, 04:14:21 AM

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theaardvark

More people watch the NFL for the same reason more people watch blockbuster movies. 

The CFL has an "indie" audience, for sure.

No reason it can't become a viral success though...

Guys like Shai Ross (Winnipeg boy) doing the Oreo Dunk or the Barbell Flip don't hurt...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPg-IFUd3qc

https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=2416577
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

Blue In BC

#91
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 04:03:12 PM
You're right that I'm sure the NFL generates viewers simply because it has so much massive momentum but I don't think the "final minutes" theory holds any truth in today's games. It is a leftover stereotype from a different NFL of yesteryear. After all, if the end of NFL games were as "boring as watching paint drying" I am sure "millennials" and the "younger generation" that people keep talking about would surely go back to their mobile phones or watch something else. Isn't it true they need constant stimulation? Ratings/data/logic are not on your side there.

In reality, the NFL has moved far more towards "traditional" CFL-style games than anyone (in either NFL or CFL camps) probably wants to admit. 2021 maybe was a bit of an outlier in that it was SO good, but the NFL last year had a whole bunch of games that absolutely saw a ton of lead changes and other craziness in the final minutes of games. It really was phenomenal entertainment.

Again, maybe this forum isn't the easiest audience for this discussion but I think there is a disconnect between some diehard CFL fans and the reality of the football sports landscape today. To grow, we are going to have to be open to challenging and ultimately changing long held ideals of what we think (or hope for tradition's sake) is best for the game and what actually is best for the game. (Or we don't and keep what we've built and hope it can hang on. And I'm sure it can in some form. But then don't complain about non-filled stadiums or low TV numbers or bigger markets struggling or younger people not being engaged).

Yes and no. 4 down football gives you more opportunities to grind the clock or force the opponent to use any remaining timeouts. Time clock run time before start of play is much longer in the NFL so that obviously allows you to run down the clock as well.

EDIT: I'd point out the failure of the AAF, XFL, USFL and other spring football leagues in the US in the past. All with 4 down, NFL type rules etc. Nothing approaching the hype of the NFL.

Consider the current USFL about to start. All games played at the same field? Yikes, that's like some version of junior football. It might be somewhat entertaining but will it last. I'll be checking out the games this weekend. My guess is that I'd find college games more entertaining watching up and coming new players than what we'll see in USFL rosters.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

TBURGESS

The idea that the rules are the reason that people watch the NFL is a non-starter.

Folks, don't watch because of 4 downs, or 100 yard fields, or fair catches, or zero point missed FG's. They watch the NFL to watch the best players, the best coaches, in the best stadiums with the best camera angles, the best analysis, by the best presenters with the best pre-game, post game and half time shows. Folks watch the stats in real time on their devices and play Madden. Folks gamble on the games (Something that could help save the CFL). The CFL can't compete with the NFL and they know it.
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

Blue In BC

Quote from: TBURGESS on April 08, 2022, 05:49:11 PM
The idea that the rules are the reason that people watch the NFL is a non-starter.

Folks, don't watch because of 4 downs, or 100 yard fields, or fair catches, or zero point missed FG's. They watch the NFL to watch the best players, the best coaches, in the best stadiums with the best camera angles, the best analysis, by the best presenters with the best pre-game, post game and half time shows. Folks watch the stats in real time on their devices and play Madden. Folks gamble on the games (Something that could help save the CFL). The CFL can't compete with the NFL and they know it.

Exactly and good points. The gambling aspect could be an advantage.
2019 Grey Cup Champions

Jesse

Quote from: TBURGESS on April 08, 2022, 05:49:11 PM
The idea that the rules are the reason that people watch the NFL is a non-starter.

Folks, don't watch because of 4 downs, or 100 yard fields, or fair catches, or zero point missed FG's. They watch the NFL to watch the best players, the best coaches, in the best stadiums with the best camera angles, the best analysis, by the best presenters with the best pre-game, post game and half time shows. Folks watch the stats in real time on their devices and play Madden. Folks gamble on the games (Something that could help save the CFL). The CFL can't compete with the NFL and they know it.

Which all comes down to money (an amount of which the CFL will never have).
My wife is amazing!

Sir Blue and Gold

Okay, but, and please bear with me, the CFL might not be able to afford the best players, coaches or stadiums but they could align the product to more closely resemble the NFL game. This could be a logical choice if the current market trends continue and NFL interest amongst young people continues to climb (while simultaneously, CFL interest in those demos continues to fall). You will then pretty much have no choice but to go after that group and you're going to have to do something differently to get them.

Throw Long Bannatyne

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 01:29:56 PM
I offer two points, one fact, one observation:

Observation: a CFL forum (during the off-season no less) is not an accurate barometer for the marketplace overall on the topic of NFL vs CFL rules (ie. 3 downs vs 4). It is never going to be a popular idea within this community.

Fact: A quarter of 18-44-year-old consumers in Canada follow the NFL, compared to one in six who follow the CFL. Meanwhile, the CFL skews older; three in ten consumers over the age of 45 follow this league. Perhaps the most illustrative finding about younger consumers is how many young football fans are watching the NFL exclusively. Nearly half of 18-44-year-old football fans watch the NFL but do not follow the CFL and only one-fifth are CFL-only fans. So not only are younger consumers more likely than older ones to watch the NFL, they are more likely to only watch the NFL when it comes to football (source: 2020, Mintel, a leading marketing intelligence company).

Back to my opinions, these trends can only go on for so long before the league is forced to adapt or die. It's very convenient for fans on here to blame marketing issues or virtually anything but the product, but customers and potential customers (fans) speak with their wallets and eyeballs and that's all that really matters in the end. Part of the allure of the NFL is certainly its most recognized names, but their game is fundamentally different due to the rules. There is absolutely no doubt that if the CFL were do adopt the NFL rulebook verbatim, 'marketing' and whatever else you may think is the problem would have a far easier time getting people to try out the league (especially amongst 18-44 year olds in Canada who only watch NFL).

What's abundantly clear is no one has the answers at this time, and that includes the sports marketing experts that work for Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment who get paid 6 figures to mostly shrug their shoulders when it comes to solving the Argos attendance problems.  Change for the sake of change is not the best policy, especially when it involves throwing over 100 years of CFL tradition away in haste to find a solution.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 08, 2022, 06:51:03 PM
What's abundantly clear is no one has the answers at this time, and that includes the sports marketing experts that work for Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment who get paid 6 figures to mostly shrug their shoulders when it comes to solving the Argos attendance problems.  Change for the sake of change is not the best policy, especially when it involves throwing over 100 years of CFL tradition away in haste to find a solution.

Well, they are reported to be one of the two teams that voted to explore playing four down football so the "6 figure" executives at Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment may think they have an answer, it's just that what they came up with is not palatable for some.

blue_or_die

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 06:48:22 PM
Okay, but, and please bear with me, the CFL might not be able to afford the best players, coaches or stadiums but they could align the product to more closely resemble the NFL game. This could be a logical choice if the current market trends continue and NFL interest amongst young people continues to climb (while simultaneously, CFL interest in those demos continues to fall). You will then pretty much have no choice but to go after that group and you're going to have to do something differently to get them.

This is where you've lost me completely. There's very likely zero correlation between interest and game rules. So how on earth would switching to 4 downs move the needle at all in growing the CFL interest, which is the goal.

That's kind of like theorizing that because the NFL has 17 regular season games instead of 18, and kids love the NFL, that the CFL should "logically" decrease their season to 17 games to capture that demographic.
#Ride?

Jesse

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 06:48:22 PM
Okay, but, and please bear with me, the CFL might not be able to afford the best players, coaches or stadiums but they could align the product to more closely resemble the NFL game. This could be a logical choice if the current market trends continue and NFL interest amongst young people continues to climb (while simultaneously, CFL interest in those demos continues to fall). You will then pretty much have no choice but to go after that group and you're going to have to do something differently to get them.

The more you align the product with the NFL, the more people will turn to the NFL as the superior version of that product.
My wife is amazing!

TBURGESS

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 06:48:22 PM
Okay, but, and please bear with me, the CFL might not be able to afford the best players, coaches or stadiums but they could align the product to more closely resemble the NFL game. This could be a logical choice if the current market trends continue and NFL interest amongst young people continues to climb (while simultaneously, CFL interest in those demos continues to fall). You will then pretty much have no choice but to go after that group and you're going to have to do something differently to get them.
Lets say the CFL takes the NFL rules... Why would anyone watch it instead of or in addition to the NFL? If you want to watch NFL lite, you can watch college ball. They also have NFL rules and more money, better coaches, better stadiums, etc.
Winnipeg Blue Bombers - 2019 Grey Cup Champs.

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: TBURGESS on April 08, 2022, 07:15:31 PM
Lets say the CFL takes the NFL rules... Why would anyone watch it instead of or in addition to the NFL?

Why were the Manitoba Moose one of the most well-attended AHL teams in the league throughout their history in Winnipeg before the Jets arrived?

Sir Blue and Gold

Quote from: Jesse on April 08, 2022, 07:14:11 PM
The more you align the product with the NFL, the more people will turn to the NFL as the superior version of that product.

If being different has helped, where's the results to back that up? We have the opposite. We have a league with a slight downward trajectory in the short term and market research that paints a very negative picture in the long term. If nothing is done, one can reasonably assume a further erosion of fans over time.

theaardvark

#103
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 06:48:22 PM
Okay, but, and please bear with me, the CFL might not be able to afford the best players, coaches or stadiums but they could align the product to more closely resemble the NFL game. This could be a logical choice if the current market trends continue and NFL interest amongst young people continues to climb (while simultaneously, CFL interest in those demos continues to fall). You will then pretty much have no choice but to go after that group and you're going to have to do something differently to get them.

The NFL is attracting young fans because they want the NFL lifestyle.  They don't admire the game, but the hype.  I don't think there are any 20somethings watching the games for strategy or skill play, but rather the spectacle of it.  Add to that things like the Nicklodeon slime bowls.. jeesh,  can they get any self respect?

CFL viewers watch for the game, and the rivalries... THAT is an aspect that is not used often enough... SSK/WPG, HAM/TOR, CGY/EDM and to a more limited degree OTT/MTL have a great regional rivalry... but it could be built upon...
Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.

blue_or_die

Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 08, 2022, 07:23:50 PM
If being different has helped, where's the results to back that up? We have the opposite. We have a league with a slight downward trajectory in the short term and market research that paints a very negative picture in the long term. If nothing is done, one can reasonably assume a further erosion of fans over time.

Your observations are correct but you have not presented a solution, just a change.
#Ride?