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October 04, 2022, 10:43:55 PM *
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Author Topic: Social Medicine  (Read 1481 times)
theaardvark
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« on: October 04, 2021, 08:05:25 PM »

Yeah, that was more PR than fact IMO. Quite likely he'll miss the rest of the regular season if not the entire season. He hasn't even had the surgery yet and that might be a week or two down the road.

I was looking forward to watching him play against other teams in 2021.

Surgery is Wed...

I get it, but in Canada, with socialized medicine, seeing an athlete getting surgery in a few days after injury while people needing hip/knee replacements are waiting months or years, it is kind of frustrating. 

I never want to go to a fully private medical system, but I do think we should allow private clinics and hospitals to be fully accredited in Canada. 

I had come up with a plan decades ago to open a private hospital and accept US patients at double the $CAN fees for service, which would still be 1/2 the $US cost to their insurers (or themselves if uninsured).  This would allow the hospital to do that procedure, plus a second procedure on a Can citizen at no extra cost.  This would allow much faster lines, as Canadians could also choose the "Pay double yourself" option to "jump the line", and drag someone else with them.  It would also allow us to increase our capacity overall by increasing the number of paid procedures, and train and retain more medical personnel.

Win/win/win...
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Unabashed positron.  Blue koolaid in my fridge.  I wear my blue sunglasses at night.  Homer, d'oh.
Sir Blue and Gold
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« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2021, 08:27:14 PM »

Surgery is Wed...

I get it, but in Canada, with socialized medicine, seeing an athlete getting surgery in a few days after injury while people needing hip/knee replacements are waiting months or years, it is kind of frustrating. 

I never want to go to a fully private medical system, but I do think we should allow private clinics and hospitals to be fully accredited in Canada. 

I had come up with a plan decades ago to open a private hospital and accept US patients at double the $CAN fees for service, which would still be 1/2 the $US cost to their insurers (or themselves if uninsured).  This would allow the hospital to do that procedure, plus a second procedure on a Can citizen at no extra cost.  This would allow much faster lines, as Canadians could also choose the "Pay double yourself" option to "jump the line", and drag someone else with them.  It would also allow us to increase our capacity overall by increasing the number of paid procedures, and train and retain more medical personnel.

Win/win/win...


I don't usually take these sorts of things up but "socialized medicine" is a term that US lobbyists invented to scare (or cast a negative light) on regular Americans from thinking that everyone getting access to free and affordable healthcare is somehow a bad idea. Google it - it's literally where the term came from. We -- along with most of the developed world -- have a Universal Health Care system. Don't let American toxicity and polarization creep into your vernacular -- it's not a good look!
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theaardvark
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« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2021, 08:59:30 PM »

I don't usually take these sorts of things up but "socialized medicine" is a term that US lobbyists invented to scare (or cast a negative light) on regular Americans from thinking that everyone getting access to free and affordable healthcare is somehow a bad idea. Google it - it's literally where the term came from. We -- along with most of the developed world -- have a Universal Health Care system. Don't let American toxicity and polarization creep into your vernacular -- it's not a good look!

Sure... universal health care is a better term than socialized medicine... and we'd never talk about socialized Fire Departments, or socialized Police... but they are just as appropriate a title.

Here, though, it truly has become socialized medicine, because there is no private sector of it at all.  You want to practice medicine in Canada, you work for the government, at the government rates, subject to the government regulations.  Sure, you can be an independent provider, but you cannot charge a Canadian citizen for service, even if they wanted to pay.  Britain and other countries take it one step further by running everything with gov't organizations, but in Canada, socialized medicine is a good descriptor for the system we have.  But those counties also have private options, where you can buy private insurance and be served in a private clinic / hospital.  In Canada, we do not have that option, and I really think that puts us behind other places and makes it harder to provide services and compete for health care workers, from support staff to doctors.


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Sir Blue and Gold
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« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2021, 09:28:31 PM »

Aardvark -- you barely understand the game of football. Forgive me if I don't think you're qualified to be giving legitimate dialogue about health care at a country level. I just wanted to say that your inclusion of divisive American words into our discourse is unhelpful. Mods, sorry for derailing us. Thank you in advance for cleaning it up.
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blue_gold_84
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« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2021, 03:47:18 PM »

The last thing our country needs to do is implement anything the US does as far as healthcare and access to medical services go. Eff that.

https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/fund-reports/2021/aug/mirror-mirror-2021-reflecting-poorly

Canada has work to do but we can learn from our Commonwealth and European friends more than the dumpster fire to the south.

Poor form, Aardsy.
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theaardvark
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« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2021, 07:09:41 PM »

The last thing our country needs to do is implement anything the US does as far as healthcare and access to medical services go. Eff that.

https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/fund-reports/2021/aug/mirror-mirror-2021-reflecting-poorly

Canada has work to do but we can learn from our Commonwealth and European friends more than the dumpster fire to the south.

Poor form, Aardsy.

I have never espoused an American system, I think it is the biggest human rights violation there is.

But having a single tier system enforced here in Canada leaves us far behind most of the rest of the civilized world.  People say we do not have a "two tier system", where the rich/powerful get better/quicker health care than anyone else, but that is crap.  The whole issue with Lucky illustrates that, and is the reason i started my rant.

We espouse "equal access to health care", but the rick/powerful still skip the line, whether it is within Canada, or by leaving.  Every health care dollar spent outside Canada by Canadians is money lost from our system, money that could be used better, more effectively here in Canada. 

I have worked in the billing side of the healthcare system, so I know how the money works.  Procedures here in Canada are performed at a fraction of the cost of doing the exact same procedure in the US or abroad, our system is more efficient, has no profit incentive and a lower overhead for malpractice.  I worked with one of the last private hospitals in Canada decades ago, and they did about 50% OHIP (Ontario Health Insurance Plan), and 50% private, mostly US clients.  Their specialty was hernia repair, they were world famous for their special technique which had an extremely short recovery.  When asked at a dinner if they charged the same for OHIP and private patients, they blushed, and another doctor familiar with them said... "The OHIP clients come in through the front doors in an ambulance, the private ones come in the back in a Brinks Truck. 

My point being, if we embrace a two tier system executed properly, it would enhance the public system with private funding, reducing our healthcare costs overall, improving service and attracting staff with better pay/facilities. It also increases the capacity, allowing for shorter wait times and better outcomes, and better being able to handle unexpected situations.

But any time you mention adding in a private component, the "social medicine" people come out with torches and pitchforks...

We are best served by a hybrid system.

That's it.  That's my rant...
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pjrocksmb
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« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2022, 03:00:39 AM »

I have never espoused an American system, I think it is the biggest human rights violation there is.

But having a single tier system enforced here in Canada leaves us far behind most of the rest of the civilized world.  People say we do not have a "two tier system", where the rich/powerful get better/quicker health care than anyone else, but that is crap.  The whole issue with Lucky illustrates that, and is the reason i started my rant.

We espouse "equal access to health care", but the rick/powerful still skip the line, whether it is within Canada, or by leaving.  Every health care dollar spent outside Canada by Canadians is money lost from our system, money that could be used better, more effectively here in Canada. 

I have worked in the billing side of the healthcare system, so I know how the money works.  Procedures here in Canada are performed at a fraction of the cost of doing the exact same procedure in the US or abroad, our system is more efficient, has no profit incentive and a lower overhead for malpractice.  I worked with one of the last private hospitals in Canada decades ago, and they did about 50% OHIP (Ontario Health Insurance Plan), and 50% private, mostly US clients.  Their specialty was hernia repair, they were world famous for their special technique which had an extremely short recovery.  When asked at a dinner if they charged the same for OHIP and private patients, they blushed, and another doctor familiar with them said... "The OHIP clients come in through the front doors in an ambulance, the private ones come in the back in a Brinks Truck. 

My point being, if we embrace a two tier system executed properly, it would enhance the public system with private funding, reducing our healthcare costs overall, improving service and attracting staff with better pay/facilities. It also increases the capacity, allowing for shorter wait times and better outcomes, and better being able to handle unexpected situations.

But any time you mention adding in a private component, the "social medicine" people come out with torches and pitchforks...

We are best served by a hybrid system.

That's it.  That's my rant...
Nah two tier is only good for the rich
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I don't follow the No Fun League b/c I live in Canada and love the CFL
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