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Author Topic: Covid 19  (Read 100708 times)
Pigskin
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« Reply #495 on: October 08, 2021, 03:17:21 PM »

Just got my third shot this morning. Ask my Dr. if I get cash or prizes for my third shot. He said you get to live longer, this is your prize.  Starting to get a little bit of a headache, other then that feeling pretty good. 
« Last Edit: October 08, 2021, 03:26:14 PM by Pigskin » Logged

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Donny C
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« Reply #496 on: October 08, 2021, 04:46:53 PM »

I'm not getting the "religious objection" concept of anti-vaxxers.  The Mennonite church has come out as pro-vax, and stated there there is no basis for a "religious objection".  And there are people asking that we don't demonize Mennonites because some are anti-vax.

Is it enough that the church has stated there is no basis for a religious objection, even though their members still claim it?  Do they need to be more proactive, and tell members to stop it or risk being ex-communicated?  If a member claimed a religious exemption without foundation to dispute a seat belt law, would the church allow it?  Or if someone claimed their DUI was subject to a religious exemption?  Or any other violation?

These pockets of self righteous antivaxers put us all at risk.  This is where variants develop, this is where breakthroughs come from, someone gets infected and then goes out into the rest of the province, spreading it like Typhoid Mary. 

We are so close to beating this, the number for Winnipeg are so small, 3 per 100,000... while southern district is 7 times that high, and probably a lot higher due to a lot of unreported cases. 

I'm not sure what we need to do to fix this, 5 billion doses, and the rest of the world begging for vaccine, and we have it here going bad, hoping these people come and get it.

Its just sad, especially when you see someone in their 100's die from it, after surviving everything else for 100 years, succumbing to this? 

I'll break down the argument and then post the reality:

Argument:
The vaccine is made from aborted fetal cells, and the Mennonite Church would not support abortion. (When mentioning the Mennonite Church, this does not refer to all Mennonites, but rather a denomination called Mennonite Church Canada). By not granting the religious exemption, the Mennonite Church is participating in benefiting from evil and forcing vaccinations - because by refusing to grant religious exemptions they are saying that they believe everyone should be forced to partake in using those aborted fetal cells and are refusing to honor people's strong objections to having any part in it.

The Reality (My response to the argument):

I believe it is a bit more nuanced than straightforward. I'm pro-life and support pregnancy care centers, for the record.

When it comes to vaccines in general it is true that there have been aborted fetal cells in the 70's & 80's which were used to multiplied into many new cells over the past four or five decades, these new cells are used.

If you want to argue that since the beginning was evil the outcome is evil, I'll concede that ground, but not agree. I am not arguing that the ends justify the means. I'll provide a biblical example to try and explain my comment a bit more:

It was evil what Joseph's brothers did to him, God used it to save a nation.

It was evil what Pharroh did in demanding that all boys be killed (and many were), God used it to insert Mosses into that situation and save a nation.
These same cells are used in the manufacturing of chickenpox, rubella, Hep A, rabies, etc.

"but because by refusing to grant religious exemptions they are saying that they believe everyone should be forced to partake in using those aborted fetal cells and are refusing to honor people's strong objections to having any part in it"

I'd like to break down the quote in a couple of sections:
1) Procedurally, they are legally correct that they must use sacred texts (with proof texts) to put into their constitution and/or bylaws. Many churches worked through that procedurally when it came to LGBTQ2 marriages to protect themselves from lawsuits.

When it comes to vaccine exemptions based on religion, the same process would have to be taken. They would have to find, quote and directly correlate those biblical proof texts (it has to be an unequivocal straight line with very little room for alternate interpretation) and cite them in their constitution/bylaws to have a legal leg to stand on.

2) Refusing to grant religious exemptions is not the same thing as saying everyone needs to be forced to take a vaccine. That argument could possibly be made if they were also only holding services for those vaccinated. But still, then it would be a hard argument to win, as the church or denominational leaders could say that they are not forcing anyone to take the vaccine, rather saying that their stance is not to grant vaccine exemptions, and people are still able to attend a different church.

I probably won't respond to many of the comments on this, at least not today as I get ready to drive into WPG.
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« Reply #497 on: October 08, 2021, 05:58:31 PM »

We need to be aware of the rules (Code of Conduct) here which precludes political and religious views in discussions.

Specifically the Code of Conduct states:

"Please avoid political and religious discussions. In order to avoid argument, if it is not directly related to the Blue Bombers, do not discuss political, religious or off-topic issues. This forum is dedicated to the Blue Bombers and related issues. While we support the right of free speech, our forums are not here to support political parties or their initiatives, individual politicians, or any religious affiliation. We reserve the right to remove all posts that violate this policy without notice."

While religious views are pertinent to the current COVID situation, please respect the fact that the forums here are not the venue to have an unfettered discussion that involves religious opinion.

Hope everyone understands.
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Donny C
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« Reply #498 on: October 08, 2021, 06:34:24 PM »

We need to be aware of the rules (Code of Conduct) here which precludes political and religious views in discussions.

Specifically the Code of Conduct states:

"Please avoid political and religious discussions. In order to avoid argument, if it is not directly related to the Blue Bombers, do not discuss political, religious or off-topic issues. This forum is dedicated to the Blue Bombers and related issues. While we support the right of free speech, our forums are not here to support political parties or their initiatives, individual politicians, or any religious affiliation. We reserve the right to remove all posts that violate this policy without notice."

While religious views are pertinent to the current COVID situation, please respect the fact that the forums here are not the venue to have an unfettered discussion that involves religious opinion.

Hope everyone understands.


My bad!
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Pigskin
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« Reply #499 on: October 08, 2021, 06:35:02 PM »

Manitoba saw 130 new cases today. and 2 more deaths. The Southern Health Regions is still topping the leader board with 43 new cases. 33 new cases in the North, 20 in Winnipeg, and 18 in the Interlake, and 16 in Prairie Mountain region.
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theaardvark
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« Reply #500 on: October 08, 2021, 07:50:18 PM »

I'll break down the argument and then post the reality:

Argument:
The vaccine is made from aborted fetal cells, and the Mennonite Church would not support abortion. (When mentioning the Mennonite Church, this does not refer to all Mennonites, but rather a denomination called Mennonite Church Canada). By not granting the religious exemption, the Mennonite Church is participating in benefiting from evil and forcing vaccinations - because by refusing to grant religious exemptions they are saying that they believe everyone should be forced to partake in using those aborted fetal cells and are refusing to honor people's strong objections to having any part in it.

The Reality (My response to the argument):

I believe it is a bit more nuanced than straightforward. I'm pro-life and support pregnancy care centers, for the record.

When it comes to vaccines in general it is true that there have been aborted fetal cells in the 70's & 80's which were used to multiplied into many new cells over the past four or five decades, these new cells are used.

If you want to argue that since the beginning was evil the outcome is evil, I'll concede that ground, but not agree. I am not arguing that the ends justify the means. I'll provide a biblical example to try and explain my comment a bit more:

It was evil what Joseph's brothers did to him, God used it to save a nation.

It was evil what Pharroh did in demanding that all boys be killed (and many were), God used it to insert Mosses into that situation and save a nation.
These same cells are used in the manufacturing of chickenpox, rubella, Hep A, rabies, etc.

"but because by refusing to grant religious exemptions they are saying that they believe everyone should be forced to partake in using those aborted fetal cells and are refusing to honor people's strong objections to having any part in it"

I'd like to break down the quote in a couple of sections:
1) Procedurally, they are legally correct that they must use sacred texts (with proof texts) to put into their constitution and/or bylaws. Many churches worked through that procedurally when it came to LGBTQ2 marriages to protect themselves from lawsuits.

When it comes to vaccine exemptions based on religion, the same process would have to be taken. They would have to find, quote and directly correlate those biblical proof texts (it has to be an unequivocal straight line with very little room for alternate interpretation) and cite them in their constitution/bylaws to have a legal leg to stand on.

2) Refusing to grant religious exemptions is not the same thing as saying everyone needs to be forced to take a vaccine. That argument could possibly be made if they were also only holding services for those vaccinated. But still, then it would be a hard argument to win, as the church or denominational leaders could say that they are not forcing anyone to take the vaccine, rather saying that their stance is not to grant vaccine exemptions, and people are still able to attend a different church.

I probably won't respond to many of the comments on this, at least not today as I get ready to drive into WPG.


I get that the whole "aborted fetal cells" argument, except that mRNA do not use them at all in their production, they were used early on in testing only.  AZ and J&J do use them as part of production, but none remain in the final injection.  So none of the vaccines contain them.

I guess my thought is, if you don't want to take the vaccine for whatever reason, religious or not, that is your prerogative.  But if you decide to not take the vaccine, you do not get the rights and freedoms of the vaccinated, just because you have "an excuse". 

If you choose not to do a drivers test, you do not get a drivers license and thereby cannot drive.  You can't say "I object to testing" and then demand to be allowed to drive.  Examples of this kind of thing are plenty in our regulated society.  If your dog doesn't have its "Kennel cough" vaccine, it can't got to many doggy daycares or groomers.  Can you demand that your dog be allowed in without its vaccine?  Nope.   Immunization records are required for all schools, because MMR outbreaks are deadly, and MMR vaccines are safe. 

The whole vaccine issue does not seem to be a problem in most of the world, except for supply.  Most places would take every dose they could get their hands on, and have more than enough arms to put them in.  Somehow, in North America, it has become a political issue, with the far right using it as a hill to die on (literally).  It is truly unfortunate that hundreds of thousands of people are dying unnecessarily, because a few idiots chose this as a way to differentiate themselves to try and garner votes. 
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Pigskin
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« Reply #501 on: October 10, 2021, 02:41:28 AM »

Yesterday Alberts had 1256 new cases, and 16 more deaths. Over 1100 in Hospital, and 250 in the ICU.

Today Sask. had 502 new cases and 5 more deaths.  332 in hospital, and 78 in the ICU.
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Pigskin
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« Reply #502 on: October 12, 2021, 04:46:50 PM »

It's looking like 479 new case over a five day period in Manitoba. 161 in the South, 106 in the North, 102 in Winnipeg, 68 in the Prairie Region, and 42 in the Interlake. 9 deaths, 7 of them are in the Southern health Region.

85 people in hospital, 16 in the ICU with active cases. Manitoba's TPR is 3.9%, Winnipeg is 1.2%.
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Pigskin
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« Reply #503 on: October 14, 2021, 04:40:36 PM »

79 new cases yesterday in Manitoba, with 25 in the South and 24 in the North.

Kleefeld School which is the Southern Health Region reporting 19 cases. Not surprised.
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Pigskin
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« Reply #504 on: October 14, 2021, 05:04:12 PM »

107 New cases in Manitoba today. 2 deaths. Man in his 40's from the South, women in her 50's from the North.

93 in hospital, 17 in ICU. Manitoba's TPR 3.8%. Winnipeg 1.5%.

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theaardvark
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« Reply #505 on: October 14, 2021, 06:29:08 PM »

Bartley Kives@bkives

Manitoba announced 107 new cases of #COVID19 and 2 more deaths on Thursday, Oct. 14, 2021.
 
Active cases: 962
Total caseload: 61,900
Recovered: 59,712
Deaths: 1,226

Regional breakdown of new Manitoba #COVID19 cases:

45 Northern
23 Southern
21 Winnipeg
10 Prairie Mountain
8 Interlake-Eastern



Bartley Kives@bkives
Oct 13
Running average daily #COVID19 cases per 100,000 people, by Manitoba health region, as of Tuesday:

Northern: 29.4
Southern: 15.1
Prairie Mountain: 9.1
Interlake-Eastern: 5.6
Winnipeg: 2.7

The infection rate is declining slightly for every region except Northern Health.




Bartley Kives@bkives
Oct 13
Running average daily COVID cases per 100K for all provinces, as of Tuesday:

1. Saskatchewan 41.1
2. Alberta 23
3. New Brunswick 12.7
4. B.C. 11.7
5. Manitoba 7.1
6. Quebec 6.4
7. Ontario 3.6
8. Nova Scotia 2.6
9. P.E.I. 1.3
10. N.L. 0.6

Alberta's fourth wave has crested.
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Pigskin
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« Reply #506 on: October 15, 2021, 03:42:09 AM »

55 of the 107 First nations people.
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theaardvark
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« Reply #507 on: October 15, 2021, 03:06:41 PM »

55 of the 107 First nations people.

All the more reason to make sure that the First Nations people are given every opportunity to get vaccines, and are educated on how safe they are, how effective they are, and the fact that they can be the difference between asymptomatic infection and ICU visit or worse, death.
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theaardvark
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« Reply #508 on: October 15, 2021, 09:08:29 PM »

Skylar Peters@SkylarAPeters
Manitoba's announcing 92 new cases of COVID-19 today.

The death toll has increased by four.

Totals: (change)

Active: 963 (+1)
Total: 61,987
MB TP%: 3.2 (-.6)
WPG TP%: 1.2
Hospital/ICU: 92/16 (-1/-1)
Deaths: 1,230
Vaccinations: 2,029,644 (+6,020)

Skylar Peters@SkylarAPeters

New cases, by region:

Southern Health (15%  MB pop.): 30
Northern (6%): 17
Winnipeg (57%): 17
Prairie Mountain (12%): 15
Interlake-Eastern (10%): 13

By vaccination status:

Not vaccinated: 58 (63%)
Partially vaccinated: 6 (7%)
Fully vaccinated: 28 (30%)

Active cases by vaccination status:

Not: 609 (63%)
Partially: 70 (7%)
Fully: 284 (29%)

In hospital:

Not: 36 (68%)
Partially: 6 (11%)
Fully: 11 (21%)

In ICU:

Not: 8 (67%)
Partially: 1 (8%)
Fully: 3 (25%)
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Pigskin
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« Reply #509 on: October 16, 2021, 07:10:59 PM »

BC: 667 new cases yesterday, 13 deaths, 367 in hospital, 152 in ICU.

Alberta:  1051 new cases yesterday, 16 deaths, 287 in ICU.

Sask: 312 new cases yesterday, 4 deaths, 339 in hospital, 78 in ICU.

It sounds like Sask. ICU is at capacity.
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