Bombers release Reggie White Jr. and sign Ian Leroux

[Waffler]

I didn't hear anything to indicate he was physically out of shape.  Every presser where they talk D.Mitchell has always, as you also said, indicated it's his headspace.

Headspace can be a much more difficult thing to overcome.  Think C.Matthews when he returned.  His heart was never in it.

I think the same thing. He IS in shape. At times he looks like an incredible athlete. He can run and make moves that make you notice.

To illustrate what I've seen, one particular punt return drill they were rotating 4 guys doing the fielding. They all know Sheahan's kicks can land anywhere and are moving as soon as it's in the air. When it's Mitchell's turn he watches it, watches it and then halfheartedly runs to the sideline but not getting there on time. It's a head scratcher. Then next one he looks like he belongs again. You'd think he would know that to make a team you have to go all out all the time. He's not a vet here.

[The Zipp]

I think the same thing. He IS in shape. At times he looks like an incredible athlete. He can run and make moves that make you notice.

To illustrate what I've seen, one particular punt return drill they were rotating 4 guys doing the fielding. They all know Sheahan's kicks can land anywhere and are moving as soon as it's in the air. When it's Mitchell's turn he watches it, watches it and then halfheartedly runs to the sideline but not getting there on time. It's a head scratcher. Then next one he looks like he belongs again. You'd think he would know that to make a team you have to go all out all the time. He's not a vet here.

FIFO...he is probably getting some extra time and coaching on this but at some point the patience will run out and he will be released if no improvement.

[Blueforlife]

This is just made up nonsense. Every receiver is a "legit scoring threat" on every passing play. The rest of this is just poorly formed opinion on top of another poorly formed opinion.

Disagree I'm with Techno, it's not nonsense imo

We need him to match what Woli brought

Not all Nat. receivers are a legit scoring threat
Good example Jeff Drover.  Loved the guy for depth but he was a once and awhile throw an under route to guy.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

I think the same thing. He IS in shape. At times he looks like an incredible athlete. He can run and make moves that make you notice.

To illustrate what I've seen, one particular punt return drill they were rotating 4 guys doing the fielding. They all know Sheahan's kicks can land anywhere and are moving as soon as it's in the air. When it's Mitchell's turn he watches it, watches it and then halfheartedly runs to the sideline but not getting there on time. It's a head scratcher. Then next one he looks like he belongs again. You'd think he would know that to make a team you have to go all out all the time. He's not a vet here.

They might be struggling to break some of Mitchell's bad habits which stem from poor focus.  Biggest flaw many receivers have is not running routes hard when they know they're not the primary target on that play, they tend to coast and good DB's can read this in their body language. Bombers don't seem to have any of this type, Schoen established himself quickly through his work ethic, he runs every route authentically at high speed whether the ball is coming to him or not. 

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Disagree I'm with Techno, it's not nonsense imo

We need him to match what Woli brought

Not all Nat. receivers are a legit scoring threat
Good example Jeff Drover.  Loved the guy for depth but he was a once and awhile throw an under route to guy.

You can agree with him if you like, and that would make you wrong also. Pretty easy to understand why:

Not withstanding the fact it makes no sense to say that in order to win a Grey Cup in 2025 our 2nd Canadian receiver has to provide the same yardage output as our 2nd Canadian receiver in 2019, the answer to the question of output in that year was 361 yards on the season. That's 20.5 yards per game. Clercius can probably do that, but even if he does, it will have no correlation to whether we win the Grey Cup. None.

[Blueforlife]

You can agree with him if you like, and that would make you wrong also. Pretty easy to understand why:

Not withstanding the fact it makes no sense to say that in order to win a Grey Cup in 2025 our 2nd Canadian receiver has to provide the same yardage output as our 2nd Canadian receiver in 2019, the answer to the question of output in that year was 361 yards on the season. That's 20.5 yards per game. Clercius can probably do that, but even if he does, it will have no correlation to whether we win the Grey Cup. None.

Nah, understating the value of a good Canadian receiver like Woli.  One of the keys to a cup run.  Techno was right and so am I imo.  Canadian depth driven league.  Agree to disagree. 

I have no worried about Clercuis.  He has the tools.  He just needs to step up at the big show like Techno said.

A team wins because of the glue.  These two gentlemen are "sticky".

Stats are not the only way to value ones importance to a ball club.  I value the blocking they provide, the tight routes and also following assignments to keep others open.  A lot more than the yardage #'s imo that come into play.  The starting Canadians receivers are a key part to any ball club in this league and always will be.  They help win cups imo.

[dd]

Starting Canadians that have an IMPACT on the game, yes, you win with those ie Harris in his Hey Day, Brady running for 1400 yds. Guys who get 20 yds a game receiving on check down routes, not so much. You need guys who make plays, big plays, and lots of them, not 8 yard check down curls. Toronto made more plays than we did in last years Grey Cup and get full credit to beating us. They were the better team that day. Our play makers didn't make plays, theirs did. its simple

[Pete]

You can agree with him if you like, and that would make you wrong also. Pretty easy to understand why:

Not withstanding the fact it makes no sense to say that in order to win a Grey Cup in 2025 our 2nd Canadian receiver has to provide the same yardage output as our 2nd Canadian receiver in 2019, the answer to the question of output in that year was 361 yards on the season. That's 20.5 yards per game. Clercius can probably do that, but even if he does, it will have no correlation to whether we win the Grey Cup. None.

I agree that Clercius with Collaros at qb can match Woli, but whether he does or not its the reciever group as a whole that needs to execute. If Schoen, Demski and Wheatfall end up being 1000 yd recievers then it really doesnt matter what Clercius does in yardage, its more important when he makes catches to extend drives.

[TecnoGenius]

Starting Canadians that have an IMPACT on the game, yes, you win with those ie Harris in his Hey Day, Brady running for 1400 yds. Guys who get 20 yds a game receiving on check down routes, not so much. You need guys who make plays, big plays, and lots of them, not 8 yard check down curls. Toronto made more plays than we did in last years Grey Cup and get full credit to beating us. They were the better team that day. Our play makers didn't make plays, theirs did. its simple

TOR is a great example.  Their absolute nobody Brissett ate us alive for 2 TDs in the GC.  That's part of why they won.  Their 5th-read (we thought) placeholder NAT ended up costing us the most TDs.

And Brissett mostly did all his damage on "8 yard check down curls".  Every play was pretty short in terms of yards from scrimmage.  But he clearly is a legit scoring threat and should have a great year in '25 (once Kelly is back).

[TecnoGenius]

Nah, understating the value of a good Canadian receiver like Woli.  One of the keys to a cup run.  Techno was right and so am I imo.  Canadian depth driven league.  Agree to disagree. 

Ya, think back to when our placeholder NAT was JFG.  Nice guy and all, and he tried, but he was like half a Woli in terms of getting the job done.  And our O game suffered all the years he was here.

And I don't care about yards or TDs, it's also about 2nd down conversions and tough catches in the middle.  It's about YAC and toughness.  When we had our 2019-2021 line-up with Woli our O was at its strongest because every last REC was a legit threat, none were NAT placeholders, and they all contributed, and usually in a (bit) more of an equal way in terms of targets.

Woli would catch that deep rail go route.  JFG never. did. even. once.

[TecnoGenius]

Not withstanding the fact it makes no sense to say that in order to win a Grey Cup in 2025 our 2nd Canadian receiver has to provide the same yardage output as our 2nd Canadian receiver in 2019

Straw man.  I never said yards.  I said "at least as good as".  This means in all aspects that Woli was good at: blocking, YAC, conversions, clutch catches, yards, TDs... everything.  Sure, the mix can be a bit different, but overall we need that 5th (4th?) spot to provide the same general level to beat these powerhouse E teams.

See my comment about Brissett.

Also, see how MTL creamed us in '23 GC with that wicked Philpot (NAT REC for MTL) final game-winning TD.  If he was just a placeholder, does MTL win that game?  It's silly to say these NAT RECs don't matter if they don't produce.

Compare with pure ratio placeholder NAT RECs: Mathis, Busby, Ternowski, etc.  Still lots of bad RECs there purely to meet the ratio.

And it makes sense, as it's the same as if you have rookie or weaker IMP RECs kind of just taking up space.  That's also a big reason why we lost the '24 GC.  If we had Schoen healthy and Wheatie out, do we do better?  (Notwithstanding Wheatie's heretofore great, potential breakout, '25 season.)

[TecnoGenius]

This is just made up nonsense. Every receiver is a "legit scoring threat" on every passing play.

Every REC is a scoring threat.  Not every REC is a legit scoring threat.  Not every REC gets taken completely seriously by the D.  And definitely not every REC will get double-teamed!

A "legit" scoring threat, which Woli was, is one who can catch it in the EZ in traffic, survive contact, be able to catch the falling-backwards or diving ones, etc.  Ternowski can't do it.  Woli could.

How many guitar-strumming-man TDs @IGF with Woli over the years??

Clercius seems OK, but he hasn't done anything near what Woli did.  How many Clercius TDs so far?  Ya...

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Every REC is a scoring threat.  Not every REC is a legit scoring threat.  Not every REC gets taken completely seriously by the D.  And definitely not every REC will get double-teamed!

A "legit" scoring threat, which Woli was, is one who can catch it in the EZ in traffic, survive contact, be able to catch the falling-backwards or diving ones, etc.  Ternowski can't do it.  Woli could.

How many guitar-strumming-man TDs @IGF with Woli over the years??

Clercius seems OK, but he hasn't done anything near what Woli did.  How many Clercius TDs so far?  Ya...

Facts:

Wolitarsky has 18 touchdowns over 6 full seasons which works out to 3 a season. He didn't even play much his first season in the CFL (5 games). You seem to be a big fan of his, and that's cool, but 3 touchdowns a year is not particularly impressive. Demski had 2 with a backup QB in our first game.

Over to Clercius: He had one TD in his rookie year while dressing every game.

There's no reason to compare them. Even if you're set on it, and you want to use the narrow scope of TDs or yards, is there really any narrative here helps? Or would it be more fair to say Wolitarsky was a fan favourite and played guitar which is fun and we cheered extra hard for him and wish him well?

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Every REC is a scoring threat.  Not every REC is a legit scoring threat.  Not every REC gets taken completely seriously by the D.  And definitely not every REC will get double-teamed!

A "legit" scoring threat, which Woli was, is one who can catch it in the EZ in traffic, survive contact, be able to catch the falling-backwards or diving ones, etc.  Ternowski can't do it.  Woli could.

How many guitar-strumming-man TDs @IGF with Woli over the years??

Clercius seems OK, but he hasn't done anything near what Woli did.  How many Clercius TDs so far?  Ya...

Meh, Woli was not that physically talented and was a plodding route runner, he caught most passes thrown his way, but he was not spectacular like Lawler.  Intelligence was his gift, he knew where to be and when to be there, and developed a great relationship reading Zach's mind.  Countless CFL receivers have filled this role over time from Ben Cahoun to Darren Flutie, they're worth is invaluable to team success. 

Clercius is more of a physical specimen and seems steady but he hasn't done anything yet to distinguish his style of play, IMO he's still behind Woli in terms of value to the team, the difference is age.

As for JFG I think we've been through this argument before, he's not a good example of a poor Natl. receiver, he was a steady, shifty receiver who played with grit who could also return punts if called upon.  Of course he was below Demski level, but most CDN receivers are, he fits in the category of Gord Patterson when compared to Joe Poplawski.  He also played with Matt Nichols who was not as daring or as skilled as Zach hitting the deeper routes.