Blue Bombers Forum

The Extra Point => Blue Bomber & CFL Discussion Forum => Topic started by: ModAdmin on December 18, 2021, 06:45:13 AM



Title: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: ModAdmin on December 18, 2021, 06:45:13 AM
Lucky Whitehouse appears to be available.  Do we sign him?  Who would he potentially replace?


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 18, 2021, 07:35:11 AM
What if we lose Lawler or Bailey to a gross higher offer like earnest Jackson or Darrel walker got a couple of years ago?? We d obviously replace them with another big name FA. I think we ll no doubt lose some players to big paydays by other clubs and signing another FA from another club at a more reasonable cap,friendly hit will play out.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: TecnoGenius on December 18, 2021, 07:37:29 AM
Total pass.  Not a match at all for Buck, for Zach or for MOS.  Heck, we had him and often didn't dress him!!

The only way we go for Lucky is if Grant leaves.  If Grant leaves then you must get Lucky!  Then Lucky becomes primarily returner again.  Alligator-arms won't help much on O, except maybe the odd special package.  But even that is a dream as we can't afford to pay "just a returner" Lucky-level big money.

BC will backup the truck to retain him, he's as big a star as Burnham now.  Any FA-ness of Lucky will just be a negotiating ploy to try to keep his salary in check.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: the paw on December 18, 2021, 11:28:09 AM
Lucky Whitehouse appears to be available.  Do we sign him?  Who would he potentially replace?

My philosophy would be that when you win a Grey Cup, your starting assumption is that you bring back every starter and primary backup that you can afford.  Only if you can't bring them back do you look to free agent replacements.

Through the year, I was wondering if Darvin Adams might be on the way out.  But not only did he make clutch catches in the big game, I think he doesn't get enough credit for his blocking and the role he plays as an enforcer after the whistle.  He is always in the grill of any defender who is taking liberties.  I like the balance of our receiving corps, any of the five can make clutch catches and big plays.

Even if we do lose one of our receivers though, I don't think we replace them with Lucky.  He improved greatly as a receiver since he was here, and would be expensive.  I think BC will retain him, but even if he tests the market, I don't think we can afford him.  Our receiver money is going to be spent hanging onto Lawler.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 18, 2021, 12:44:04 PM
Probably not but it depends on who we lose if any in free agency. I'm not opposed but SMS and fit could be significant issues. A bigger issue is ratio, roster size and use of DI's. He would be valuable as an injury replacement, role player to add a different dynamic to the offence. As a full time player he has some limitations.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Jesse on December 18, 2021, 01:38:56 PM
I would like to see him back, but don't see how it happens.

Gonna be tough to keep together as much of the team as possible, and I don't think we can add a big salary to the receiving room.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 18, 2021, 02:06:40 PM
If we?re going to spend money, it?s going to be to retain the receivers we have. If it plays out that one or some are braking the budget some tough calls are going to have to be made and Walters is going to have to find the money elsewhere on the roster or go elsewhere for a reciever. I can?t help but think Bailey and Lawler are in for a pay increase, And rightfully so, especially Lawler , the leagues leading reciever. He ll both get some offers from other teams as well as be asking for a pay increase from KW, priority would be to resign him. Bailey would be of secondary importance, priority would be to get Lawler under contract as well as ZC, with ZC being THE #1 priority offensively for the club.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Sec223 on December 18, 2021, 02:17:38 PM
Speedy B :)


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 18, 2021, 02:28:13 PM
Banks had a down year and is trending in the wrong direction for my cheque book. I?d take Lawler and Bailey over him any day as both are in addition to being good receivers, both can block like heck and support our run game and this often gets overlooked. We have 2 great backs waiting anxiously in the wings, our run game needs receivers who can block, and a 140 lb speedy B can?t block worth beans. Hard pass on banks


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Sir Blue and Gold on December 18, 2021, 03:49:34 PM
If we need a receiver we could do a lot worse than Lucky. It would be pretty interesting to see what teams would do with Lucky and Lawler on the field at once. Hard to double both of them consistently. On the other hand, it's hard to see how we could fit Lucky back into the fold if all the receivers come back. Assuming they come back, perhaps we could trade/replace Darvin Adams with Lucky although I don't think Walters and O'Shea would do that given the loyalty Adams has shown over the years. On paper though, that move probably makes us better.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Waffler on December 18, 2021, 03:57:58 PM
I liked Lucky from the beginning minus the comment disparaging our DBs he made before playing us this year. That said, pretty impossible to know what the roster would look like later. If it was a straight up trade, I prefer him over the oft-injured Darvin Adams. Bless him for his play in the Grey Cup though.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 18, 2021, 04:00:49 PM
Lucky would give us depth at the returner position, but not sure he?s a better blocker than Adams and sure as heck doesn?t have hands like Adams. I think priority goes to resigning Lawler, Bailey and Demski and whitehead doesn?t fit in cap wise after that as there will be a bunch of key players looking for raises ie our O line.  Pass on this notion


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: the paw on December 18, 2021, 04:26:11 PM
If we need a receiver we could do a lot worse than Lucky. It would be pretty interesting to see what teams would do with Lucky and Lawler on the field at once. Hard to double both of them consistently. On the other hand, it's hard to see how we could fit Lucky back into the fold if all the receivers come back. Assuming they come back, perhaps we could trade/replace Darvin Adams with Lucky although I don't think Walters and O'Shea would do that given the loyalty Adams has shown over the years. On paper though, that move probably makes us better.

If we end up needing a receiver, I think either Acklin or Dunbar would be a good fit, and probably less expensive.  If we?re willing to take a chance, I think both Derel Walker and Shaq Evans would benefit from a change of scenery, and be very affordable after down years.  I expect both of them to rebound, but there is a certain risk.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 18, 2021, 04:28:37 PM
No to Lucky, he isn't physical enough to block and that should now be a major requirement of all Bomber receivers, they need to have enough grit to be physical.  Darvin developed that over time but when he first came to the Bombers he was a bean pole.

If Lawler gets a $200,000 offer from another team Kyle should let him walk, top end for a receiver should stay around $160,000.  It took years for the Bombers to find a receiver of his caliber but they can't break the bank to retain him.  There will be plenty of top tier receivers available in F.A. as there always are, find one within the budget with good hands and grit.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: GOLDMEMBER on December 18, 2021, 04:50:54 PM
To injury prone. Pass.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: DM83 on December 18, 2021, 05:58:28 PM
He seems to want to be here,  imagine, a guy who wants Tobe partof  winnipeg team


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 18, 2021, 06:55:59 PM
If we end up needing a receiver, I think either Acklin or Dunbar would be a good fit, and probably less expensive.  If we?re willing to take a chance, I think both Derel Walker and Shaq Evans would benefit from a change of scenery, and be very affordable after down years.  I expect both of them to rebound, but there is a certain risk.
Hard no to both Walker and Evan's, both trending in strong direction. It seemed they both quit/gave up this year . We dont need quitters on this team


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 18, 2021, 07:34:20 PM
Hard no to both Walker and Evan's, both trending in strong direction. It seemed they both quit/gave up this year . We dont need quitters on this team

If they have to pickup a F.A. to replace Lawler, I would take a run at Buster Rhymes from BC and keep an eye on the Argos and Stamps lists to see who they can't renew.  Problems is, if every top receiver is looking for bigger bucks it becomes more difficult to find a good receiver at a fair price. 

Bombers depth fails them at this position, they dicked around with Nelson for years and McKnight who are not good enough to step up and become major contributors.  Bombers also have a WR named Mekale McKay on their F.A. list, I have no idea who he is.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: pjrocksmb on December 18, 2021, 09:04:19 PM
His price tag will be very high, love the player but like other said unless we lose our aces, pass.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 18, 2021, 09:49:59 PM
I m interested in seeing where burnham and Elingson go. I remember seeing burnham frustrsted a number of times this past season and elingson  probably can?t get out of Edmonton fast enough. I would think both would want to go to contenders and donor dwell in obscurity while the clubs they?re presently on flounder away, and both those teams aren?t getting to contender status in a year, and these elite receivers have time ticking on their careers.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Lincoln Locomotive on December 19, 2021, 01:59:43 AM
A team should never stand pat with their roster even after winning a championship back to back.   We will likely retain many of our core players however everyone has a price and that may be a factor with some players more than others.    Lucky is now an all star and he fit into a BC offensive system that well let's face it...wasn't working for various reasons.   Could he fit into ours?   Buck is creative and he would have to adapt to our system which is more about ball control and grinding out yardage in tough conditions.    As much as I liked him as a returner I'm not 100% sure he'd fit in to our receiving core.    For Mike O'Shea, fitting into the team model IS everything....so having said that...he wouldn't necessarily be a lock to fit in despite his talent and physical attributes.   He'd be a thoroughbred trying to fit in with a team of draught horses.

That's the short and long of it and I'm not sure either Walters or MOS will bite on the prospect of signing him as much as I and and some others on this forum would like to see it happen.     


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: TecnoGenius on December 19, 2021, 02:15:09 AM
Lucky is now an all star and he fit into a BC offensive system that well let's face it...wasn't working for various reasons.   Could he fit into ours?   Buck is creative and he would have to adapt to our system which is more about ball control and grinding out yardage in tough conditions.    As much as I liked him as a returner I'm not 100% sure he'd fit in to our receiving core.

I think the consensus is we all like Lucky, and he's clearly a great player, and even fits in great with the "MOS Locker Room (TM)".

What's in dispute is would he be useful to the Bombers.  Some (including me) say probably not (except as a returner).

Maybe it's best we let Lucky shine with ball-chucking teams and QBs... just like BC and M.Reilly!  Who here didn't enjoy watching Lucky light up the league most of the season?  He never would have gotten that opportunity here.

Where else would he make a good fit...?  TOR & MBT would be good.  Maybe MTL/VAJ: though they already have a few Lucky-lites.  Maybe Lapo might be interested if he can get a QB.  Or whatever team ends up with Evans -- especially if Speedy B retires.  Lucky is basically the next Speedy, minus the hands.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 19, 2021, 02:53:14 PM
I think the consensus is we all like Lucky, and he's clearly a great player, and even fits in great with the "MOS Locker Room (TM)".

What's in dispute is would he be useful to the Bombers.  Some (including me) say probably not (except as a returner).

Maybe it's best we let Lucky shine with ball-chucking teams and QBs... just like BC and M.Reilly!  Who here didn't enjoy watching Lucky light up the league most of the season?  He never would have gotten that opportunity here.

Where else would he make a good fit...?  TOR & MBT would be good.  Maybe MTL/VAJ: though they already have a few Lucky-lites.  Maybe Lapo might be interested if he can get a QB.  Or whatever team ends up with Evans -- especially if Speedy B retires.  Lucky is basically the next Speedy, minus the hands.

I see him staying in BC as long as Reilly is their QB, BC needs recognizable "star power" and Lucky can help provide that.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: BLUEBOMBER on December 22, 2021, 02:16:45 AM
If Lucky is not too expensive, I would take him in case we lose a receiver from FA or injury.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 27, 2021, 08:10:36 PM
Lucky just had a career year, he?s going to be expensive, his stock is at an all time high


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: DM83 on December 28, 2021, 06:48:34 AM
Goofy topic.
Lucky was not good enough for,the NFL, and the Bombers.
Fantastic player, probably even better person.
Until,he overcomes his inconsistency he will always get cut.
It's pretty simple, he's not dependable.
As a limited  player( returner) or a jet. Sweep guy, yes he is.  But he's not an ever down receiver

Lawler is awesome, but probably too slow for the NFL, like Steagal and hundreds of others.
I personally think most CFL receivers coul,dHe fitted into a role.  But,....tons of competition, and odds of starting long.
In Canada, those  types of receivers. Have more flexibility.  He doesn't have to be 6'2"  or,run a 4.3 40 yRd dash.  Lawler, and the entire. blue Bomber group have their own unique niche.

Actually every team lost that this last year.

You need a burner -speedy B
A bigger almost as fast, but great hands -Lawler
The second  receiver option- Bailey emerged
A Fast Canadian- Oak Park kid, Nik Demski.
The slow dependable Cdn -Wolitarski

The other guy out there also a U of M kid would be ......played for Toronto.  (Now he may be too beat up.)

Your turn - there are the categories - can you fill them
M in for the other teams.?

For other teams, - Go ahead and fill in a guy in. Each of those categories . 
When you have, then you. Probably have a winning team. This past year not many guys.

I state  that no other team had that combination.
A good QB
A superior  o line that run blocks, pancakes people and looks like they aimed to take. Guys. Five yards or more,downfield.
 A decent RB
A team first  defence.

Lastly, The culture,was accountability and responsibility. Team. Policed, the players. Of course that goes without saying.  A problem in the lockeroom. Or with something is handled in house. ( Lawler)

Also,  the Canadian Mafia. Led the way.  The signing of new contracts by. Gove ia, and McManus is beyond huge. Those five guys are probably all related. By bad option to each other now. They all seem to know what has to be done. then the assistants also have bought in, and then the  door-keepers.

I bet they realize theynhave something special here, and when you have that, there isn't much of anything better..

While Lucky is super, he deserved better, and everyone wanted it for him.





Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: TecnoGenius on December 28, 2021, 10:14:03 AM
Until,he overcomes his inconsistency he will always get cut.
It's pretty simple, he's not dependable.

Great post.  Your phone auto-correct always makes one really have to think hard to decipher what you're saying.  ;D

Yes, Lucky is not dependable, IMHO mostly because he has no hands.  Just awful hands.  I don't know if his arms are short and stubby or something, but total T-rex arms.  OK, I've said that a million times.  Here's the question: Did Speedy B also have bad hands and that's why they relegated him to return duty?  Or did he have great hands and just nobody knew?  The answer to that question could spell the future for Lucky... if Banks had bad hands and somehow improved, there's hope for Lucky.  Maybe there are clinics/coaches that can help with that?

Lawler is awesome, but probably too slow for the NFL, like Steagal and hundreds of others.

Yes, like you said, Lawler too slow and short and skinny.  Same as it ever was in the NFL.  Like you said, the age old question: be a superstar winner in the CFL or a nobody PR 1-year-max guy in the NFL.  But I guess a year of NFL PR money is worth 10 CFL starter years, eh?  But I would hope he'd remember the team that dev'd him to stardom when he returns...

The other guy out there also a U of M kid would be ......played for Toronto.  (Now he may be too beat up.)

Your turn - there are the categories - can you fill them
M in for the other teams.?

Coombs?  He really fell off the radar since 2018 or 2019.  Dropped a lot and doesn't get many reps or attempts.

As for other teams O being complete like WPG... don't think it exists.  HAM 2019 was close.  An O where every player is a weapon is rare.  Maybe BC came close?  TOR was close too.  MTL looked like they were getting there but really petered out and started focusing on just 1-2 WRs.  This is a great question for fantasy fanatics because that's precisely the question we face every week, but in reverse.  In fantasy it's actually easier when the team has 1-2 good WRs.  It's when the whole corps is good that it gets tough (like WPG)... you never know who's going to blow it up each game because they all take turns!  I picked Lawler in GC and it was a horrible, awful, expensive waste.  I was proud to see so many Bomber fans picked Adams though, what foresight and confidence!  Adams was the best price/points ratio on our team that game.

I state  that no other team had that combination.
A good QB
A superior  o line that run blocks, pancakes people and looks like they aimed to take. Guys. Five yards or more,downfield.
 A decent RB
A team first  defence.

You state correctly.  No one was even close in 2021.  HAM was in 2019 though, but their OL imploded in the GC.  I think the biggest stumbling block for teams is the RB spot.  There are so few legit RBs in 2021.  Besides AH, Stanback and Powell, no other RB scared me at all.  Even Powell was fading.  JWJ wildly inconsistent, though much improved over 2019.

I think what we can learn from the WPG dynasty, and even CGY's past dynasty, is that you almost always need a top-2 RB to win the GC.  You must have a strong run game.

As for the Mafia, I think the biggest surprise is how we really didn't skip a beat with Lapo->Buck.  Mafia played that one masterfully.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Sec223 on December 28, 2021, 10:38:24 AM
With Lucky showing up in the stands here I get the feeling he's using the Bombers to get a raise with the Lions ?


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 28, 2021, 01:38:01 PM
I don't know why so many posters seem to want to slag Whitehead. He had a higher reception rate than Lawler. Sure I'd take Lawler over Whitehead but that doesn't mean Whitehead is not a good receiver. Whitehead improved over 2019 and there is no reason to not believe he won't continue to improve in 2022.

He wouldn't have fit our 2021 roster but if we had room for a receiver as a DI that might have been an option. Obviously SMS is always a question.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Jesse on December 28, 2021, 02:36:13 PM
With Lucky showing up in the stands here I get the feeling he's using the Bombers to get a raise with the Lions ?

Or he's just a guy who wanted to party with his friends.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: theaardvark on December 28, 2021, 03:18:09 PM
With Lucky showing up in the stands here I get the feeling he's using the Bombers to get a raise with the Lions ?

Pretty sure that would work AGAINST getting a raise.... wearing the competition's gear while still under contract?  Easier to get you released...  would Geroy be interested in bringing him to Edm?  Guess it depends on who the OC/QB are...


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 28, 2021, 06:28:59 PM
Attending the Bomber game doesn't mean he ends up here or doesn't end up in Vancouver. Teams make decisions on their needs and he was important and well liked in Vancouver. Burnham might be the receiver on the bubble from an SMS point of view. If Reilly leaves the Lions then all bets are off.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Pigskin on December 28, 2021, 07:02:16 PM
If Lawler was to sign with an NFL team, I could see the bombers taking a shot at Lucky. Bailey also had a very good year for the bombers and turned into one of our go to receivers. Adams is one of the best blocking receivers in the league, and can make plays.  Demski is rock solid, and Woli showed in the 4th. quarter of the GC, that if you throw him the ball he can make plays.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 28, 2021, 10:15:59 PM
If Lawler was to sign with an NFL team, I could see the bombers taking a shot at Lucky. Bailey also had a very good year for the bombers and turned into one of our go to receivers. Adams is one of the best blocking receivers in the league, and can make plays.  Demski is rock solid, and Woli showed in the 4th. quarter of the GC, that if you throw him the ball he can make plays.

If Lawler signed elsewhere I expect the Bombers to bring around 10 new receivers to camp to see if they could find his immediate replacement, they seem to do this every year regardless of need.  The Bomber receiving corps. without Lawler drops off a cliff in terms of effectiveness, without a dominant #1 receiver they are solid but middle of the pack, much as they were the previous decade before he showed up.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 29, 2021, 12:35:33 AM
If we lose Lawler ?-heaven forbid!!, I would go hard after burnham, forget whitehead.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: ModAdmin on December 29, 2021, 12:50:38 AM
IF Kenny Lawler moved on to the NFL I could see the Bombers make a serious offer to Burnham.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: DM83 on December 29, 2021, 11:49:27 AM
Burnham like Lawler ...too slow for. Permanent work in the NFL.
Perfect for the CFL.
QBs had no pass protection.  A lot of guys wasted.
Salary cap has to rise.

Lucky was very exciting. Just too inconsistent.   


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 29, 2021, 12:52:29 PM
If Lawler signed elsewhere I expect the Bombers to bring around 10 new receivers to camp to see if they could find his immediate replacement, they seem to do this every year regardless of need.  The Bomber receiving corps. without Lawler drops off a cliff in terms of effectiveness, without a dominant #1 receiver they are solid but middle of the pack, much as they were the previous decade before he showed up.

Bombers bring in a dozen or more receivers every TC. They look at even more in open camps etc.  Take a look at who we ended up with on the PR. Only McKnight made the game day roster for a few games. That's in the time between the end of 2019 and beginning of 2021.

Whitehead may have his issues but our track record finding receivers has been horrible. We need to hang on to Lawler and Bailey.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Lincoln Locomotive on December 29, 2021, 03:26:23 PM
Bombers bring in a dozen or more receivers every TC. They look at even more in open camps etc.  Take a look at who we ended up with on the PR. Only McKnight made the game day roster for a few games. That's in the time between the end of 2019 and beginning of 2021.

Whitehead may have his issues but our track record finding receivers has been horrible. We need to hang on to Lawler and Bailey.
Bailey impressed with his YAC and determination....also showed good speed on jet sweeps.    He had his best year as a Bomber as did Lawler who was number 1 in the league.   


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 29, 2021, 03:53:10 PM
Bailey impressed with his YAC and determination....also showed good speed on jet sweeps.    He had his best year as a Bomber as did Lawler who was number 1 in the league.   

Bailey showed promise in 2019 when he got playing time. Lapo didn't use him as much in deeper routes but he was very reliable. I was optimistic he would excel in 2021 and he lived up to my hopes.

That said I have a similar thought about McKnight being able to progress in 2022. He also ran the shorter possession type routes. While he didn't jump out, Collaros told Pierce and O'Shea that the team needed to keep him around in early TC. I have to believe they see his potential.

Now I'm still hoping we can keep both Lawler and Bailey as starters in 2022 and beyond. However someone like McKnight could improve and be that depth guy every team needs at least a couple.

Expecting a CFL rookie to be prominent doesn't always happen in their 1st season.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 29, 2021, 04:41:33 PM
Bailey showed promise in 2019 when he got playing time. Lapo didn't use him as much in deeper routes but he was very reliable. I was optimistic he would excel in 2021 and he lived up to my hopes.

That said I have a similar thought about McKnight being able to progress in 2022. He also ran the shorter possession type routes. While he didn't jump out, Collaros told Pierce and O'Shea that the team needed to keep him around in early TC. I have to believe they see his potential.

Now I'm still hoping we can keep both Lawler and Bailey as starters in 2022 and beyond. However someone like McKnight could improve and be that depth guy every team needs at least a couple.

Expecting a CFL rookie to be prominent doesn't always happen in their 1st season.

Good point, that's usually the case, plenty of vet receivers will become F.A. this spring, Armanti Edwards is already available, not saying he is the answer but they could bring in 2-3 vets of a higher calibre to compete and let the best win the job, cut the rest to save salary. 

If Nelson and McNight are the "next up" best, that's not super impressive.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: kkc60 on December 29, 2021, 04:45:10 PM
If Nelson and McNight are the "next up" best, that's not super impressive.
There should be no reason Nelson is back. 3 years here, hasn't shown anything that says he's developing.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: theaardvark on December 29, 2021, 04:53:10 PM
2022 FA season is going to be weird. 

Budgets might not be known, blowing a big chunk to recruit away a guy like Lawler might just hamstring you.  I can see the top spots are each position still demanding top dollar, but with a haircut off the max... guys who could make $225k in 2019 might be looking at $190k... getting a player to stay all things being equal is going to be easier for the two time defending GC champs, for sure. 

Unless Jones is willing to make some stupid offers (we is famous for ding the opposite), or OTT's new GM making a few splashes for Lapo, I'm thinking we're going to be pretty safe. 

We ARE going to lose players, we won't be able to sign everyone, I am already OK with that.  With our scouts still here, and the core group still here, and our coaches still here, I'm confident going forward.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 29, 2021, 05:41:45 PM
Good point, that's usually the case, plenty of vet receivers will become F.A. this spring, Armanti Edwards is already available, not saying he is the answer but they could bring in 2-3 vets of a higher calibre to compete and let the best win the job, cut the rest to save salary. 

If Nelson and McNight are the "next up" best, that's not super impressive.

Bringing in vet receivers has never been something that worked out for the Bombers. I agree that Nelson's time in Winnipeg is probably done unless Grant departs in free agency. Then he's pencilled in as the returner in TC until someone beats him out.

We need the dust to settle to see who we lose and who might be a good alternative. Free agency starts around Feb 8th IIRC.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: GCn19 on December 29, 2021, 05:56:59 PM
I was very impressed by the season Lucky was having, but we don't need him. If Lawler goes then he might be someone we target.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: blueraid on December 29, 2021, 06:13:48 PM
IF Lawler decides to leave, then Whitehead would be an option but the better move would be to offer a solid contract to Burnham.....IF Michael Riley isn't behind centre in B.C. then Burnham might decide to look for greener pastures....The duo of Riley and Burnham were pretty tight BUT all bets are off if Riley isn't their qb.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 29, 2021, 06:42:14 PM
Burnham ain?t getting any younger and I m thinking he wants to play for a winner for a change. If we went after him, I think he?s come here vs stay on the left coast and continue to lose, after all, he?s be the #1 receiver on the defending grey cup champs, contending for a 3rd


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: GCn19 on December 29, 2021, 07:08:01 PM
Burnham ain?t getting any younger and I m thinking he wants to play for a winner for a change. If we went after him, I think he?s come here vs stay on the left coast and continue to lose, after all, he?s be the #1 receiver on the defending grey cup champs, contending for a 3rd

Burnham has snubbed us twice already. I wouldn't even waste my time on him if I were Walters. Plus he is at the age of diminishing returns.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Jesse on December 29, 2021, 07:29:50 PM
Burnham has snubbed us twice already. I wouldn't even waste my time on him if I were Walters. Plus he is at the age of diminishing returns.

That?s how I feel too.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 29, 2021, 11:21:52 PM
That?s fine, he can waste away on the left coast, shame that talent will never win a cup.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: blue_or_die on December 30, 2021, 12:44:06 AM
If we lose Lawler to the NFL, we should go after Burn'em. If we lose Adams to retirement or decide to move on from him for whatever reason, we should go after Lucky. And yes I realize Adams and Lucky are very different players but where they are in their careers are clear #2 receivers. We shall see what the great free agency of 2022 brings to see what our needs actually are, but should we find ourselves short a few players, we have options to replace them and going to a back2back championship team is a no-brainer.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: BLUEBOMBER on December 30, 2021, 04:12:30 AM
Lawler is good but he is not big and strong enough to be an NFL receiver. He shouldn't waste his time down there but if he decides to go and try to get a bigger paycheck or ask for more money from other cash strapped CFL teams then go for it.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 30, 2021, 03:36:39 PM
Lawler is good but he is not big and strong enough to be an NFL receiver. He shouldn't waste his time down there but if he decides to go and try to get a bigger paycheck or ask for more money from other cash strapped CFL teams then go for it.

I don't know anything about the NFL process, are the players who get invited to NFL TC's well paid for attending, or do they have to at least make the PR to cash in?  Jeopardizing an earned spot in the CFL may not be worth it for those who only get tryouts and not TC invites.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on December 30, 2021, 04:27:11 PM
I don't know anything about the NFL process, are the players who get invited to NFL TC's well paid for attending, or do they have to at least make the PR to cash in?  Jeopardizing an earned spot in the CFL may not be worth it for those who only get tryouts and not TC invites.

It's a risk assessment for players and NFL tryouts. The depth on a given team and signing bonus might indicate how good their chances are to make a roster. OTOH they can see how other top players have fared.

Realistically I don't expect Lawler or Bailey to have a significant chance in the NFL. Size, speed, age against a large group of young draft choices to contend with each year. NFL free agent movement / acquisitions.

That doesn't mean they won't accept a tryout and / or TC contract. The dream and money are big. Can't blame them. OTOH a few of our good players have had NFL PR's etc a few times and may not want to go throught that again.



Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: blueraid on December 30, 2021, 05:34:17 PM
Just wondering IF the nfl would be a little offish with Lawler because of the dui charge....I don't know what their policy is regarding something like that....Could be a hindrance regarding him getting a looksee????


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on December 30, 2021, 07:06:05 PM
It's a risk assessment for players and NFL tryouts. The depth on a given team and signing bonus might indicate how good their chances are to make a roster. OTOH they can see how other top players have fared.

Realistically I don't expect Lawler or Bailey to have a significant chance in the NFL. Size, speed, age against a large group of young draft choices to contend with each year. NFL free agent movement / acquisitions.

That doesn't mean they won't accept a tryout and / or TC contract. The dream and money are big. Can't blame them. OTOH a few of our good players have had NFL PR's etc a few times and may not want to go throught that again.

I believe Bighill decided to come back to the CFL to play rather than spend his time chasing the NFL dream, he  bounced between the Saints roster/PR 4 times during 2017, before finally requesting his official release in May of 2018.  If Bighill was 2-4" taller he could have had a solid NFL career.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on December 31, 2021, 10:20:18 PM
Just wondering IF the nfl would be a little offish with Lawler because of the dui charge....I don't know what their policy is regarding something like that....Could be a hindrance regarding him getting a looksee????
Wouldn?t matter a bit. The NFL is full of players on drugs or alcohol or both, associated with gangs/shootings, players that have openly assaulted their girlfriends or been shot by their girlfriends, a guy who has a dui wouldn?t even raise an eyebrow. Non issue. That said, Lawler isn?t fast enough to play in the nfl, he ll have a great career though in the cfl.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: RebusRankin on January 02, 2022, 03:16:46 PM
If we're looking for a free agent receiver, Jake Weinke would top my list.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: dd on January 02, 2022, 04:01:21 PM
If we're looking for a free agent receiver, Jake Weinke would top my list.
He had a great year and caught everything that came his way. He was the #2 receiver in Montreal behind Lewis, could he be as effective if he was the #1 read and drew the tighter coverage from the defense like Lewis did??


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on January 02, 2022, 04:21:17 PM
If we're looking for a free agent receiver, Jake Weinke would top my list.

He's a good receiver but he looks slow to me.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on January 02, 2022, 05:03:45 PM
If we're looking for a free agent receiver, Jake Weinke would top my list.

Good receiver but it would depend on who he'd replace and how we'd use him. He's more of an inside guy than an outside guy IMO. In that sense he'd be a candidate for Bailey's role if he was to leave. Where either fit from an SMS point of view I don't know.

Given the same or similar SMS I'm sticking with Bailey though


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: theaardvark on January 02, 2022, 05:51:44 PM
If we're looking for a free agent receiver, Jake Weinke would top my list.

Much bigger Wolitarsky fan than Winker.  He is here, he's a part of this team, and he's every bit as reliable as Weinke. 

Much rather re-sign Wolitarski... but sure, if we lose him, Weineke is a good replacement...


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on January 02, 2022, 07:01:17 PM
Much bigger Wolitarsky fan than Winker.  He is here, he's a part of this team, and he's every bit as reliable as Weinke. 

Much rather re-sign Wolitarski... but sure, if we lose him, Weineke is a good replacement...

Not really an accurate assessment /comparison and Woli is designated as a National. Weineke is an import. Weineke has double the yardage and significantly more passes thrown his way. We all like Woli but he's a less used receiver based on where he lines up and who are other receivers fall into the route tree.

I'd be happy to re-sign Woli but the fact he's designated as a National goes a long way into that comment.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: theaardvark on January 02, 2022, 08:25:31 PM
Not really an accurate assessment /comparison and Woli is designated as a National. Weineke is an import. Weineke has double the yardage and significantly more passes thrown his way. We all like Woli but he's a less used receiver based on where he lines up and who are other receivers fall into the route tree.

I'd be happy to re-sign Woli but the fact he's designated as a National goes a long way into that comment.

Wow... I had always thought Weineke was a Nat.  Not sure why..  then that doubles my commitment to getting Woli back.  The job Weineke does is what I expect from a Nat... big, possession, 2nd down / TD kind of rec.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: the paw on January 02, 2022, 10:53:43 PM
Wow... I had always thought Weineke was a Nat.  Not sure why..  then that doubles my commitment to getting Woli back.  The job Weineke does is what I expect from a Nat... big, possession, 2nd down / TD kind of rec.

Wow, are you out to lunch on this one.  Weineke had more than double the yards of Woli.  He was the 5th leading receiver in the whole league, and #1 in TDs.  His number of plays over 30 yards, his YAC all point to the fact he is more than just a possession receiver.  I love Woli, but its apples and oranges.  Now, Weineke versus Demski is a fairer comparison, and I would definite prefer Demski over Weineke for a number of reasons.

We can't afford to sign Weineke unless we lose Lawler.  He will command more than either Bailey or Adams in free agency.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on January 03, 2022, 01:35:40 PM
Wow, are you out to lunch on this one.  Weineke had more than double the yards of Woli.  He was the 5th leading receiver in the whole league, and #1 in TDs.  His number of plays over 30 yards, his YAC all point to the fact he is more than just a possession receiver.  I love Woli, but its apples and oranges.  Now, Weineke versus Demski is a fairer comparison, and I would definite prefer Demski over Weineke for a number of reasons.

We can't afford to sign Weineke unless we lose Lawler.  He will command more than either Bailey or Adams in free agency.

Actually Lawler led the league in TD's with 10 compared to Weineke at 7 tied with 4 others. Something to take into account for any receiver is how good is the rest of the receiving corps and the distribution by the QB.

Overall Winnipeg's starting 5 were much better and the ball was distributed more to 3rd, 4th and 5th receivers. In Montreal there was a significant drop off after Lewis and Weineke.

Woli was really our 5th option most of the time based on where he lined up etc etc.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: the paw on January 03, 2022, 03:39:51 PM
Actually Lawler led the league in TD's with 10 compared to Weineke at 7 tied with 4 others.

You are misreading the stats.  Lawler had 10 plays over 30 yards and only 6 TDs.  Not that Lawler is the point, the issue under debate is whether Wolitarsky is better than Weineke, which is a ridiculous proposition.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Blue In BC on January 03, 2022, 03:58:25 PM
You are misreading the stats.  Lawler had 10 plays over 30 yards and only 6 TDs.  Not that Lawler is the point, the issue under debate is whether Wolitarsky is better than Weineke, which is a ridiculous proposition.

Ah. You are correct, my bad.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: GCn19 on January 04, 2022, 05:33:11 PM
Weineke is a MUCH better receiver than Woli...however it's a moot point because Woli has the better passport.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: the paw on January 04, 2022, 06:01:08 PM
Weineke is a MUCH better receiver than Woli...however it's a moot point because Woli has the better passport.

Wolitarsky is a very solid receiver, and he could definitely put up more yards if he played in the slot.  But at this point, as a Canadian receiver I would rank him behind Demski, Gittens, Schaffer-Baker, Cottoy and Lemar Durant (if healthy).

I like him just as much as Lenius, Mike Jones, Shaq Johnson and Behar and would keep him over any of these these even though production is similar.

I would definitely keep him ahead of Shai Ross, Tevaughn Campbell, Ungerer, Picton, Malaya or Sidani.



Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: TecnoGenius on January 05, 2022, 07:42:58 AM
Wolitarsky is a very solid receiver, and he could definitely put up more yards if he played in the slot.  But at this point, as a Canadian receiver I would rank him behind Demski, Gittens, Schaffer-Baker, Cottoy and Lemar Durant (if healthy).

I like him just as much as Lenius, Mike Jones, Shaq Johnson and Behar and would keep him over any of these these even though production is similar.

I would definitely keep him ahead of Shai Ross, Tevaughn Campbell, Ungerer, Picton, Malaya or Sidani.

Have to disagree.  Woli is ahead of Cottoy/Lemar.  The rest of your list is good.

Woli made big clutch catches in both 2019 and 2021 playoffs and GCs.  That's major pressure situations that show a lot about a player.  Except for 1 or 2 games this year where Woli seemed to have the dropsies or some issue, he's always solid when targeted, and can take the big hits and hang on.  He has pretty good hands too.

Remember, Woli is in the position where JFG failed to catch a single rail pass in X years and like 10 attempts.  Woli makes those catches.

Lemar has gone downhill majorly and Cottoy, meh.  Started big in 2021 then fell off the radar.

You are right that KSB is one to watch.  Kid is a monster, a NAT version of Gronk.  What a find for SSK.  And Gittens is like a Lawler-lite with a passport.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: GCn19 on January 05, 2022, 01:36:33 PM
Wolitarsky is a very solid receiver, and he could definitely put up more yards if he played in the slot.  But at this point, as a Canadian receiver I would rank him behind Demski, Gittens, Schaffer-Baker, Cottoy and Lemar Durant (if healthy).

I like him just as much as Lenius, Mike Jones, Shaq Johnson and Behar and would keep him over any of these these even though production is similar.

I would definitely keep him ahead of Shai Ross, Tevaughn Campbell, Ungerer, Picton, Malaya or Sidani.



Like anything else it's all relative to price vs production. If Woli doesn't demand the moon he is a perfect fit in the 5th receiver slot in our offence and I would be more than happy to have him back.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Jesse on January 05, 2022, 03:45:06 PM
Like anything else it's all relative to price vs production. If Woli doesn't demand the moon he is a perfect fit in the 5th receiver slot in our offence and I would be more than happy to have him back.

Woli's already received at least a second contract from us. There's not a lot of negotiation room for either side. I think he's already penciled in.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on January 05, 2022, 04:05:22 PM
Woli's already received at least a second contract from us. There's not a lot of negotiation room for either side. I think he's already penciled in.

The Bomber are fortunate to have Woli, but Woli is fortunate he has the Natl. loophole to hang onto, win/win.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on January 10, 2022, 04:14:43 PM
LIONS INK LUCKY WHITEHEAD THROUGH 2023

https://www.cfl.ca/2022/01/10/lions-ink-lucky-whitehead-2023/


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent
Post by: Jesse on January 10, 2022, 05:20:47 PM
Good for Lucky!


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: theaardvark on January 10, 2022, 06:21:12 PM
What the literal heck?



Justin Dunk@JDunk12

Explosive playmaker Lucky Whitehead becomes the highest paid receiver in the CFL at $200,000.

https://3downnation.com/2022/01/10/b-c-lions-re-sign-explosive-cfl-all-star-lucky-whitehead/


#BCLions #TheFlash #CFL


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Ridermania on January 10, 2022, 07:13:28 PM
Way overpaid at $200K


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: theaardvark on January 10, 2022, 07:33:34 PM
Way overpaid at $200K

Way, way, WAY overpaid.

Love the guy, he's a hoot and a heckuvalot of fun to watch, but one good year does not = $200k+ during COVID.  BC could have signed him for $150k easily... or less with incentives.

I guess they felt they needed to make a statement, a commitment, so they blew the wad on Lucky, who was about their only bright spot last year.  No doubt he sells tickets, but they are going to create a lot of SMS troubles with this signing. 


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Pigskin on January 10, 2022, 07:39:30 PM
Anyone know what the Cap is set at for this year?


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: the paw on January 10, 2022, 07:46:18 PM
When you think that Derel Walker had a 2021 contract for $180k and Shaq Evans was scheduled for $165k, Luckys new contract isn?t as outrageous as it first seems.

If he hadn?t broken his wrist, he would have been the leading CFL receiver.  I like Lawlers game more, but when you add in Lucky?s return ability, for a franchise looking to get fans excited, it?s probably fair value.

It does look like this will make retaining Lawler more challenging.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on January 10, 2022, 07:47:38 PM
Way, way, WAY overpaid.

Love the guy, he's a hoot and a heckuvalot of fun to watch, but one good year does not = $200k+ during COVID.  BC could have signed him for $150k easily... or less with incentives.

I guess they felt they needed to make a statement, a commitment, so they blew the wad on Lucky, who was about their only bright spot last year.  No doubt he sells tickets, but they are going to create a lot of SMS troubles with this signing. 

This makes it really difficult to sign Lawler for less but just because the Lions made a crazy offer doesn't mean Walters has to follow suite.  Offer Lawler a fair deal that fits within the team salary structure or let him walk, no certainty any other team is going to offer him $200,000+ either.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: blue_or_die on January 10, 2022, 08:16:46 PM
When you think that Derel Walker had a 2021 contract for $180k and Shaq Evans was scheduled for $165k, Luckys new contract isn?t as outrageous as it first seems.

If he hadn?t broken his wrist, he would have been the leading CFL receiver.  I like Lawlers game more, but when you add in Lucky?s return ability, for a franchise looking to get fans excited, it?s probably fair value.

It does look like this will make retaining Lawler more challenging.

Going into 2021, Walker and Evans were the class of the league as far as receivers went. Through that lens, I don't think of Lucky as in the same galaxy. When Lucky was having those big games at the beginning of the year, many including me said it wasn't sustainable and that he'd level off and I still firmly believe that.

Love the guy and I'm super happy for him, but bad deal for BC.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Pigskin on January 10, 2022, 09:46:12 PM
What do we think Burnham will be asking for?


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: the paw on January 10, 2022, 10:31:47 PM
Going into 2021, Walker and Evans were the class of the league as far as receivers went. Through that lens, I don't think of Lucky as in the same galaxy. When Lucky was having those big games at the beginning of the year, many including me said it wasn't sustainable and that he'd level off and I still firmly believe that.

Love the guy and I'm super happy for him, but bad deal for BC.

I understand your point.  I mentioned Walker and Evans specifically, as they kind of prove the point that past performance is no guarantee of future production.  Those 2 guys might bounce back, but it?s equally possible Whitehead has become a better receiver than both.

If you look at Luckys season in detail, it wasn?t just a hot start for a few games.  Although the stat sheets show he played 12/14 games, one of those games was the game he was injured, and one was his first game back, trying to play with a cast.  In reality, he put really good numbers fairly consistently over 10 games.   It?s fair to wonder if he sustains that in 2022, but you can?t really dismiss the 2021 production so easily.

If I was a GM, I don?t think I would have gone as high as $200k, but he is going to be the face of the franchise for the next couple of years, and maybe paying a bit of a marketing premium isn?t such bad business.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: pjrocksmb on January 10, 2022, 10:41:34 PM
Steep price but gotta over pay for a top receiver with incredible potential.  I think he will earn his salary if he can stay healthy and will certainly entertain us!


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: theaardvark on January 10, 2022, 10:45:32 PM
I understand your point.  I mentioned Walker and Evans specifically, as they kind of prove the point that past performance is no guarantee of future production.  Those 2 guys might bounce back, but it?s equally possible Whitehead has become a better receiver than both.

If you look at Luckys season in detail, it wasn?t just a hot start for a few games.  Although the stat sheets show he played 12/14 games, one of those games was the game he was injured, and one was his first game back, trying to play with a cast.  In reality, he put really good numbers fairly consistently over 10 games.   It?s fair to wonder if he sustains that in 2022, but you can?t really dismiss the 2021 production so easily.

If I was a GM, I don?t think I would have gone as high as $200k, but he is going to be the face of the franchise for the next couple of years, and maybe paying a bit of a marketing premium isn?t such bad business.

The key is, he's had part of one great year.  Yes, he was injured, but still, it was 10 games.  And he lands the biggest deal for a WR?  Plus, we don't know what this year will be, with COVID there might be further fan restrictions, and who knows what the landscape will be.  

So, BC has set an unrealistic bar for salaries, to retain a guy that, for sure, is a crowd pleaser (although he had PO'd a bunch of fans showing up in Bomber gear at the WF), and he will sell tickets, and they have a new owner trying to revitalize the franchise....

He could have been given an incentive laden contract, and he would have jumped at that.  I get that BC could ill afford to lose him in FA (which they pretty much assured they will lose Burnham now...), but they pulled the trigger far to fast for far too much.   In My Humble Opinion.

Lucky got very Lucky...


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: ichabod_crane on January 11, 2022, 12:32:41 AM
I guess the Lions still have not learned from the Reilly way overpaid fiasco and screw up their cap once again! :(


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: GOLDMEMBER on January 11, 2022, 01:23:35 AM
Way overpaid plus he likes to go to Blue Bomber home games. LOL

Injury prone liability


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: dd on January 11, 2022, 02:37:00 AM
The key is, he's had part of one great year.  Yes, he was injured, but still, it was 10 games.  And he lands the biggest deal for a WR?  Plus, we don't know what this year will be, with COVID there might be further fan restrictions, and who knows what the landscape will be.  

So, BC has set an unrealistic bar for salaries, to retain a guy that, for sure, is a crowd pleaser (although he had PO'd a bunch of fans showing up in Bomber gear at the WF), and he will sell tickets, and they have a new owner trying to revitalize the franchise....

He could have been given an incentive laden contract, and he would have jumped at that.  I get that BC could ill afford to lose him in FA (which they pretty much assured they will lose Burnham now...), but they pulled the trigger far to fast for far too much.   In My Humble Opinion.

Lucky got very Lucky...
If BC had a choice-lose burnham or whitehead, they chose the wrong guy!! Grotesquely overpaid for a bubble screen, throw it in his gut so he can catch it receiver. He caught teams flat footed and burned them, that won?t happen now. Bc now has the reciever version of mike Reilly- he?s grossly overpaid and will lay an egg this year. Worst signing since Ottawa signing Ernest Jackson a couple of years ago and we all know what happened after that. Same thing here.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: theaardvark on January 11, 2022, 03:32:19 PM
So, we won't see Lucky until the last game of the year....

As a STH 3 rows behind the visitors bench, it will be interesting to "talk" to Lucky.  If BC has a great year, and makes the playoffs, well, good on him.  But, should they meet expectations and suck, I can imagine the taunts about him earning his $200k... might not happen as he is genuinely a nice guy, and affable.  But still, the opportunity will present for "Well, at least YOU got paid" taunts... can see him now, smiling and shrugging his shoulders...


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Jesse on January 11, 2022, 03:47:14 PM
Nothing but love for Lucky.

Hope he earns every dollar (except against us).


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: theaardvark on January 11, 2022, 04:03:54 PM
Nothing but love for Lucky.

Hope he earns every dollar (except against us).

Noted:  Last game at home is against BC... hopefully too late for him to earn it then ;)


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: GCn19 on January 11, 2022, 04:57:19 PM
Hope Lucky earns his contract mostly against Saskatchewan. I would be cool with that.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: TecnoGenius on January 12, 2022, 01:58:50 AM
If he hadn?t broken his wrist, he would have been the leading CFL receiver.  I like Lawlers game more, but when you add in Lucky?s return ability, for a franchise looking to get fans excited, it?s probably fair value.

If I was a GM, I don?t think I would have gone as high as $200k, but he is going to be the face of the franchise for the next couple of years, and maybe paying a bit of a marketing premium isn?t such bad business.

Yes, how much of this is the "fan favorite" premium?  Lucky is such a perfect fit for BC... very flamboyant, always happy and smiling.  That's what the Lions want as the face of the franchise.  Burnham is a positive stick in the mud compared to Lucky.

However, even with that, they could have gotten him cheaper.  Bad bad GM moves here.

If BC had a choice-lose burnham or whitehead, they chose the wrong guy!! Grotesquely overpaid for a bubble screen, throw it in his gut so he can catch it receiver. He caught teams flat footed and burned them, that won?t happen now. Bc now has the reciever version of mike Reilly- he?s grossly overpaid and will lay an egg this year.

You nailed it.  Lucky is a great player, but they just paid $200k for a receiver who cannot catch with his hands!  What's up with that?  When has that ever happened before?  Worst hands out of all "franchise receivers", by miles, and he gets paid the most?  Yikes.

Hey, since these numbers are always "whisper" or "leaked" and not "official", what's to keep BC's GM from making up any number he wants, leaking that, to force other GMs to match those offers with their FA re-signings??  If that was possible, it would be an amazing ploy to bankrupt other teams...


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: dd on January 12, 2022, 02:54:28 AM
Hope Lucky earns his contract mostly against Saskatchewan. I would be cool with that.
Well he won?t get any against our D, we put him in his place last year and he was a total non factor.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Cool Spot on January 13, 2022, 02:30:38 AM
Lucky is a great player, but they just paid $200k for a receiver who cannot catch with his hands!  What's up with that?

Doesn't he also return kicks? He's pretty valuable in that position, too.

But agree that spending a lot of money in one position means you can't spend it elsewhere. I think that BC spending so much at the QB position (for Reilly) had already impacted their ability to spend in other places to create a more well-rounded supporting cast, and this will make things that much more difficult unless the combination of Reilly/Lucky/Burnham deliver so much value that they can afford to underspend in other positions.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: dd on January 13, 2022, 03:29:47 AM
I don?t think Reilly?s coming back this year but if he does, whiteheads contract guarantees it will be for less money


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: pjrocksmb on January 13, 2022, 03:34:36 AM
Way overpaid plus he likes to go to Blue Bomber home games. LOL

Injury prone liability
Overstated homer bias


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: ModAdmin on January 13, 2022, 04:02:54 AM
Overstated homer bias

$200K is overpaying no matter how you look at it.  2 years in the CFL, 4th in league receiving stats.  $150K - $160K would be a decent salary for his production.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: GCn19 on January 13, 2022, 12:21:43 PM
$200K is overpaying no matter how you look at it.  2 years in the CFL, 4th in league receiving stats.  $150K - $160K would be a decent salary for his production.

Lucky can be an electric player and is worth upper CFL receiver money. Unfortunately it seems BC still thinks it's pre-pandemic receiver rates and it will end up costing other teams a few more dollars than they were willing to spend now. How does BC management look at Begelton at 160k and then offer Lucky 200k? Baffling.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Blue In BC on January 13, 2022, 01:18:41 PM
It's going to cost us more to retain Lawler if in fact he remains in the CFL.



Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: 3rdand1.5 on January 13, 2022, 01:38:09 PM
I agree it seems he is 30-40k overpayed based on what we have seen so far based on other players. Good for him unfortunately I think we may have to be close to retain Lawler.. C'est La vie...


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: Throw Long Bannatyne on January 13, 2022, 03:00:15 PM
Yes, how much of this is the "fan favorite" premium?  Lucky is such a perfect fit for BC... very flamboyant, always happy and smiling.  That's what the Lions want as the face of the franchise.  Burnham is a positive stick in the mud compared to Lucky.

However, even with that, they could have gotten him cheaper.  Bad bad GM moves here.

You nailed it.  Lucky is a great player, but they just paid $200k for a receiver who cannot catch with his hands!  What's up with that?  When has that ever happened before?  Worst hands out of all "franchise receivers", by miles, and he gets paid the most?  Yikes.

Hey, since these numbers are always "whisper" or "leaked" and not "official", what's to keep BC's GM from making up any number he wants, leaking that, to force other GMs to match those offers with their FA re-signings??  If that was possible, it would be an amazing ploy to bankrupt other teams...


Contract is registered with the league, I believe GM's and player agents have access to that information even if the media does not.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: theaardvark on January 13, 2022, 03:08:11 PM
I think that BC is hoping to catch lightning in a bottle and have the next "Speedy B".  Ham sold a lot of tickets and merch off of Banks, and Lucky has that weird personality to go with it. 

I get that idea, and I hope that every GM makes sure they use that in their negotiations with guys looking for "Lucky money".



Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: dd on January 14, 2022, 03:46:05 AM
$200K is overpaying no matter how you look at it.  2 years in the CFL, 4th in league receiving stats.  $150K - $160K would be a decent salary for his production.
$200k is too much but he does return kicks and punts for TDs pretty regularly so I can see the $160-170 range, but $200 is absolutely nuts


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: TecnoGenius on January 14, 2022, 05:32:35 AM
Contract is registered with the league, I believe GM's and player agents have access to that information even if the media does not.

Is that true though?  The impression I've gotten after many years on the forum is that these numbers are leaked to the "insiders", or whisper numbers, but nobody really knows for sure.  I've always wondered how that works as some players like QBs we tend to all know the $$, but many players we just have no clue.

If it's not "policed" or "official", what is to keep a wily GM from just lying (early in FA/re-signings for max effect) to force other GMs to overpay?


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: GCn19 on January 14, 2022, 01:03:23 PM
Is that true though?  The impression I've gotten after many years on the forum is that these numbers are leaked to the "insiders", or whisper numbers, but nobody really knows for sure.  I've always wondered how that works as some players like QBs we tend to all know the $$, but many players we just have no clue.

If it's not "policed" or "official", what is to keep a wily GM from just lying (early in FA/re-signings for max effect) to force other GMs to overpay?


The CFL, and GMs are all privy to contract information. The player agents are aware, obviously, what their own players make. The circle is small though and player agents talk amongst themselves almost certainly. There wouldn't be too many players they wouldn't be aware of what they are making. The GMs do not get the information on what team is offering what, they get the info after the contract is signed and ratified by the league. It is the player agents that leak the salary info out to the media. The reason you outlined above is precisely why CFL GMs have the info on each player after each of them is ratified. The CFL would gain nothing by allowing GMs to bluff like that, and they would gain nothing by releasing contract numbers out to the public either although the latter would not be nearly as big a deal.


Title: Re: Lucky Whitehead - Free Agent (no longer)
Post by: TecnoGenius on January 15, 2022, 01:49:52 AM
That's very good to know, thanks!