Hi would disagree at times it was good but with the game on the line what was up with leaving the entire middle open to let SASK get an easy TD, there had to be 20 feet between the DL and DE when Harris ran up the middle and on the TD play not as big a gap but still wide open what was the DC thinking or did the players line up wrong ?
Well, we limited the league-best team to a reasonable amount of points. They didn't get huge yards or many explosions either. We also did something that made them go away from Liver King mid/late in the game.
D did ok. If Zach did better and didn't get bell-run, and if Hogan adjusted, we possibly could have won. Especially if we had a 4th Q like last week.
The problem was once Strev was in we knew any TD scoring was hopeless.
D was good imo
O fair at best
ST poor to pass
Coaching fair
Quote from: Blueforlife on September 07, 2025, 04:34:42 AMD was good imo
O fair at best
ST poor to pass
Coaching fair
D good at time but stunk on the last few players of the Ouellette TD the Middle was WIDE OPEN !
O Good until the 2 Zach INTs and awful after Strev took over he looked lost.
ST Ok
Coaching Poor OC DC HC errors
Quote from: BBFANDM on September 07, 2025, 04:39:58 AMD good at time but stunk on the last few players of the Ouellette TD the Middle was WIDE OPEN !
O Good until the 2 Zach INTs and awful after Strev took over he looked lost.
ST Ok
Coaching Poor OC DC HC errors
Missed two FGs so ST took their licks
One bad punt but return was small so net was ok
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBA8g9DAkDM Look at 6:29 Wide open up the middle with only 1 DT ?
Quote from: Blueforlife on September 07, 2025, 04:41:25 AMMissed two FGs so ST took their licks
One bad punt but return was small so net was ok
Good points ST wasn't good ether so while the game was close O D and ST not good enough
Quote from: BBFANDM on September 07, 2025, 04:39:58 AMD good at time but stunk on the last few players of the Ouellette TD the Middle was WIDE OPEN !
So was Brady's TD in LDC. Sauntered in.
Sometimes you do make the perfect play call, and the OL executes perfectly.
Maybe SSK psyched us out with all those outside runs (this week and last) that we were so busy protecting those we had too much space in the middle.
SSK's coords have been running circles around ours in both games. They seem to actually think and plan.
In fact, I would say SSK is built 100% to be "Bomber Killers" this season. That's literally their whole goal all FA, all TC, all everything. That's why they sucked vs CGY. Too bad for them we're only a so-so team this year and it's probably CGY they'll have to beat in WDF.
You know that Mace's job is now 100% secure for several years no matter what happens because they beat the dreaded Bumblers in the season series, and coveted LDC
and BB. That's all it takes to keep your job in SSK.
You can pick out certain plays in literally every game, but our defence did enough the last two weeks to win both games.
The theme of both games was turnovers. We had 2 fumble last week on out goal line that led to TDs and this week, 2 of Zach's final play's were INTs that turned into 10 points.
Even when the offence is moving the ball, we have this penchant for losing it.
not holding them when they started at their own 1 yard line was huge. that was the time for the defence to step up and they didn't.
Overall our defence played pretty well. Giving up those turnovers can't be blamed on the defence and that cost us the game for the most part.
We still seem to give up at least 1 big play screw up every game. This week is was Vaval getting burnt twice in a row.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 07, 2025, 03:29:13 PMOverall our defence played pretty well. Giving up those turnovers can't be blamed on the defence and that cost us the game for the most part.
We still seem to give up at least 1 big play screw up every game. This week is was Vaval getting burnt twice in a row.
Concerning about Vaval to be sure but Lawson has bounced back. Need to shore up our weakest link on the back end. I like our defensive schemes and rotatations. So many moving pieces and faces.
MOS and staff are coaching like they are done with being here.
Either that or the level of ineptitude has reached epic proportions.
Quote from: GOLDMEMBER on September 07, 2025, 03:51:05 PMMOS and staff are coaching like they are done with being here.
Either that or the level of ineptitude has reached epic proportions.
Sort of have to agree with your comments. I think the issue is pretty plain and simple. Not enough talent on the team coupled with poor management from the top down. And if Zach is done for the year so are we!
They played well for a unit that can't pressure the QB whatsoever.
I wish we were more aggressive and attacked the QB but for whatever reason the system is more passive. The jury is out on that I think.
Regardless, they were largely effective and that can't really be denied. Not the reason we lost even if it could be better.
Quote from: Blueforlife on September 07, 2025, 03:47:59 PMConcerning about Vaval to be sure but Lawson has bounced back. Need to shore up our weakest link on the back end. I like our defensive schemes and rotatations. So many moving pieces and faces.
Vaval seems to be playing fairly well. Lawson has picked it up. All that said it makes me wonder if there continues to be some sort of miscommunication or is it bad luck? By that I mean does a given DB try to jump a move or slip making a speed turn? How does any receiver get that open? I mean that's job one!!
Bombers defence still uses a lot of bend but don't break strategy. That works against lesser QB's that will make more mistakes. Good QB's will nickle and dime you all the way down the field and at times find that open deep shot.
I wouldn't say our DB's consistently contest receptions. Notice how quickly Riders surrounded our receivers and either knocked down a pass or delivered heavy hits.
However as several posters have mentioned our defence played well enough to win both games. Turnovers, missed FG's and an offence with only 2 good receivers makes it difficult to win. When was the last time we played close to a perfect game?
We're last or close to last on turnover ratio. That usually means you are losing games.
I don't know if Houston gets added this week but I would like to see Vaval just as the returner at the moment. His returns have dropped off since he has been doing double duty. That's tough on a 1st year player.
As always, it creates another possible ratio problem unless we flip the OL back to 3 Canadians next week.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 07, 2025, 04:58:56 AMSo was Brady's TD in LDC. Sauntered in.
Sometimes you do make the perfect play call, and the OL executes perfectly.
Maybe SSK psyched us out with all those outside runs (this week and last) that we were so busy protecting those we had too much space in the middle.
SSK's coords have been running circles around ours in both games. They seem to actually think and plan.
In fact, I would say SSK is built 100% to be "Bomber Killers" this season. That's literally their whole goal all FA, all TC, all everything. That's why they sucked vs CGY. Too bad for them we're only a so-so team this year and it's probably CGY they'll have to beat in WDF.
You know that Mace's job is now 100% secure for several years no matter what happens because they beat the dreaded Bumblers in the season series, and coveted LDC and BB. That's all it takes to keep your job in SSK.
The funny thing is, Bob Slowik the Stamps new DC is being lauded for running a very simple basic defence that the players all understand and buy into. Which means everybody gets to play the position they signed up for and doesn't have to make decisions or multi-task on every second play.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 07, 2025, 04:42:18 PMVaval seems to be playing fairly well. Lawson has picked it up. All that said it makes me wonder if there continues to be some sort of miscommunication or is it bad luck? By that I mean does a given DB try to jump a move or slip making a speed turn? How does any receiver get that open? I mean that's job one!!
Bombers defence still uses a lot of bend but don't break strategy. That works against lesser QB's that will make more mistakes. Good QB's will nickle and dime you all the way down the field and at times find that open deep shot.
I wouldn't say our DB's consistently contest receptions. Notice how quickly Riders surrounded our receivers and either knocked down a pass or delivered heavy hits.
However as several posters have mentioned our defence played well enough to win both games. Turnovers, missed FG's and an offence with only 2 good receivers makes it difficult to win. When was the last time we played close to a perfect game?
We're last or close to last on turnover ratio. That usually means you are losing games.
I don't know if Houston gets added this week but I would like to see Vaval just as the returner at the moment. His returns have dropped off since he has been doing double duty. That's tough on a 1st year player.
As always, it creates another possible ratio problem unless we flip the OL back to 3 Canadians next week.
Agree Vaval needs one job
Good assessment
It doesn't really matter so much who is covering at corner if we can't get any pressure on the quarterback. Houston can't cover for 10 seconds any better than Vaval can.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 07, 2025, 04:32:17 AMWe also did something that made them go away from Liver King mid/late in the game.
"Liver King" LOL!, nicely done, slow clap Techno!
When Houston comes back, I d move Vaval over and bump Lawson to the bench, he's been awful. Vaval is too good an athlete to take out of our secondary, twice the athlete Lawson is. Keep Lawson around in the event of injuries to others
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on September 07, 2025, 05:58:55 PMIt doesn't really matter so much who is covering at corner if we can't get any pressure on the quarterback. Houston can't cover for 10 seconds any better than Vaval can.
That's true but there is a difference between being close to a receiver and not in the same area code. We've seen receivers 8 yards behind our DB's.
Take last week. Allen was only a bit off on his timing and about a yard away on that 79 yard score. This week Vaval was not close to the receiver on the 1st completion. Whereas on the 2nd completion he took a PI. So the 2nd one was a technique / timing issue and the 1st one was a blown coverage.
I haven't re-watched the game to " time " how long Harris had to throw.
Quote from: dd on September 07, 2025, 06:13:13 PMWhen Houston comes back, I d move Vaval over and bump Lawson to the bench, he's been awful. Vaval is too good an athlete to take out of our secondary, twice the athlete Lawson is. Keep Lawson around in the event of injuries to others
Vaval has more upside but the double duty thing is not the best plan. I'm not sure which played better yesterday. Vaval was the one that gave up the 49 yard completion and then the PR. So it's debatable for present and future. Yes he's more athletic but it's not that simple. Good players win between their ears with football IQ and ability to react.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 07, 2025, 06:15:29 PMVaval has more upside but the double duty thing is not the best plan. I'm not sure which played better yesterday. Vaval was the one that gave up the 49 yard completion and then the PR. So it's debatable for present and future. Yes he's more athletic but it's not that simple. Good players win between their ears with football IQ and ability to react.
Lawson seems to be capable of more physical play, saw him help out tackling Oullette a couple of times.
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on September 07, 2025, 05:58:55 PMIt doesn't really matter so much who is covering at corner if we can't get any pressure on the quarterback. Houston can't cover for 10 seconds any better than Vaval can.
Agreed but it seemed to me that SASK was doing a lot of Holding and it wasn't getting called.
Quote from: dd on September 07, 2025, 06:13:13 PMWhen Houston comes back, I d move Vaval over and bump Lawson to the bench, he's been awful. Vaval is too good an athlete to take out of our secondary, twice the athlete Lawson is. Keep Lawson around in the event of injuries to others
It's not that simple imo. Vaval and Lawson are at similar abilities and point in their career. Both shown flashes of good, bad and ugly. Vaval plays teams and is also very good at that. Saying Vaval is twice the athlete Lawson is isn't correct. I would try to rotate all three but might not have the roster flexibility to do that.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 07, 2025, 06:15:29 PMVaval has more upside but the double duty thing is not the best plan. I'm not sure which played better yesterday. Vaval was the one that gave up the 49 yard completion and then the PR. So it's debatable for present and future. Yes he's more athletic but it's not that simple. Good players win between their ears with football IQ and ability to react.
I'm not sure I buy into the fact that the double duty thing is a big deal. This is the CFL. Many starters play on ST.
He's a professional athlete. A handful of extra snaps a game isn't affecting him. They can rotate him out for a play if he's temporarily winded at any point.
Quote from: BBRT on September 07, 2025, 04:00:19 PMSort of have to agree with your comments. I think the issue is pretty plain and simple. Not enough talent on the team coupled with poor management from the top down. And if Zach is done for the year so are we!
we need to make a trade for someone's back up again! Tre Ford? lol
Quote from: Jesse on September 07, 2025, 09:01:01 PMI'm not sure I buy into the fact that the double duty thing is a big deal. This is the CFL. Many starters play on ST.
He's a professional athlete. A handful of extra snaps a game isn't affecting him. They can rotate him out for a play if he's temporarily winded at any point.
Not every play gets hit at full speed like returners. It depends on how long the defence is on the field TOP which would factor into the statement.
He's also a CFL rookie and that alone is a factor. Many USA college players only play 12 games and have longer between snaps. Some get burned out about this time of the season if they've been starting regularly.
Quote from: Jesse on September 07, 2025, 09:01:01 PMHe's a professional athlete. A handful of extra snaps a game isn't affecting him. They can rotate him out for a play if he's temporarily winded at any point.
The risk of relying on Vaval for both is returners OFTEN get injured. Sometimes only for a couple of series, sometimes for the rest of the game, sometimes a few weeks, sometimes the rest of the season. See: Janarion Grant.
If Vaval became top at his spot, then it would really suck if/when he got injured in ST (remember Fogg getting injured?). Yes, that problem is lessened by him being no better than Lawson (so far) and probably way worse than Houston.
And in any case it's perfect if Vaval does return only AND is the backup IMP DB. Then we don't need to dress another DB,
and we have that comforting insurance.
It's actually ideal.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on September 07, 2025, 06:27:19 PMLawson seems to be capable of more physical play, saw him help out tackling Oullette a couple of times.
Yup, I saw that too. It was wild (and fun!). Not only did he go put hits on steamrolling Oullette, but actually made a dent in him. He must be heavier than featherweight Vaval, and/or have more beef, and/or have more cajones, and/or have less brains! :D :D :D
Also, not mentioned, but players brought in are not very good. Secondly, we don't seem to have good production, from our scouts. Do we not pay enough? Many of the players don't compete with their competition. The coaches certainly can't use the guys we have, effectively. The Quarternacks can't get it done.
Quote from: Jesse on September 07, 2025, 01:18:59 PMYou can pick out certain plays in literally every game, but our defence did enough the last two weeks to win both games.
The theme of both games was turnovers. We had 2 fumble last week on out goal line that led to TDs and this week, 2 of Zach's final play's were INTs that turned into 10 points.
Even when the offence is moving the ball, we have this penchant for losing it.
The offense hasn't progressed at all this season. I'd even argue it's regressed based on the last two games.
The offense has been a sore spot going back to last season - and that was with a seasoned OC at the helm. A rookie OC and an aging QB have only exacerbated the issues, IMO.
Quote from: Jesse on September 07, 2025, 09:01:01 PMI'm not sure I buy into the fact that the double duty thing is a big deal. This is the CFL. Many starters play on ST.
He's a professional athlete. A handful of extra snaps a game isn't affecting him. They can rotate him out for a play if he's temporarily winded at any point.
The risk of injury for a starting defensive player returning kicks isn't one I would take lightly
Having a player develop by learning one craft at a time is ideal
Yes people play teams but this is a little different imo
I think our O can been consistently average and it's success is based on two primary factors which also feed into the third:
Zach's health
Play of OL
Ability to establish front run game
Quote from: blue_gold_84 on September 08, 2025, 01:16:56 PMThe offense hasn't progressed at all this season. I'd even argue it's regressed based on the last two games.
The offense has been a sore spot going back to last season - and that was with a seasoned OC at the helm. A rookie OC and an aging QB have only exacerbated the issues, IMO.
Last year turnovers were a huge handicap as well.
Quote from: Jesse on September 08, 2025, 11:13:56 PMLast year turnovers were a huge handicap as well.
I think the offence started sputtering in 2023, they did well in most games but came out flat in a number of big games. That trend continued through 2024 and has now reversed itself, more often than not the offence is sputtering, they occasionally catch fire for brief intervals but can not maintain like they used to.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on September 09, 2025, 05:00:09 PMI think the offence started sputtering in 2023, they did well in most games but came out flat in a number of big games.
The 2023 team did very, very well in the majority of its regular season games. Only two jump out as anomalous, IMO: the week 3 loss at home to the Lions and the ugly collapse to the RedBlacks in week 6.
All-star nods to Collaros, Oliveira, Demski, Schoen, Bryant, Hardrick, and Neufeld. That offense was beyond dominant.
Quote from: blue_gold_84 on September 09, 2025, 05:39:50 PMThe 2023 team did very, very well in the majority of its regular season games. Only two jump out as anomalous, IMO: the week 3 loss at home to the Lions and the ugly collapse to the RedBlacks in week 6.
All-star nods to Collaros, Oliveira, Demski, Schoen, Bryant, Hardrick, and Neufeld. That offense was beyond dominant.
That's when it began, they inexplicably came up flat at home and laid an egg.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on September 09, 2025, 05:44:59 PMThat's when it began, they inexplicably came up flat at home and laid an egg.
(https://y.yarn.co/0d0beb47-9dd2-47eb-86d2-0337631e4fbe_text.gif)
One game is an anomaly. Full stop.
Quote from: blue_gold_84 on September 09, 2025, 05:59:14 PMOne game is an anomaly. Full stop.
Ya, you said it. OTT beating BC with Crum, or EDM creaming CGY this week is proof of that. Reminder: CGY creamed SSK and WPG in every game.