Winnipeg Blue Bombers add two to roster - Kickel and Brown
WINNIPEG, MB., April 9, 2025 – The Winnipeg Blue Bombers today announce the club has signed American offensive lineman Matt Kickel and American receiver Reggie Brown.
Kickel (6-4, 323; Aurora; born: April 4, 2001, in Bolingbrook, IL) joins the Blue Bombers after starting 11 games for the Spartans in 2024, being named Second Team CSC Academic All-American, Second Team All-American by D3football.com, Associated Press (AP), and the American Football Coaches Association (AFCA). He was also named NACC Offensive Lineman of the Year and First Team All-NACC. He started his collegiate career at Arizona State in 2019, transferring to Aurora in 2020 and playing in 34 games from 2020-2024.
Brown (6-1, 195; James Madison; born: January 29, 1999, in Lakeland, FLA) comes to the Blue Bombers after he spent time last year with the Kansas City Chiefs as an undrafted free agent.
Brown played his college ball at James Madison, earning honours as an Honorable Mention All-American and First Team All-Sun Belt after pulling in 53 passes for 1,054 yards and nine TDs in 2023. He also set a school record with 202 receiving yards in a game against Connecticut.
He dressed for 45 games for JMU during his career (2019-23) and finished with 93 receptions for 1,686 yards and 16 touchdowns.
Another OL with some size nice
Early days but we have 12 OL including 3 rookie imports, 3 imports from 2024 PR ( 2 got in some game time ). I'd expect to see a couple more added / looked at before TC. OTOH, I don't know how many ( imports ) will make the primary TC due to change in who is included in the " non counter " list.
Some of the rookies seem to have good credentials but those that were here in 2024 have the initial step up.
May 10th cut down to 85 excluding non counters. May 13th cut down to 75 excluding non counters.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 10, 2025, 04:33:53 PMEarly days but we have 12 OL including 3 rookie imports, 3 imports from 2024 PR ( 2 got in some game time ). I'd expect to see a couple more added / looked at before TC. OTOH, I don't know how many ( imports ) will make the primary TC due to change in who is included in the " non counter " list.
Some of the rookies seem to have good credentials but those that were here in 2024 have the initial step up.
May 10th cut down to 85 excluding non counters. May 13th cut down to 75 excluding non counters.
Yes, very little time to evaluate.
Quote from: Pigskin on April 10, 2025, 08:58:23 PMYes, very little time to evaluate.
I hear what you're saying, but its like any training camp, the newbies have got to do something that gets them noticed and get them a spot on the PR. I doubt any newbie comes in and beats out a vet starting OL, and would do well to get on the AR
Quote from: dd on April 10, 2025, 10:36:12 PMI hear what you're saying, but its like any training camp, the newbies have got to do something that gets them noticed and get them a spot on the PR. I doubt any newbie comes in and beats out a vet starting OL, and would do well to get on the AR
Part of the point was the change in the non counter rule. The 2024 draft choices will no longer be non counters so that reduces the number of roster spots before each cut down date. I doubt we'll see any early cuts of Canadian players so that means some imports will see the door a few days early etc etc.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 10, 2025, 11:09:39 PMPart of the point was the change in the non counter rule. The 2024 draft choices will no longer be non counters so that reduces the number of roster spots before each cut down date. I doubt we'll see any early cuts of Canadian players so that means some imports will see the door a few days early etc etc.
I really wonder what prompted this rule change, there seems to be no urgency or reason to shuffle the deck at this time. I guess there had to be a number of GM's complaining to make the change.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 11, 2025, 01:01:25 AMI really wonder what prompted this rule change, there seems to be no urgency or reason to shuffle the deck at this time. I guess there had to be a number of GM's complaining to make the change.
The larger the number of players the harder it is to evaluate in a short time frame. This seems to reduce the number by perhaps 10 players which refines the group coming to TC and the amount of time before each cut down date. To some degree it reduces the cost of bringing in the larger number of players.
I already suggested that every team will have some extras on speed dial as they see some not arrive / retire, fail medicals or get injured early.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 11, 2025, 01:31:51 PMThe larger the number of players the harder it is to evaluate in a short time frame. This seems to reduce the number by perhaps 10 players which refines the group coming to TC and the amount of time before each cut down date. To some degree it reduces the cost of bringing in the larger number of players.
I already suggested that every team will have some extras on speed dial as they see some not arrive / retire, fail medicals or get injured early.
I always thought the excess players brought in to TC was a huge waste of money for a league were teams often complain about expenditures and lose money. Like why bring in a dozen receivers to compete for a single job opening? Why not adjust the plan to the situation and only bring in the best 4 or 5? From a small business perspective this never made sense to me, but I guess it's what happens when an organization reaches a certain size and runs more on policy and less on common sense.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 11, 2025, 04:23:31 PMI always thought the excess players brought in to TC was a huge waste of money for a league were teams often complain about expenditures and lose money. Like why bring in a dozen receivers to compete for a single job opening? Why not adjust the plan to the situation and only bring in the best 4 or 5? From a small business perspective this never made sense to me, but I guess it's what happens when an organization reaches a certain size and runs more on policy and less on common sense.
It's not quite that simple. Teams bring in loads of DB's and receivers so they can run drills and give QB's someone to throw to.
Even in simple drills, receivers run routes while 3 - 5 QB's throw passes and DB's cover in quick rotations.
We probably see nearly 20 of each to start TC. The speed guys are more prone to early injuries in TC, so there is that. Teams seem to sit out more veterans to start TC. If the TC wasn't so short they could change their arrival date so the rookies get more of a chance to shine.
I think the answer is slightly longer mini rookie camp to weed out and make quick decisions before the main camp? Short pre season doesn't help but that's another cost / revenue decision.
Interestingly the UFL has a very short TC and no pre season IIRC. They also seem to have large roster turnover each season.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 11, 2025, 04:23:31 PMI always thought the excess players brought in to TC was a huge waste of money for a league were teams often complain about expenditures and lose money. Like why bring in a dozen receivers to compete for a single job opening? Why not adjust the plan to the situation and only bring in the best 4 or 5? From a small business perspective this never made sense to me, but I guess it's what happens when an organization reaches a certain size and runs more on policy and less on common sense.
Because sometimes that 12th receiver is Pokie Wilson, or a DB that steals reps and earns a spot.
The more players, the better. The true survivors, the guys with grit and heart, they can show themselves when competition is deep and reps are fewer.
You bring in 5 guys to fight for 1 AR spot and 2 PR spots, you only rule out 2 guys. You bring in 12 and that's 9 guys you have to cut. But 7 extra that you get a chance at working with, even for a few days, and get a glimpse of what lurks behind a highlight reel, measurables or scouting report.
I'd far rather have too many to choose from than too few. It doesn't take a hundred snaps to see if a player has talent. If you are working that deep in reps waiting for that one highlight reel play, you are going to wait that long in season for the repeat.
You want to identify the guys that can take instruction, can improve every rep, that can catch on to the CFL game, the waggle, 12 men, etc. The guys who can perform outside their comfort zone. Guys that can adapt and thrive.
Those kinds of guys, with the intangibles that may have gotten them to camp for a longer look, to get a few snaps with even a guest coach, can reveal that diamond in the rough.
Sure, I want guys to show up for camp that are ready to play the CFL game right out of the first practice. But we have great scouts and coaches who can spot that guy that could be the next one... so let them see as many potential players as possible.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 11, 2025, 04:38:18 PMIt's not quite that simple. Teams bring in loads of DB's and receivers so they can run drills and give QB's someone to throw to.
Even in simple drills, receivers run routes while 3 - 5 QB's throw passes and DB's cover in quick rotations.
We probably see nearly 20 of each to start TC. The speed guys are more prone to early injuries in TC, so there is that. Teams seem to sit out more veterans to start TC. If the TC wasn't so short they could change their arrival date so the rookies get more of a chance to shine.
I think the answer is slightly longer mini rookie camp to weed out and make quick decisions before the main camp? Short pre season doesn't help but that's another cost / revenue decision.
Interestingly the UFL has a very short TC and no pre season IIRC. They also seem to have large roster turnover each season.
I didn't even know the United Football League existed until you posted it, never heard of it before. Other leagues come and go while the CFL endures if not prospers.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 11, 2025, 05:02:30 PMI didn't even know the United Football League existed until you posted it, never heard of it before. Other leagues come and go while the CFL endures if not prospers.
LOL. It's not very good football. There is a game on tonight at 5:00 Vancouver time. I usually watch the 1st 5 minutes mostly to see what attendance is like.
However with 1 year CFL contracts it does seem that most teams potential free agent list in half their roster. This results in large roster turnover as teams try to " buy " specific needs and open up the wallets.
With one owner for all the teams, it changes roster dynamics.
Consistency, even of the QB's and skill positions, is not something I've seen in the UFL's many incarnations. I'm pretty sure I've seen good QB's tossed aside for no good reason, and the shiny new toy get the shot.
Its WWE with padding and annoying drones. Its not like any team is building anything long term, its 100% transactional and content for TV. And to assuage the Rock's pro ball ego. Still think when the UFL folds, he should buy a CFL team. Would have been great in Edm or Mtl.
Log jam and both those positions, so these are likely TCF. Maybe a diamond in the rough, though. Who knows
Quote from: blue_or_die on April 11, 2025, 05:56:38 PMLog jam and both those positions, so these are likely TCF. Maybe a diamond in the rough, though. Who knows
It's never certain when 2024 PR players are surpassed in TC. It's also possible that some players won't accept a 2nd year mostly on the PR like Wheatfall or Case. So you have to have a look see of replacements one way or the other.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 11, 2025, 01:01:25 AMI really wonder what prompted this rule change, there seems to be no urgency or reason to shuffle the deck at this time. I guess there had to be a number of GM's complaining to make the change.
It isn't a rule "change". It is actually correctly applying the language in the latest CBA and it was the CFLPA who pushed for this change. You can draw your own conclusions probably.
Quote from: Pigskin on April 10, 2025, 08:58:23 PMYes, very little time to evaluate.
It changes a little but not a lot.
Anyone who was sent back to school already had a full camp and were therefore already cut once. You're looking to see whether they've improved in the areas you've asked or not. Usually these are bubble players and guys who get "sent back to school" rarely go on to make it in any meaningful way later. Yes, there are exceptions. No, it's not common.
Current year draft picks are still non counters so they're getting all camp and there's no rush.
All they're doing is narrowing down the window for returning Canadians and teams should be able to make a decision on those guys more quickly. Either you're interested or you're not. You have had a full camp, a full season of tape after the camp and then the rookie camp to figure out if they are worth a snowball's chance and if you want more time the easy answer is to fit them into the count.
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 11, 2025, 10:26:57 PMIt changes a little but not a lot.
Anyone who was sent back to school already had a full camp and were therefore already cut once. You're looking to see whether they've improved in the areas you've asked or not. Usually these are bubble players and guys who get "sent back to school" rarely go on to make it in any meaningful way later. Yes, there are exceptions. No, it's not common.
Current year draft picks are still non counters so they're getting all camp and there's no rush.
All they're doing is narrowing down the window for returning Canadians and teams should be able to make a decision on those guys more quickly. Either you're interested or you're not. You have had a full camp, a full season of tape after the camp and then the rookie camp to figure out if they are worth a snowball's chance and if you want more time the easy answer is to fit them into the count.
Interesting way to look at it. This change may have more of an impact going into 2026 when they will face this issue. I don't know whether they will still retain the rights to those returning to college?
For 2025 they've already re-signed a few of the 2024 draft choices.
Kornelson attended the last 2 TC before returning to college. Samson spent the entire season on the PR before being activated for the Grey Cup.
Leroux and Gassama may just be fighting for PR spots. Gassama might be fighting for a depth spot on the AR. That's a TBD.
We see many draft choices also spend their 1st season on the PR and then return for the next season. In some cases they are successful and make the AR or part of the roster on the AR and part on the PR.
Granted many of them never achieve much beyond being ST players but you have to have those as well.
We'll see how those I mentioned work out and whether they make our rosters one way or the other. There were 2 OL drafted last year that I thought would be invited to TC but now that's less clear.
It makes you wonder if the draft will continue to be 9 rounds with what I'd call a new limitation. It's sort of one and done potentially.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 11, 2025, 11:40:18 PMInteresting way to look at it. This change may have more of an impact going into 2026 when they will face this issue. I don't know whether they will still retain the rights to those returning to college?
For 2025 they've already re-signed a few of the 2024 draft choices.
Kornelson attended the last 2 TC before returning to college. Samson spent the entire season on the PR before being activated for the Grey Cup.
Leroux and Gassama may just be fighting for PR spots. Gassama might be fighting for a depth spot on the AR. That's a TBD.
We see many draft choices also spend their 1st season on the PR and then return for the next season. In some cases they are successful and make the AR or part of the roster on the AR and part on the PR.
Granted many of them never achieve much beyond being ST players but you have to have those as well.
We'll see how those I mentioned work out and whether they make our rosters one way or the other. There were 2 OL drafted last year that I thought would be invited to TC but now that's less clear.
It makes you wonder if the draft will continue to be 9 rounds with what I'd call a new limitation. It's sort of one and done potentially.
The number of draft rounds won't change. At least not due to counting previous year picks in the official training camp number.
All that is happening is that teams must decide after rookie camp if their prior year draft choices are worth a training camp spot or not. I argue (and frankly I'm sure this is what the CFLPA is thinking too) - they should have more than enough information to make that determination.
Look at it another way, teams typically decide on keeping rookie Americans (who always count) based on nothing more than college tape and three day rookie camp.
I wonder which of the rookie receivers is going to be the next Wilson? Although we signed 3 CFL free agent receivers, I'd say only Mitchell is a lock. The other 2 are good but will face enormous competition.
The new guy might end up on the PR to start the season and learn more of the CFL game. We appear to be in good shape to start the season with the veterans but it will be interesting to see what rookie impresses as well.
Not sure another rookie receiver will survive beyond the PR, not much room. They've been on a hot streak lately recruiting Wilson and stumbling upon an unheralded Schoen, but before that you'd have to stretch back to Chris Matthews in 2018 to find a new receiver they brought in that made a significant impact.
There's been big turnover in the scouting dept. as well, so we'll have to wait to see how that changes player recruitment, not too surprised Goveia took Cyril Penn with him. For some strange reason Danny Mac has not been great recruiting high skilled import positions such as receiver and QB, which he should have an eye for.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 12, 2025, 04:34:02 PMNot sure another rookie receiver will survive beyond the PR, not much room. They've been on a hot streak lately recruiting Wilson and stumbling upon an unheralded Schoen, but before that you'd have to stretch back to Chris Matthews in 2018 to find a new receiver they brought in that made a significant impact.
There's been big turnover in the scouting dept. as well, so we'll have to wait to see how that changes player recruitment, not too surprised Goveia took Cyril Penn with him. For some strange reason Danny Mac has not been great recruiting high skilled import positions such as receiver and QB, which he should have an eye for.
Agreed. Barring injuries it's going to be pretty tough for the rookie receivers this year to find their way onto the field. Especially early. .
Way more depth ahead of them.
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on April 11, 2025, 10:26:57 PMIt changes a little but not a lot.
Anyone who was sent back to school already had a full camp and were therefore already cut once. You're looking to see whether they've improved in the areas you've asked or not. Usually these are bubble players and guys who get "sent back to school" rarely go on to make it in any meaningful way later. Yes, there are exceptions. No, it's not common.
Current year draft picks are still non counters so they're getting all camp and there's no rush.
All they're doing is narrowing down the window for returning Canadians and teams should be able to make a decision on those guys more quickly. Either you're interested or you're not. You have had a full camp, a full season of tape after the camp and then the rookie camp to figure out if they are worth a snowball's chance and if you want more time the easy answer is to fit them into the count.
I kind of thought going back to school was often the players choice, deferring their pro football career for a year or two while they finish their degree while continuing to play college football. I certainly wouldn't be keen dropping out to pursue a short-term CFL football career that has a very good chance of going nowhere and isn't likely to pay very well. In that case getting drafted years prior to graduating isn't much of a blessing.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 12, 2025, 04:53:02 PMI kind of thought going back to school was often the players choice, deferring their pro football career for a year or two while they finish their degree while continuing to play college football. I certainly wouldn't be keen dropping out to pursue a short-term CFL football career that has a very good chance of going nowhere and isn't likely to pay very well. In that case getting drafted years prior to graduating isn't much of a blessing.
You're right. CFL teams don't force players back to school. Typically though, this is a conversation for guys who don't really project to be very effective at the CFL level anyway. And don't forget they're virtually always Canadians playing in the CIS which right out of the gate reduces a players odds to win a starting spot in the CFL dramatically (yes, Demski, yes Kramdi, yes maybe it's changing slightly, but not much.)
Early I thought we'd be bringing back the 2 OL we drafted in 2024. Now that's less certain. I was already not sure if Gassama and Leroux had any more chance to make anything beyond the PR.
Leroux might have been considered the LS for 2026 or sooner if they choose to move past Benson. Benson can still perform but when does the team make that decision?
Is there a chance that the team deletes some Canadians on the current roster before TC? We already had a couple that are long in the tooth.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 12, 2025, 08:21:06 PMEarly I thought we'd be bringing back the 2 OL we drafted in 2024. Now that's less certain. I was already not sure if Gassama and Leroux had any more chance to make anything beyond the PR.
Leroux might have been considered the LS for 2026 or sooner if they choose to move past Benson. Benson can still perform but when does the team make that decision?
Is there a chance that the team deletes some Canadians on the current roster before TC? We already had a couple that are long in the tooth.
I thought Benson retired after last season? If not probably time to move onto the younger Leroux anyway.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 12, 2025, 09:20:51 PMI thought Benson retired after last season? If not probably time to move onto the younger Leroux anyway.
No he's still on the roster at the moment. Like I said, Benson can play but he's 38 this season. Risk of injury increases and there would be some SMS savings using Leroux.
I don't know if Leroux has the " right stuff " so to speak. If we keep him on the PR all season that has something approaching $1K per week plus how ever much more we pay to retain Benson. It also uses a spot on the PR that is limited to 10 non global players.
When is the right time with a player that is 38?
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 12, 2025, 11:32:59 PMNo he's still on the roster at the moment. Like I said, Benson can play but he's 38 this season. Risk of injury increases and there would be some SMS savings using Leroux.
I don't know if Leroux has the " right stuff " so to speak. If we keep him on the PR all season that has something approaching $1K per week plus how ever much more we pay to retain Benson. It also uses a spot on the PR that is limited to 10 non global players.
When is the right time with a player that is 38?
I'd put the age of retirement at 36 but having a consistant long snapper is super important.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 13, 2025, 01:24:53 AMI'd put the age of retirement at 36 but having a consistant long snapper is super important.
I'm sure Rempel could have played 2-3 more seasons at his high level, but Benson was there for the taking and bought us a little time. And he's been solid, as solid as Rempel.
I can't recall the last over-the-head punt snap by Rempel or Benson. That's a good thing.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 12, 2025, 04:34:02 PMThere's been big turnover in the scouting dept. as well, so we'll have to wait to see how that changes player recruitment, not too surprised Goveia took Cyril Penn with him. For some strange reason Danny Mac has not been great recruiting high skilled import positions such as receiver and QB, which he should have an eye for.
How do you/we know? Do we have it documented who's "responsible" for the Schoen or Pokey find? Couldn't that have been Danny?
Many thought Rigmaiden was the genius, but we found Pokey after he was long gone, no?
Quote from: TecnoGenius on April 13, 2025, 02:45:22 AMI'm sure Rempel could have played 2-3 more seasons at his high level, but Benson was there for the taking and bought us a little time. And he's been solid, as solid as Rempel.
I can't recall the last over-the-head punt snap by Rempel or Benson. That's a good thing.
Neither were perfect but both were very good. Part of the discussion just at the end of last season was that a LS is easy to find. I don't know if that's true but it doesn't answer the question.
It's not impossible that Benson decides to retire before TC. I'm not expecting that but it's not outside the possibility.
Having a consistent LS is very important so that is worth noting. Posters will have to watch Leroux in TC and determine whether he might be ours in 2026 or whether we'll might be in the hunt.
I pointed out some of the SMS issues and roster spots on the PR to retain any player over another. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but it's not necessary the best use of roster management.
Let the TC battle determine the outcomes. I won't be upset if Benson plays another couple of years. I might be upset if we cut Leroux and he signs elsewhere to play top level for a decade. Obviously that's only speculation.
It's no different than wondering when we part ways with other older players.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on April 13, 2025, 02:46:31 AMHow do you/we know? Do we have it documented who's "responsible" for the Schoen or Pokey find? Couldn't that have been Danny?
Many thought Rigmaiden was the genius, but we found Pokey after he was long gone, no?
McManus has been with the team for over a decade and although overall recruitment has been very good, they've been weak finding high quality QB's and receivers. As I mentioned in an earlier post, other than Pokey, Schoen and Chris Matthews I can't think of any all-star caliber receivers brought in though scouting. It's worse when you look at QB's, the 2 highlights may have been Dru Brown and Streveler.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on April 13, 2025, 02:46:31 AMHow do you/we know? Do we have it documented who's "responsible" for the Schoen or Pokey find? Couldn't that have been Danny?
Many thought Rigmaiden was the genius, but we found Pokey after he was long gone, no?
What we don't know is whether he was added to our neg list or by who or when. Or whether he had been scouted or just showed up at a try out camp and was discovered.
It's not a straight line to any acquisition. A player could be on our neg list for a few years or a few weeks.
Quote from: Blue In BC on April 13, 2025, 04:50:22 PMWhat we don't know is whether he was added to our neg list or by who or when. Or whether he had been scouted or just showed up at a try out camp and was discovered.
It's not a straight line to any acquisition. A player could be on our neg list for a few years or a few weeks.
I think Pokey came in through the neg. list, not sure how Schoen was acquired but I think he surprised everyone.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 13, 2025, 03:48:42 PMother than Pokey, Schoen and Chris Matthews I can't think of any all-star caliber receivers brought in though scouting. It's worse when you look at QB's, the 2 highlights may have been Dru Brown and Streveler.
I don't know, I think 3 great RECs and 1.5 great QBs scouted in a decade is probably on par with many/most other teams? (Ask me that question before we found Schoen though and I'll give you a different answer!)
A legit top-5 QB is scouted maybe once every 2-4 seasons in the CFL. That's why they now play until mid/late-30s, because they are so rare.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on April 13, 2025, 07:37:05 PMI think Pokey came in through the neg. list, not sure how Schoen was acquired but I think he surprised everyone.
I remember his rookie TC MOS and everyone here who went to practice were screaming about him being great and I was skeptical. I was still skeptical until around week 6, then I was a convert! He doesn't look like much, but he sure gets the job done, and the TDs!
A two-time D3 All-American, Kickel started his collegiate career at Arizona State before making the jump to play for Don Beebe at Aurora. He's a well-built lineman at 6-foot-4 and 300 pounds who has tackle-guard versatility, though he projects better at guard due to his nasty, finishing mentality. He's a powerful lineman at the point of attack who keeps a low center of gravity and maintains good footwork, reflective of his initial basketball background. With his level of success, the Benet Academy alumnus deserves a shot to showcase himself at the next level.