The Blue Bombers injury list remains significant and even more so with unconfirmed reports that Dalton Schoen is lost for the season with a knee injury.
While the final injury report before the game and the depth chart are still forthcoming, it is apparent there will be new faces in the line up on Saturday against Calgary.
Some considerable improvement was noted in the last game, and this game will be important to show continued improvement. A win would move the Bombers forward even further.
Ed Tait's 48 Hour Primer is here. (http://"http://www.bluebombers.com/2024/06/27/48-hour-primer-wpg-at-cal/)
"...The way we've worked for the last pile of years is pretty simple: it's whatever the game dictates," said head coach Mike O'Shea. "We go in with a big call sheet that covers off every situation, scenario, and what defences are going to bring. And then as the game unfolds sometimes no matter what you absolutely want to do it's 180 degrees from what you're doing because the game dictates it.
"Yup, we want to dictate to the defence and pound the ball but if some team is going to load the box up completely we're not going to forfeit a win because our plan said, 'Here's what we want to do.' Buck (Pierce, offensive coordinator) has been awesome at having that understanding of what it's going to take and from the planning being able to put the ego aside and being able to shift how he's going to call the game that week..."
This would be an ideal opportunity to start a winning streak and while the odds may dictate otherwise, there are players on the Bombers who know how to win.
More on the depth/position chart to follow including an injury update. Let's go Bombers!
Quote from: ModAdmin on June 28, 2024, 06:06:24 AMSome considerable improvement was noted in the last game, and this game will be important to show continued improvement. A win would move the Bombers forward even further.
Not likely. Every game we lose 3 starters. If we're lucky we get 1 back. You can't improve when you go 1 step forward and 3 steps back. You just end up slowly walking backwards. And since Schoen is worth like 3 players, we went 1 step forward and 5 steps back.
The only reason we looked better vs BC was our O decided to (finally) wake up and stop sucking for week 3. Even if they decide to stay awake, they can't be better than when Schoen was in. Our only 2 remaining planned-starter Rs are now "just" NATs. Even if the OL keeps improving (which they were), and RB situation improves (which it should), and even Zach improves (crossing my fingers), the R situation ensures continued woes. Especially against a team with a traditionally strong run D.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings. I wish Bombers the best of luck in any case, and GO BLUE. I hope something good comes of the game, even with a loss. Maybe one of the newest guys shows that he's the next all-star, like Fayad was doing. That would be an awesome silver lining. We also get to see whose heart is in it vs giving up and just jogging & moping around.
CFL Game Notes - Winnipeg @ Calgary
Link: Game Notes (https://mcusercontent.com/7a0c86d02b5c64ea04a3c48be/files/a11b35b7-f682-0d61-68e4-c7b199ffea75/2024_GN_Gm_24_Cgy_vs_Wpg.pdf)
Stamps will just key in on Oliveira, Demski and Wolitarsky. Our D need to play better for us to win this game. And maybe, get some help from the Special Teams.
Jake Maier has improved.
got this from stats junkie post:
completion rate 2024 79.7 %
one interception in 178 pass attempts.
Looks like all the games are going to be tough this season.
From the stats, the D has been doing well under very difficult circumstances.
For those of you who don't get the depth chart mailed by Canada Post it can be found here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1012482866891712&set=a.790927029047298
Winning hides the flaws on this team. But our GM and HC has been brutal in managing the roster.
We're starting 10 Cdns out of necessity. We don't have enough quality Imps on the roster. That's on Management
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on June 28, 2024, 03:11:32 PMFor those of you who don't get the depth chart mailed by Canada Post it can be found here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1012482866891712&set=a.790927029047298
Woooooow, that's a skeleton crew at receiver.
To look on the positive side, we'll have more funds to spend on NFL cuts.
Quote from: peg_city on June 28, 2024, 03:32:44 PMWoooooow, that's a skeleton crew at receiver.
To look on the positive side, we'll have more funds to spend on NFL cuts.
Bringing in more unknown receivers with no CFL experience won't help them right now, I'd contact free agent CFL vets that are still in decent shape like Derel Walker who could immediately contribute. At least now with all the injuries they should have a little bit of cash to spend. It's time for O'Shea to swallow some pride and deviate from the script to get this team back on track before it's too late.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 28, 2024, 03:49:06 PMBringing in more unknown receivers with no CFL experience won't help them right now, I'd contact free agent CFL vets that are still in decent shape like Derel Walker who could immediately contribute. At least now with all the injuries they should have a little bit of cash to spend. It's time for O'Shea to swallow some pride and deviate from the script to get this team back on track before it's too late.
Pretty sure there are reasons why vet CFL receivers are not on rosters, and it's not $SMS concerns. Walker was moved on from for a reason. Next you'll be suggesting Duron Carter. Maybe Milt Stegall? (Hey, did he jinx us by coming to camp?)
Derel Walker? LOL
Bring back Lucky Whitehead
Quote from: Slingin Sammy on June 28, 2024, 03:29:26 PMWe're starting 10 Cdns out of necessity. We don't have enough quality Imps on the roster. That's on Management
Not thrilled with this line up. 3 rookie receivers starting.
Quote from: theaardvark on June 28, 2024, 04:06:59 PMPretty sure there are reasons why vet CFL receivers are not on rosters, and it's not $SMS concerns. Walker was moved on from for a reason. Next you'll be suggesting Duron Carter. Maybe Milt Stegall? (Hey, did he jinx us by coming to camp?)
The point is a CFL veteran receiver would be a valuable addition right now for temporary assistance, they have plenty of inexperienced rookies that will grow with the opportunity but will contribute much less ability towards winning games. Lesser names than Walker in terms of current ability and motivation, Brescacin, Ellingson, Wieneke, Shaq Evans, Cam Phillips, Whitehead, take your pick.
Weineke, Evans, and Whitehead could be worth a look.
Probably pass on the rest, though.
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on June 28, 2024, 03:11:32 PMFor those of you who don't get the depth chart mailed by Canada Post it can be found here:
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1012482866891712&set=a.790927029047298
Unbelievable! Still a Facebook fixation by the Bombers.
::)
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 28, 2024, 04:30:49 PMThe point is a CFL veteran receiver would be a valuable addition right now for temporary assistance, they have plenty of inexperienced rookies that will grow with the opportunity but will contribute much less ability towards winning games. Lesser names than Walker in terms of current ability and motivation, Brescacin, Ellingson, Wieneke, Shaq Evans, Cam Phillips, Whitehead, take your pick.
Again, none of those would be on a couch if they still had the ability to play better than a rookie. We still have Lawler and Schoen "vet presence" on the sidelines, and they probably can contribute more than any of the names you mentioned.
Quote from: Foxhound on June 28, 2024, 04:34:08 PMUnbelievable! Still a Facebook fixation by the Bombers.
::)
We're all
shocked. Can't believe they are such early adopters of this new method of information dissemination. I still think they should mail it out to you!
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on June 28, 2024, 03:11:32 PMFor those of you who don't get the depth chart mailed by Canada Post it can be found here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1012482866891712&set=a.790927029047298
I hate to say it, but just an absolute failure of scouting to not have capable receivers on hand.
We're also in the position where our only DE is a 2024 draft pick. I'm at a lose at how we got here.
Quote from: kkc60 on June 28, 2024, 05:22:35 PMi honestly don't know where the FO's head is at. Second week without Haba and still no DEs brought in for the PR. If Fayad or Jefferson goes down, we have an 8th round rookie. Embarrassing
There has to some imaginary savings accruing in the cookie jar saved from Lawler and Schoen going on the 6 game, don't think they'll weather this storm unless they spend money on a vet or two.
whatever happened to TD Jake Weineke?? He was on fire 2 years ago, went to the riders who had primarily backup Qb's throwing to him all last year and he's out of football this year?? Give him a call
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRKjAAMbgAAG2mF?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRK6fRZbIAAeL7J?format=jpg&name=large)
Quote from: gobombersgo on June 28, 2024, 06:10:37 PM(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRKjAAMbgAAG2mF?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
So only 1 global player on the roster this week. IIRC Karamoko was nicked but it's a partial surprise that we didn't activate either of the 2 on the PR. Isn't that the point of keeping them around?
Ed Tait @EdTaitWFC
The @Wpg_BlueBombers depth chart for tomorrow in Calgary features three changes: on are receivers
Jeremy Murphy and
Josh Johnson and DB
Deatrick Nichols; off are
Dalton Schoen,
Keric Wheatfall and DB
Souleymane Karamoko.
Schoen and
Wheatfall to the 6-game injured list
Derek Taylor
@DTonOBBombers roster for Calgary Saturday
HB
Deatrick Nichols returns after a week out.
Jeremy Murphy &
Josh Johnson on and starting at receiver.
Plus,
Brady Oliveira back to RB1.
markonfootball @Markonfootball
INSTA-ANALYSIS: A minimum of changes for the Stampeders.
Malcolm Thompson slides in at safety as
Bentlee Sanders nurses a shoulder injury.
Josiah Coatney is off the practice roster and moves to the DL. Special team star
Kelon Thomas also sits.
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 28, 2024, 06:20:52 PMSo only 1 global player on the roster this week. IIRC Karamoko was nicked but it's a partial surprise that we didn't activate either of the 2 on the PR. Isn't that the point of keeping them around?
It's not a surprise at all.
Need to get Murphy on the roster and it looks like Griffin has taken over Karamoko's spot on defence.
The 2 Globals on the PR are linebackers. If they were dlinemen or receivers then you might see them in the lineup.
Quote from: gobombersgo on June 28, 2024, 06:10:37 PM(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRKjAAMbgAAG2mF?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
Who are these people?? seriously looks like a lineup for a preseason game.
Quote from: gobombersgo on June 28, 2024, 06:38:59 PMIt's not a surprise at all.
Need to get Murphy on the roster and it looks like Griffin has taken over Karamoko's spot on defence.
The 2 Globals on the PR are linebackers. If they were dlinemen or receivers then you might see them in the lineup.
I did say a partial surprise and did that mention earlier. Iff we were starting 3 Canadian receivers then Murphy would be added as depth. I wasn't sure whether he would start or Clercius since he was already on the AR. Murphy has been round longer so there is that in his favour.
The 2nd global was always an option at the expense of another Canadian. I thought it would be 50 / 50 that Alston would dress even if he was only the back up. However that would have required another import off the roster. An import can't replace an import ratio wise.
Griffith was on the roster last week. Bridges came off now that Nichols is back.
Our run game better be successful tomorrow or it's going to be really ugly if we live or die by the pass alone.
Griffith was on the roster last week. Bridges came off now that Nichols is back.
[/quote]
Yes, Griffith was on the roster last week and was on the field when the team went with 3 dlinemen. Karamoko had zero snaps on defence.
Bridges is still on the roster but now as a back up.
Weird to dress two extra HBs as DAs but no receivers. With how that position has been dropping, one would think they'd play it safe. Murphy effectively is viewed as a better receiver than Mitchell it appears, as no need to go with an extra canadian there otherwise
Nichols, back in that is very good for our D. Murphy had a good week at practice, glad to see the kid getting the start. DL the same as last week. Time to get some pressure.
Quote from: gobombersgo on June 28, 2024, 08:43:38 PMGriffith was on the roster last week. Bridges came off now that Nichols is back.
Yes, Griffith was on the roster last week and was on the field when the team went with 3 dlinemen. Karamoko had zero snaps on defence.
Bridges is still on the roster but now as a back up.
I missed Bridges still on the roster. I guess they wanted more depth on defence considering few options on offence.
Quote from: kkc60 on June 28, 2024, 08:52:02 PMWeird to dress two extra HBs as DAs but no receivers. With how that position has been dropping, one would think they'd play it safe. Murphy effectively is viewed as a better receiver than Mitchell it appears, as no need to go with an extra canadian there otherwise
I thought Alston would be higher among the import choices. He will have had a few more reps by next week and we'll see if Murphy makes an impression. Even so, Alston could be added in if we drop one of the extra import DB's.
I have been on here for a long time this might be a record for me, mega multiple response warning lol
Quote from: M.O.A.B. on June 28, 2024, 04:08:16 PMBring back Lucky Whitehead
Hard pass
Quote from: BBRT on June 28, 2024, 06:43:10 PMWho are these people?? seriously looks like a lineup for a preseason game.
Overstated on the negative imo
Quote from: Jesse on June 28, 2024, 04:58:14 PMI hate to say it, but just an absolute failure of scouting to not have capable receivers on hand.
We're also in the position where our only DE is a 2024 draft pick. I'm at a lose at how we got here.
Calling the scouts a failure this early is premature. Saying we don't have capable receivers before letting them play isn't fair. Wheatfall looked good in one game and has promise, for the rest we shall see.
Quote from: blue_gold_84 on June 28, 2024, 04:33:06 PMWeineke, Evans, and Whitehead could be worth a look.
Probably pass on the rest, though.
Pass on the other two imo, I don't know Evans tell me more
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 28, 2024, 04:30:49 PMThe point is a CFL veteran receiver would be a valuable addition right now for temporary assistance, they have plenty of inexperienced rookies that will grow with the opportunity but will contribute much less ability towards winning games. Lesser names than Walker in terms of current ability and motivation, Brescacin, Ellingson, Wieneke, Shaq Evans, Cam Phillips, Whitehead, take your pick.
Tell me more about Phillips, not sold on rest. I know Evans and Phillips by name but can't recall their game. I would prefer to develop receivers, not sign washed ups.
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 28, 2024, 04:24:58 PMNot thrilled with this line up. 3 rookie receivers starting.
Double edged sword. We find out what we got / develop. Likely will be a struggle but pay off down the road imo.
Quote from: peg_city on June 28, 2024, 03:32:44 PMWoooooow, that's a skeleton crew at receiver.
To look on the positive side, we'll have more funds to spend on NFL cuts.
Forgot about that, maybe we can find a diamond in the rough
Quote from: M.O.A.B. on June 28, 2024, 04:08:16 PMBring back Lucky Whitehead
I wouldn't mind bringing him back at least until Lawler and Shoen are healthy. He would be better than Murphy who I am sure is a nice kid but zero CFL catches. Whitehead is not a long term solution but the Bombers are a mess at receiver right now.
Quote from: bwiser on June 28, 2024, 10:08:20 PMI wouldn't mind bringing him back at least until Lawler and Shoen are healthy. He would be better than Murphy who I am sure is a nice kid but zero CFL catches. Whitehead is not a long term solution but the Bombers are a mess at receiver right now.
I would suggest you give Murphy a few games before coming to any conclusions.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 28, 2024, 10:54:39 PMI would suggest you give Murphy a few games before coming to any conclusions.
Developing players for later is great, but it's not going to help this year's edition if they miss the playoffs. Chris Jones has been in development mode for 3 years now and it hasn't put him any closer to making the playoffs.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 28, 2024, 11:35:24 PMDeveloping players for later is great, but it's not going to help this year's edition if they miss the playoffs. Chris Jones has been in development mode for 3 years now and it hasn't put him any closer to making the playoffs.
We are not anything like Jones in any way shape or form. I am happy to develop and see what we have. That doesn't pan out, bring a body in mid season.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 28, 2024, 11:35:24 PMDeveloping players for later is great, but it's not going to help this year's edition if they miss the playoffs. Chris Jones has been in development mode for 3 years now and it hasn't put him any closer to making the playoffs.
I get your point, but we are an awful long way from Chris Jones territory.
Quote from: Sir Blue and Gold on June 28, 2024, 03:11:32 PMFor those of you who don't get the depth chart mailed by Canada Post it can be found here: https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1012482866891712&set=a.790927029047298
I keep trying to get them to send my chart by Xpresspost, but they keep sending it regular parcel. Takes forever! ;D ;D ;D
Joking aside, though, once again we are the
only CFL team of the week to not post their depth chart on their team web site roster page at the proper time. We are literally not doing what every other team does, and has done for years. I really don't understand why it's so difficult. I'm starting to think they do it on purpose.
But I will point out how gobombersgo now posts the charts (including the "good" one) at the top of the thread list in a pinned/locked thread, and in a very timely manner. This really helps me a lot and I am very thankful. We asked, they listened. Thanks gobombersgo!
Quote from: peg_city on June 28, 2024, 03:32:44 PMTo look on the positive side, we'll have more funds to spend on NFL cuts.
Keep dreaming. The chances of us picking up an NFL cut who already isn't known to the team or CFL is basically zero. It's something we just don't do. Plus, zero money left... whoever it is would have to be ELC only.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 28, 2024, 11:43:48 PMWe are not anything like Jones in any way shape or form. I am happy to develop and see what we have. That doesn't pan out, bring a body in mid season.
The point is
maybe we should be. Just this
once, for this bad situation we're in. Do the "season is a big tryouts" trick. Find our version of D.Mitchell, which we so desperately need right now (and for 2025 too).
I don't mind giving extended (3-4 game) looks to the "guys we have", but when we exhaust our supply, or show no sparkle after 3-4 games, then bring in more!
Quote from: Pigskin on June 28, 2024, 09:14:03 PMNichols, back in that is very good for our D.
Nichols back is huge. But now I sit and wonder why we held him out last week? My take on his injury was he had his bell rung. Most teams will just rush those guys back in if they aren't badly concussed, and if they are, they are out for several weeks.
We did neither. It's weird. I bet we could have started him, but didn't. That may have been the difference between winning and losing vs BC. How many of those deep torches right in Nichol's lane might we have stopped?
Quote from: theaardvark on June 28, 2024, 04:06:59 PMPretty sure there are reasons why vet CFL receivers are not on rosters, and it's not $SMS concerns.
It's
always SMS concerns. A ton of vets can (still) outperform an ELC, but they are cut because it's not an equation that just has "performance" in it. The equation is always cost divided by performance. Always. And add in a third variable: hope. The ELCs will give you the hope they are the next Schoen. The vets are known quantities. (Well, and the fourth variable: availability, which ELCs usually win by being young and uninjured.)
Moreso, the better the vet is, the more likely he is to be cut because he has set the tone that he's has to be highly paid. Think Jeffcoat and D.Walker. No one will ever call them offering $90k.
Quote from: theaardvark on June 28, 2024, 04:06:59 PMWalker was moved on from for a reason. Next you'll be suggesting Duron Carter. Maybe Milt Stegall? (Hey, did he jinx us by coming to camp?)
Straw man. No one is suggesting Clown Carter or anyone out of the league more than 1 whole season (the same reason I poopooed the D.Adams suggestion).
I've put up a pretty nice list of decent vets, and others have too, that
if money was no object we'd love to have hired to take Bailey's place in FA. It all boils down to money.
We don't need a franchise long-term guy right now: we need a pure mercenary. And we shouldn't care about injury history: give the guy a big salary with no bonus and then who cares if he gets hurt. Then if he sucks too, cut him (a la A.Bowman).
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 28, 2024, 06:20:52 PMSo only 1 global player on the roster this week. IIRC Karamoko was nicked but it's a partial surprise that we didn't activate either of the 2 on the PR. Isn't that the point of keeping them around?
I'm surprised as well. Lucky Ogbeovn was getting reps with ST and was practicing with D Lineman and O line in one on one drills during Tuesday practice. I thought they might use him on D rotationally as an edge rusher and ST...but Griffin was also getting reps on D and ST...Griffin likely gives them more bang for their buck as a gunner on ST. Ogbeovn has quicks and a motor...but he might be a bit undersized for the D Line, not necessarily as an edge rusher but against the run...they ultimately kept Hubert on as a rotating rusher...I think the defining difference between these two 1st year players is familiarity with the Cdn game. Hubert played at McMaster. For me, Ogbeovn stood out because he was going 1000% in his one on one's and was just clearly energized and athletically gifted. If he continues to progress, I can see him being a Hansen type replacement.
Quote from: Slingin Sammy on June 29, 2024, 01:48:01 PMI'm surprised as well. Lucky Ogbeovn was getting reps with ST and was practicing with D Lineman and O line in one on one drills during Tuesday practice. I thought they might use him on D rotationally as an edge rusher and ST...but Griffin was also getting reps on D and ST...Griffin likely gives them more bang for their buck as a gunner on ST. Ogbeovn has quicks and a motor...but he might be a bit undersized for the D Line, not necessarily as an edge rusher but against the run...they ultimately kept Hubert on as a rotating rusher...I think the defining difference between these two 1st year players is familiarity with the Cdn game. Hubert played at McMaster. For me, Ogbeovn stood out because he was going 1000% in his one on one's and was just clearly energized and athletically gifted. If he continues to progress, I can see him being a Hansen type replacement.
Speaking of Hansen, he was getting some significant D-line reps. last night with the Argos and making an impact, dude is incredibly strong.
Ok. Time to end the cliches post game. Time to step up to the LOS on both sides of the ball and win every one on one battle.
Pre season is over. Play like it starting today. Be aggressive.
Quote from: DM83 on June 29, 2024, 03:24:22 PMBlue in BC, I bet the entire forum agrees with you.
I apologize for asking this question but has it been announced what Schoen injury is?
I have not seen it. I heard someone say he is gone for the season. I would speculate that it is an Achilles or an ACL.
Anyone know? Thanks
Unofficially reported as a knee injury of some sort and that he's expected to be gone for the season. While that's very bad it's not as bad as an achilles might be in recovery time or risk of re-injury.
Looking out my front window in calgary this second and there is not a cloud in the sky! ☀️
Game time temp is forecast to be +22C! Let's have some football and beers and bbq's! Will need to Check out HUFF's Hut! 😎
Quote from: DM83 on June 29, 2024, 03:24:22 PMBlue in BC, I bet the entire forum agrees with you.
I apologize for asking this question but has it been announced what Schoen injury is?
I have not seen it. I heard someone say he is gone for the season. I would speculate that it is an Achilles or an ACL.
Anyone know? Thanks
All I've heard is that it's a knee. Whether ACL, MCL or both, I don't know. I'm still, like, you've got to be effin kidding me! I don't think I've ever seen this team suffer injuries like this but to lose Lawler and Shoen like this is unbelievable.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 29, 2024, 06:26:48 AMIt's always SMS concerns. A ton of vets can (still) outperform an ELC, but they are cut because it's not an equation that just has "performance" in it. The equation is always cost divided by performance. Always. And add in a third variable: hope. The ELCs will give you the hope they are the next Schoen. The vets are known quantities. (Well, and the fourth variable: availability, which ELCs usually win by being young and uninjured.)
Moreso, the better the vet is, the more likely he is to be cut because he has set the tone that he's has to be highly paid. Think Jeffcoat and D.Walker. No one will ever call them offering $90k.
Straw man. No one is suggesting Clown Carter or anyone out of the league more than 1 whole season (the same reason I poopooed the D.Adams suggestion).
I've put up a pretty nice list of decent vets, and others have too, that if money was no object we'd love to have hired to take Bailey's place in FA. It all boils down to money.
We don't need a franchise long-term guy right now: we need a pure mercenary. And we shouldn't care about injury history: give the guy a big salary with no bonus and then who cares if he gets hurt. Then if he sucks too, cut him (a la A.Bowman).
I get your point about vets that can still play but I also like the idea of bringing in fresh blood and hope to uncover a diamond in the rough. The potential payoff here is that you could get a dynamic player at a bargain price -- exactly what we need.
Bombers have money to spend, it's just fitting it into the sms cap is the issue. I don't care if they even go over $100,000 on the cap IF THEY truly think they can pull out of this slide. They can afford it. Almost chicken feed with their incoming revenue right now. GC IN Winnipeg next year is even more assured cash flow.
Going over the cap is ALLOWED within the rules, just pay $1-$1 fine UP to $100,000. Over then higher fines and lost draft picks. You don't want to go there. Not cheating to me when it's in the rules and open to see by everyone after the fact. Pathetic cats even went over the cap last year speaking of a team that had a rash if injuries. Bombers not quite at that level yet.
Push the rules to the max if you are a winner mindset. Then it's up to scouts and coaches and gm's to get some magic rolling to get good replacements asap.
Walby seems concerned...
Said the Bombers backend needs to get it together.
I hope Jake Maier and Dave Dickensen do not shred the Bombers pass defence...
I'm Not confident that the pass D is up to stopping this.
keep them off the field I guess. Extra o lineman, run the ball.
Quote from: markf on June 29, 2024, 09:51:59 PMWalby seems concerned...
Said the Bombers backend needs to get it together.
I hope Jake Maier and Dave Dickensen do not shred the Bombers pass defence...
I'm Not confident that the pass D is up to stopping this.
keep them off the field I guess. Extra o lineman, run the ball.
Walby's opinion doesn't hold any more weight than anyone else's drunk uncle at this point (all due respect to the legend, but he's far removed from the game and has no connections to the team itself).
Brady is going to have a massive impact on this game. It's going to be night and day from the first 2.5 games. And I'm sure we'll give up a ton of yards on D that will keep everyone all worked up, but I don't see the Stamps scoring more than 25 points.
Quote from: markf on June 29, 2024, 09:51:59 PMWalby seems concerned...
Said the Bombers backend needs to get it together.
I hope Jake Maier and Dave Dickensen do not shred the Bombers pass defence...
I'm Not confident that the pass D is up to stopping this.
keep them off the field I guess. Extra o lineman, run the ball.
Calgary's pass rush scares me also. I fear for Zach and if he panics and starts throwing picks it could be a long night. Bombers need a good night from the hogs and pound the ball, keep the ball away from the Stamps offense. I do like what Younger has been doing with the D, despite the injuries, and hope that continues and that we can force 2-and-outs and get the ball back in Zach's and Brady's hands. The longer our D is on the field the higher the likelihood that Meier and his receivers have a good game.
Quote from: J5V on June 29, 2024, 10:09:04 PMCalgary's pass rush scares me also. I fear for Zach and if he panics and starts throwing picks it could be a long night. Bombers need a good night from the hogs and pound the ball, keep the ball away from the Stamps offense. I do like what Younger has been doing with the D, despite the injuries, and hope that continues and that we can force 2-and-outs and get the ball back in Zach's and Brady's hands. The longer our D is on the field the higher the likelihood that Meier and his receivers have a good game.
With Brady comes the outlet screen.
A good balanced offence slows down the pass rush. Can we stop running up the gut on play 1 of our 1st series please.
Oliveria is angry and I think that's a good thing. Let him loose.
Quote from: Jesse on June 29, 2024, 10:03:19 PMWalby's opinion doesn't hold any more weight than anyone else's drunk uncle at this point (all due respect to the legend, but he's far removed from the game and has no connections to the team itself).
LOL! I think Walby understands the game a little better than any of my drunk uncles but I see you point, funny as it is. :-)
Quote from: Jesse on June 29, 2024, 10:03:19 PMBrady is going to have a massive impact on this game. It's going to be night and day from the first 2.5 games. And I'm sure we'll give up a ton of yards on D that will keep everyone all worked up, but I don't see the Stamps scoring more than 25 points.
This is exactly the way I hope this game goes. I also want to see this team get through this game without losing any more players to injury.
Don't give up the deep balls, no turn overs, run the ball and keep our O on the field.
Quote from: ichabod_crane on June 29, 2024, 04:51:04 PMLooking out my front window in calgary this second and there is not a cloud in the sky! ☀️
Game time temp is forecast to be +22C! Let's have some football and beers and bbq's! Will need to Check out HUFF's Hut! 😎
Sounds great ichabod. Hope you're having a good one! Wish I could be there. Love me some Calgary and McMahon. The city always treats me right.
I have no hope for us in this one. But that puts me in the nice situation of having no nerves watching on TV. Every single positive will be gravy. Any bad things will just be expected.
The best I think we can hope for is to continue to weed out the gems in order to get stronger for the future.
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 29, 2024, 10:12:33 PMA good balanced offence slows down the pass rush. Can we stop running up the gut on play 1 of our 1st series please.
Oliveria is angry and I think that's a good thing. Let him loose.
Sorry, run up the gut, lol.
lol, first series two runs up the middle 😂
That wasn't pretty
Quote from: ichabod_crane on June 29, 2024, 09:05:45 PMBombers have money to spend, it's just fitting it into the sms cap is the issue. I don't care if they even go over $100,000 on the cap IF THEY truly think they can pull out of this slide. They can afford it. Almost chicken feed with their incoming revenue right now. GC IN Winnipeg next year is even more assured cash flow.
Ya, whenever I say "afford" I mean "cap". No one cares about the "real world" OOP money in WFC-land. As for the going $100k over... there's an optics standpoint and accusations of "cheating". It's not really encouraged even if it's "allowed". I'm not sure the league will look kindly on doing it "on purpose" in an obvious way.
Plus, you need some breathing room for any
accidental/forced overages.
Ugly start for both offences...
Quote from: J5V on June 29, 2024, 10:15:14 PMI also want to see this team get through this game without losing any more players to injury.
This will be key. We have stop taking steps backwards. The injury demons must be exorcised. Our luck has to turn, then we can slowly turn the corner eventually.
So far so good on D
I like Chris Smith - I think he has potential
Quote from: The Zipp on June 29, 2024, 11:13:41 PMUgly start for both offences...
I wouldn't call anything ugly so far. A couple 2 and outs, but no egregious mistakes or anything.
So far we're playing basically as expected.
So far CGY playing worse than I expected, but not by much. Somehow our D manages not to be complete garbage even though half of them are on the IR. It's actually quite amazing.
Tip to Maier: throw deep 25% of the time like VAJ.
Quote from: Jesse on June 29, 2024, 11:18:57 PMI wouldn't call anything ugly so far. A couple 2 and outs, but no egregious mistakes or anything.
What happened to our first (scripted) drives going 40-60 yards & scores like we did all 2021 mid 2023?
Going 2 & out twice to start is "bad team" territory, not GC-worthy team performance.
Awe is a cheap and dirty player
I saw that offside live. It was lining up offside by 1 or 2 guys.
I can't even recall the last time that ever happened. It's literally not a thing. Gotta figure out who did that one. That's not acceptable and it's only luck that we're not punting right now.
Feed BO.
Feed JA.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 29, 2024, 11:21:14 PMWhat happened to our first (scripted) drives going 40-60 yards & scores like we did all 2021 mid 2023?
Going 2 & out twice to start is "bad team" territory, not GC-worthy team performance.
It was one 2 and out and now we're driving. Chill out.
Brady is back baby
New players = mistakes and penalties
Always the way
Good drive.
If demski catches that they challenge for OPI
do we not have another endzone play other than deep to the right corner..every team in the league knows we go there
Quote from: The Zipp on June 29, 2024, 11:27:07 PMNew players = mistakes and penalties
Always the way
I checked on the computer PVR and I don't think he was offside. It was razor close and they usually let those slide. Live it looked horribly offside, but it really wasn't.
Unfortunately the one angle we got was not the best in terms of seeing the ball, but you can tell when the C snaps because of his body movement. Reminds me of the Willie "offsides" where he's just to fast and on the razor's edge that they call it O/S when it's not.
When it's 2 and 8 and they run the ball - they are seeing something that says it will work.
Quote from: Pete on June 29, 2024, 11:29:18 PMdo we not have another endzone play other than deep to the right corner..every team in the league knows we go there
Haha, ya, too true. I want to see more posts where we use it as a rub.
I really like Buck doing a Brady/Johnny dual-set. Finally a glimmer of creativity. No one expects Johnny to have the ball with Brady there.
More of that creativity please!
First we get offence alignment offside, which never happens.
Now we get D holding, which also (almost) never happens. That was a fake call BTW, it was the O holding. Refs really "homing it" today. I really hope MOS holds onto that challenge flag all game. It's the only thing keeping them honest.
decent quarter
I thought Woods got injured last week? Just an in-game thing?
Anyone trying that TSN+ "enhanced game" thing? URL?
Is it free with Shaw subscription or do we need to buy something new?
So far the game looks very relaxed. Like a PS game.
Did you see the intensity of the slobberknocker in TOR last night? Yowzers.
Maybe it'll amp up if the game stays close into the 2nd half.
Terrible throw
That may be one of Zach's worst (i.e. completely avoidable) INTs. It wasn't even disguised well. It's like he has tunnel vision these days.
At least MTL had to work to trick him. This was just a MLB guy roaming the flat, normal stuff. Not good.
I hope this doesn't turn into a bad ToP situation...
Questionable play call by DD...
Quote from: The Zipp on June 29, 2024, 11:45:10 PMQuestionable play call by DD...
Totally normal for him these last 3 seasons. He's kind of lost his mind. Or he's run some stats and he thinks it's smart... maybe it is smart on paper, who knows, but in-game it rarely works out for him.
I knew that was an overthrow the instant it left Maier's hands. Even with all that glue on Begelton's mitts he couldn't reel it in.
I think you could blitz the bombers and we can't stop it.
Special teams are firing
Zac doesn't seem to be reading defenses well
I'm not sure the refs' brains are working at all today. "Holding - CGY".
P.S. OT's do that "holding" all the time and it's rarely called. Lightly hanging on isn't usually a problem, especially when the guy still gets a sack.
Zach turtling again, and no hot routes and outlets planned by Buck. Well, at least he stood in there rather than running into it, I just wish his eyes stayed downfield... If you don't make them pay, they'll keep doing it.
Quote from: Pete on June 29, 2024, 11:49:37 PMZac doesn't seem to be reading defenses well
Honestly. Both the pick and the sack stem to him not seeing the D in front of him.
Both teams look baaaaaad. Compare to the MTL/TOR game or the EDM/BC game... wow, both CGY and WPG are total basement dwellers.
We should be thankful we get to play CGY today. Only OTT and maybe HAM are nearly as bad.
I like #52
running game was working. so buck stops running. I do not get it.
Zac needs to start using some of the rookies, its getting stupid
Demski and Woli carrying the load in the receiving game
Quote from: markf on June 29, 2024, 11:54:12 PMrunning game was working. so buck stops running. I do not get it.
Not the last 2 zero yard runs. The pass & run blitz can be combined a bit to nullify your run.
And hey, maybe the big plan is to rack up as many INTs as we can?
No hole for BO on that one
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 29, 2024, 11:52:32 PMBoth teams look baaaaaad. Compare to the MTL/TOR game or the EDM/BC game... wow, both CGY and WPG are total basement dwellers.
We should be thankful we get to play CGY today. Only OTT and maybe HAM are nearly as bad.
Toronto scored 6 points in the first half against Montreal. You just are talking out of your butt at this point. Everything runs through this narrative in your head that you ignore anything that doesn't fit.
Quote from: Pete on June 29, 2024, 11:55:24 PMZac needs to start using some of the rookies, its getting stupid
It's not our M.O., we just ignore the rookies. It's not a bad idea as they'll probably just jog and whiff every time anyhow (see: last game).
I did like seeing the FB pass though! I want more of that. We're not going to out-talent anybody, so Buck needs to out-think them.
Quote from: Jesse on June 29, 2024, 11:56:59 PMToronto scored 6 points in the first half against Montreal. You just are talking out of your butt at this point. Everything runs through this narrative in your head that you ignore anything that doesn't fit.
Ya, against the miles-away league-best D. TOR in every other game had Dukes looking like the next best QB. I stand by my statement.
Did you see the intensity of every play in that game, by both teams? If you can't see the difference in general talent between the top 5 and bottom 4 teams then I'm not sure what to say.
Was it a shot in the nards? Wind knocked out ?
again trying to force the ball into demski, i know we;re gonna rely on vets but we need to at least put some doubts in the stamps that we will throw to someone else
Zach is just winded, or has some chest injury. Nothing on that hit had anything to do with his head.
I bet he sits out a series and comes back.
On the bright side, now everyone who wanted Strevie gets to see if he learned to throw in the NFL or not.
Demski have a point about the DPI? I guess you can say the D guy edged him away from it, but D guy can play the ball too. I don't think you get DPI on that one.
I like this gameday thread today. It's seems a little more active than usual. Been kind of missing that the last couple of years. Or maybe it's just me.
Ford looking good
Ford amazing int, we got a star here boyz
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 12:03:44 AMDemski have a point about the DPI? I guess you can say the D guy edged him away from it, but D guy can play the ball too. I don't think you get DPI on that one.
I don't think there was DPI
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 12:04:27 AMFord looking good
That was a great play. That's what we wanted to see from Mr. NFL.
Strevie actually gonna be allowed to throw after the ad break? My money is on "no". Bet they run. Do the 2 back set with Strevie as 3rd option! However, might be tough to beat the run blitz.
run d is impressive.
Sure hope Zach doesn't have rib damage
Yay! We have proof Strev can pass!! A 4Y dump. Hey, I'll take it!
I like Emperor Clercius. He's still looked better than almost all the rookie IMPs. That was a good catch and tough hang-on.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 12:00:37 AMYa, against the miles-away league-best D. TOR in every other game had Dukes looking like the next best QB. I stand by my statement.
Did you see the intensity of every play in that game, by both teams? If you can't see the difference in general talent between the top 5 and bottom 4 teams then I'm not sure what to say.
The baaaaad was a little over the top
They are loading the box and stuffing the run
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 12:09:31 AMThey are loading the box and stuffing the run
No kidding. If you're playing undialed and INT & sack-happy Zach, wouldn't you stuff the run too? A possible counter is we start attacking the edges with wider runs.
Maier still looks like he's shot-putting sometimes. The release is bad and you know it's a bad throw.
But earlier in the season he looked much sharper. Dickenson The Remaining must be praying he doesn't regress.
Arm strength has always been Maier's biggest weakness.
Wait! Stop the presses! BA37 was in the picture on a deep post!!
P.S. Clock needs to start right away on that sideline tackle: he was moving backwards
Don't give up a td
that was the first time our line got within 2 yards of maier. and he still had a lot of time
Quote from: bomb squad on June 30, 2024, 12:09:21 AMThe baaaaad was a little over the top
Uh, have you seen the score and on-field play? Ya, baaaaaaad.
9-7 at the half? Who took the halftime under? LOL.
Bombers playing good
Bomber D playing great. If we can get the offense rolling we'll be in good shape.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 12:15:50 AMWait! Stop the presses! BA37 was in the picture on a deep post!!
I'm trying to be funny, but I'm also deadly serious that our FS helping out on the deep routes is deadly critical. And the fact he was there is actually great news, and awesome that whoever our
real DC is is paying attention and trying to fix things.
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 12:19:53 AMBomber D playing great. If we can get the offense rolling we'll be in good shape.
Are they? Or is the CGY O and Maier just baaaaad? Serious question.
Decent halftime on the road for a struggling team. Can't make mistakes like turnovers in the second half or give up explosion plays to bagelton
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 12:17:39 AMUh, have you seen the score and on-field play? Ya, baaaaaaad.
9-7 at the half? Who took the halftime under? LOL.
A low score doesn't mean it's baaaaad. And the on field play isn't baaaaad either. So theeeere.
Broken rib??
Seems like they can get a pass over the middle with no issues
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 12:35:56 AMBroken rib??
I don't think its a broken rib, he wouldn't be able to breath... maybe bruised but I think the medical staff are being cautious to prevent further damage to his upper body.....
Holm is gutting it out
Is jefferson playing? just kidding, but its not because they are double teaming him, hes just ineffective. Thank goodness our dbs are playing lights out
Now we've lost our QB to injury. This is just ridiculous.
Not a great pass by Strev on the run
happy feet
now we can see if strev has improved since his tenure in the nfl...
Perhaps the D is gonna need to score ??!
I guess I can't change my pick to Calgary now that ZC is out of game. Jeez who else are we going to lose to injuries.
with collaris on the sidelines , with lawler and Schoen, thats over $1 million of our cap
will either team score a td???
That's the 2nd kick Chris Smith misjudged the ball and giving up 2 whole points.
Zach has a bruised rib is my guess
Big play Willie
Put the punter on offense !!
My biggest pet peeve.... taking a penalty with "no end"
No end penalty - that's on coaching and practice..
Bad throwing by Strev there
Defence needs to stop, not convinced we have more than 3-7 points from this offence
Probably on the new receivers
Fayad #52 hugged him on that penalty
Dumb penalties
New players = penalties
Bad penalties
Shoe string tackle....
Nowhere for BO to go - gotta go play action and throw
No first downs for Strev??
Not a great punt
Calgary not respecting the pass
Quote from: Go_Big_D on June 30, 2024, 12:50:23 AMwill either team score a td???
its certainly wont be us, unless its by the defense
8 first downs...the Drew Willy era is back...
Strev can throw. He just needs to settle down.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:05:10 AMNo first downs for Strev??
Who was it that insisted we bench Zach for him?
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 01:10:24 AMStrev can throw. He just needs to settle down.
Why do people keep saying this? He's literally never proven he can throw.
Strevy magic will be needed now
Game over, season over. It's next year time.
yeah earlier in the year i was saying that strev would have improved with his nfl experience, but he's sure proving me wrong
Gotta think with just bruised ribs Zach would be back in the game??
with this O Line, pocket passing is suicide
sure seems like back to square 1. on Offence.
plus side.... D is getting it together.
hard to believe that streveller isn't better than what he's shown.
Quote from: Jesse on June 30, 2024, 01:12:17 AMWhy do people keep saying this? He's literally never proven he can throw.
What are you talking about? He threw a beautiful pass for the TD to AH in the 2019 Grey Cup. He can definitely throw.
winnipeg's bench looks defeated already
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:16:11 AMGotta think with just bruised ribs Zach would be back in the game??
Has there been any actual information about bruised ribs? Seems everyone is assuming this.
I have absolutely no hope Winnipeg is coming back in this game. Our defence can't be on the field the whole time when Strevy can't throw the ball 10 yards.
If they can't score,starting from midfield, this game is over.
Quote from: Pete on June 30, 2024, 01:17:18 AMwinnipeg's bench looks defeated already
Thought the same thing
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 01:16:55 AMWhat are you talking about? He threw a beautiful pass for the TD to AH in the 2019 Grey Cup. He can definitely throw.
So you have one example against how many 2 and outs?
Josh Johnson - nice knowing you.
Legit question - is Lofton a legit starting o linemen??
Another penalty...coaching and practice
Sergio my hero 59 yards
Special teams have come to play today!!
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:20:01 AMJosh Johnson - nice knowing you.
Facts. Get rid of that guy.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:22:52 AMSpecial teams have come to play today!!
Definitely. Huge step up all around for ST
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:20:01 AMJosh Johnson - nice knowing you.
yeah hes afraid of the middle
60 yards is legit a bomb kick. Now defence needs to hold
Calgary O working against the wind and the Bomber D playing off. Stupid coaching. Calgary will run the clock out.
D can't stop them
5 minutes left and I think that's the first time Maier got touched
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:29:17 AM5 minutes left and I think that's the first time Maier got touched
Well, there was a roughing the passer call against us
Zach hasnt been breaking records so far except maybe for interceptions by the end of the season
Make that 3 points with Chris Smith letting the ball go over his head
Quote from: Go_Big_D on June 30, 2024, 01:29:50 AMZach hasnt been breaking records so far except maybe for interceptions by the end of the season
At least Zach can throw longer than 10 yards
More penalties
Rookies taking penalties.
Strevy no chemistry with the rookies
noone has any chemistry with the rookies, wilson should be gone as well
Gotta go for 1st down... time is our enemy
Quote from: barbk on June 30, 2024, 01:32:46 AMAt least Zach can throw longer than 10 yards
lol...interceptions yes
Second half they barely got BO the ball - that is a mistake
Man o man those penalties
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:38:16 AMSecond half they barely got BO the ball - that is a mistake
Maybe just try something other than running him up the middle?
Quote from: barbk on June 30, 2024, 01:31:03 AMMake that 3 points with Chris Smith letting the ball go over his head
I've seen a few comments on this - giving up a single to go to the 40 isn't always a bad decision.
Quote from: Go_Big_D on June 30, 2024, 01:29:50 AMZach hasnt been breaking records so far except maybe for interceptions by the end of the season
Ridiculous statement
Boat moving with lines out
Full yard short - stupid decision making by Strev
Quote from: Jesse on June 30, 2024, 01:39:12 AMMaybe just try something other than running him up the middle?
Exactly. He is one of the best players..screen pass
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:40:30 AMFull yard short - stupid decision making by Strev
i dont blame strev.....doubt if anyone was open downfield
Good read by Nichols (spook) too bad it didn't go for 6
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 01:40:05 AMRidiculous statement
Boat moving with lines out
lol explain where it was ridiculous...boat moving with lines out seems to be ur issue
Smith looks fantastic
Procedure penalties. Maybe practice is an issue
heck of a pass
atta boy strev!!!!!
Strevy threw it to his BFF
Receivers suck they said
Fly in vets they said
Strev can't throw they said
Bird ready
Magic is real
OT time
Castillo Bomb made this possible
Quote from: Go_Big_D on June 30, 2024, 01:44:43 AMlol explain where it was ridiculous...boat moving with lines out seems to be ur issue
Zach career
Td vs int
182 89
To suggest he would break the record on ints is ridiculous by definition
Wilson beast
There is the Strevy bad throw
Back foot Strevy
bloody buck strikes again
Quote from: Pete on June 30, 2024, 12:46:22 AMwith collaris on the sidelines , with lawler and Schoen, thats over $1 million of our cap
Over $1.15M by my calculations.
Time to take another look at the Bonus SMS and Restructure threads! On the bright side, Zach will be back soon enough, not like Schoen.
more like bucks dumb play calling
BO didn't touch the ball in ot
closer than i would have thought, give em credit for fighting thru
doesnt buck have RPO's in his playbook?
Great ball game, some good signs for the blue but injuries and penalties are regrettable
This team sucks.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 01:51:05 AMReceivers suck they said
Fly in vets they said
Strev can't throw they said
Bird ready
I guess you can just keep those birds for yourself.
Strev is not a starting QB ...he is a gimmick guy - short yardage player.
Special teams were great
Not getting the ball in BO's hands in OT was a mistake
Penalties were an issue
O line not good enough
Defence had limited pressure
Another step forward as we now went to OT.
I'm getting tired of improving but still losing.
I will say I liked Strev for the last quarter,I'm sure he'd like that last pass back. But he stepped up later in the game and I am not quite as worried.
Sure hope Collaros isn't out long though. Hope there aren't broken ribs.
Quote from: Jesse on June 30, 2024, 02:04:03 AMI guess you can just keep those birds for yourself.
Receivers played well
Strev looked decent
Yeah I'll have some bird but a wee bit should be shared
This loss was huge for standings..we will be fighting with Calgary for playoffs.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 02:05:42 AMReceivers played well
Strev looked decent
Yeah I'll have some bird but a wee bit should be shared
Receivers dropped more passes than they caught.
Strev looked the same as always.
This was an extremely poorly played game on offence.
Quote from: barbk on June 30, 2024, 01:22:01 AMSergio my hero 59 yards
I'm 45 mins behind after having to bbq dinner...
This 59Y FG, maybe Castillo's longest?, is literally the highlight of our season so far. And I'm not being facetious. It's a great thing to rally behind. Most coaches won't go for that, and most PK can't make it reliably.
Way to go "Chippy" Castillo! (I think stats guys need to throw away the week 1 Castillo stats.)
Quote from: Big Daddy on June 30, 2024, 02:05:26 AMAnother step forward as we now went to OT.
I'm getting tired of improving but still losing.
I will say I liked Strev for the last quarter,I'm sure he'd like that last pass back. But he stepped up later in the game and I am not quite as worried.
Sure hope Collaros isn't out long though. Hope there aren't broken ribs.
Critical issue is the condition of the ribs. Otherwise we be ok. D played well. ST good. With Zach O be fine.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 02:07:07 AMThis loss was huge for standings..we will be fighting with Calgary for playoffs.
And the win was there for the taking if we just had anything on offence.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:07:21 AMI'm 45 mins behind after having to bbq dinner...
This 59Y FG, maybe Castillo's longest?, is literally the highlight of our season so far. And I'm not being facetious. It's a great thing to rally behind. Most coaches won't go for that, and most PK can't make it reliably.
Way to go "Chippy" Castillo! (I think stats guys need to throw away the week 1 Castillo stats.)
60
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:07:21 AMI'm 45 mins behind after having to bbq dinner...
This 59Y FG, maybe Castillo's longest?, is literally the highlight of our season so far. And I'm not being facetious. It's a great thing to rally behind. Most coaches won't go for that, and most PK can't make it reliably.
Way to go "Chippy" Castillo! (I think stats guys need to throw away the week 1 Castillo stats.)
It's a Bomber record.
Quote from: Big Daddy on June 30, 2024, 02:05:26 AMAnother step forward as we now went to OT.
I'm getting tired of improving but still losing.
I will say I liked Strev for the last quarter,I'm sure he'd like that last pass back. But he stepped up later in the game and I am not quite as worried.
Sure hope Collaros isn't out long though. Hope there aren't broken ribs.
They're not improving.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:21:48 AMLegit question - is Lofton a legit starting o linemen??
Far and away Lofton's worst game for us so far. Showing us why SSK pass pro was so bad last season. He wasn't looking great last game either. But in week 1 & 2 he was ok. Maybe teams have figured him out? He seems weak vs guys going around the horn.
Quote from: Jesse on June 30, 2024, 02:07:18 AMReceivers dropped more passes than they caught.
Strev looked the same as always.
This was an extremely poorly played game on offence.
Receivers battled back after some drops yes. All the new faces contributed and that a good sign.
Strev played well, had a mistake at a critical part of the game.
Over stated on the negative. I see good signs.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 01:58:12 AMWilson beast
showed a lot there. man that was slick.
game tieing drive... restored hope.
Still an ugly loss but there was improvement in many areas. That's a small consolation.
1. Collaros injury was hopefully just precautionary keeping him out.
2. Streveler has horrible throwing mechanics. Accuracy not that great and don't give me rusty.
3. Oliveria wanted the ball. He got it and failed essentially. Not all his fault with little passing game.
4. Defence played well for most of the day.
5. Too many penalties still and those hurt us.
6. Castillo brought his A game.
7. O. Wilson and J. Johnson finally got a few chances to show what they could do.
At the least the point spread means we can still win the season series. I'd say we HAVE TO at this point.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:09:31 AMFar and away Lofton's worst game for us so far. Showing us why SSK pass pro was so bad last season. He wasn't looking great last game either. But in week 1 & 2 he was ok. Maybe teams have figured him out? He seems weak vs guys going around the horn.
Concerning yes
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 30, 2024, 02:10:25 AMStill an ugly loss but there was improvement in many areas. That's a small consolation.
1. Collaros injury was hopefully just precautionary
2. Streveler has horrible throwing mechanics. Accuracy not that great and don't give me rusty.
3. Oliveria wanted the ball. He got it and failed essentially. Not all his fault with little passing game.
4. Defence played well for most of the day.
5. Too many penalties still and those hurt us.
6. Castillo brought his A game.
7. O. Wilson and J. Johnson finally got a few chances to show what they could do.
At the least the point spread means we can still win the season series. I'd say we HAVE TO at this point.
All good pts
Quote from: Big Daddy on June 30, 2024, 01:17:42 AMHas there been any actual information about bruised ribs? Seems everyone is assuming this.
Not yet (with my tape delay). But I studied the hit and there was no head contact with anything. No player contact, no turf contact. Ya, you can still rattle your brain just taking a chest hit, but it's rare(r). So what's left over... more than just "wind", so some bruise/discomfort in the chest. Not so horrible they don't send him out again (they did), but enough that after that he leaves the game.
My money is on some minor chest/rib thing and he'll be fine in 1-3 weeks.
The better question is why is our OL taking an insane number of IP flags? Everyone is taking a turn! Real embarrassing ones too. We usually take 0-1 a game, not 3+.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:59:36 AMThere is the Strevy bad throw
I disagree. That's a jump ball and Demski fell down on the play resulting in an easy INT. Lots of heart shown on the road to force it to OT and a great chance to win it with a major in OT. I'm proud of this team and the way they battled until the final whistle. We are very close to turning this thing around and there is lots to build on. If we keep playing with heart like that the football gods will smile on us yet, guaranteed.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 02:05:05 AMStrev is not a starting QB ...he is a gimmick guy - short yardage player.
Special teams were great
Not getting the ball in BO's hands in OT was a mistake
Penalties were an issue
O line not good enough
Defence had limited pressure
Got to practice and tell Strev his is a gimmic guy to his face. Have some respect. Decent 2nd stringer. If you wouldn't say it to their face don't say it here.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 02:10:11 AMReceivers battled back after some drops yes. All the new faces contributed and that a good sign.
Strev played well, had a mistake at a critical part of the game.
Over stated on the negative. I see good signs.
He did not play well. He had one successful drive the whole game. That doesn't negate every other drive.
Quote from: Go_Big_D on June 30, 2024, 01:29:50 AMZach hasnt been breaking records so far except maybe for interceptions by the end of the season
I think he's going for lowest QB Rating in the history of the league. Lower than Brohm! ;D ;D ;D
I kid! I love Zach and still have faith he'll figure it out.
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 02:15:38 AMI disagree. That's a jump ball and Demski fell down on the play resulting in an easy INT. Lots of heart shown on the road to force it to OT and a great chance to win it with a major in OT. I'm proud of this team and the way they battled until the final whistle. We are very close to turning this thing around and there is lots to build on. If we keep playing with heart like that the football gods will smile on us yet, guaranteed.
Props man we have the exact same attitude and you sum it up well. Love what you bring to this place bud!!! Keep it up.
Team showed some improvement. Loss still stings though. This is a big hole to climb out of. Just have to keep fighting.
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:37:09 AMStrevy no chemistry with the rookies
Which is extremely odd as he practices all day with the #2 Team. Usually the #2 comes in and is great with the #2 Rs. Very strange.
Quote from: Jesse on June 30, 2024, 02:19:53 AMHe did not play well. He had one successful drive the whole game. That doesn't negate every other drive.
Well considering the circumstances. One throw away from victory. Showed a lot of moxie on the last drive. We can agree to disagree.
Quote from: Pete on June 30, 2024, 01:38:00 AMnoone has any chemistry with the rookies, wilson should be gone as well
Johnson gets a break since this is his first game starting. Wilson has had a couple/few starts and consistently been stanky. He gets the apple first. Johnson gets a longer leash.
... now make it 4 IP penalties. It wasn't just Stan, Neuf moved early too. Clearly they aren't used to working with Strev.
Our D stopped run most of the time but Maier had too long to throw most of the night. I suppose considering the inexperience of our rookie DL that was to be expected. IMO they are improving and it was good to get Nichols back.
Ford made a great pick but also made a couple of key errors including not switching on the TD.
Without success in the passing attack it's difficult to blame the OL, however, they are not playing well.
Is it time to give one of the PR OT's a chance?
I thought Buck should have had Smith in as a 2nd RB in the 4th Q a few times. That would have given the Stamps defence more to worry about since our passing game was not a threat.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:21:45 AMWhich is extremely odd as he practices all day with the #2 Team. Usually the #2 comes in and is great with the #2 Rs. Very strange.
The starting receivers are all the # 2 players and in one case our # 3 receiver from the PR. We didn't add a bunch of rookies when Streveler came into the game.
I see we have another new poster. He seems to not be a giant negatron, but we'll see. It's curious that we lose a troll and all of a sudden a newbet arrives.
Like I said, he sounded like a normal guy so far.
Quote from: Pete on June 30, 2024, 01:38:00 AMnoone has any chemistry with the rookies, wilson should be gone as well
Hard no on Wilson being cut, shows promise
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 01:46:11 AMProcedure penalties. Maybe practice is an issue
Practice? These guys practice? :-) I'm pretty sure they are just sipping daiquiris for an hour in Pinnacle and then going to Willie's house for a pool party and ordering Slurpees from 7-11 via Skip the Dishes.
Oh wait.... Strev just got a TD!! You guys know the result... I don't yet! OT here we come eh! Exciting!
Quote from: barbk on June 30, 2024, 01:50:42 AMStrevy threw it to his BFF
There's your chemistry! Those guys have a secret code and playbook together. Book it!
Quote from: barbk on June 30, 2024, 01:50:42 AMStrevy threw it to his BFF
Strevie's TD does what Zach hasn't done in 6.3 games (including last year): throw a TD pass.
Doh!
Quote from: The Zipp on June 30, 2024, 02:01:26 AMBO didn't touch the ball in ot
When Suits said Brady was stewing on the sidelines in the 4th, I'm pretty sure those shots of Brady moping were him actually in pain. When he left the field after that last tackle he looked hurt, hopping around. Pretty sure he was just a decoy after that. He toughed it out so CGY had to take the run threat seriously, which they may not if Johnny was in.
Quote from: Jesse on June 30, 2024, 02:07:59 AMAnd the win was there for the taking if we just had anything on offence.
Yup, closest one yet.
We forgot the cardinal (only!) rule of OT: don't turn the ball over!! Literally do anything except TO. Doh.
Being burned by Houston is fitting. We deserve it.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 02:08:13 AM60
TSN guys kept saying 59? And we were at the 52? 52+7=59? I'll have to recheck. I'll take all y'alls word for it until then!
60! Woot woot. Where was Castillo in the '17 WSF LOL (I think it was '17?).
Quote from: Big Daddy on June 30, 2024, 02:05:26 AMAnother step forward as we now went to OT.
I'm getting tired of improving but still losing.
I will say I liked Strev for the last quarter,I'm sure he'd like that last pass back. But he stepped up later in the game and I am not quite as worried.
Sure hope Collaros isn't out long though. Hope there aren't broken ribs.
I agree. Strev still mostly Strev. But it's his first live-fire game, so he gets some slack for 1-3 weeks, when he can practice with the first unit. If he's "good ol' Strev" cold off the bench, you've got to think he'll actually be New & Improved Strev the next couple of weeks. I'm hopeful, if he's the #1 for a little while.
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 30, 2024, 02:27:24 AMThe starting receivers are all the # 2 players and in one case our # 3 receiver from the PR. We didn't add a bunch of rookies when Streveler came into the game.
Good point. Haha. Still, you'd think Strev would have better chem with whoever the non-desired-starters are... But you guys made a good point earlier about Woli/BFF. Maybe we should have just had Strev throwing to him. In between series they can sandlot out ideas on the sidelines and then ignore Buck. ;) ;) ;)
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 02:27:31 AMHard no on Wilson being cut, shows promise
That's literally his only notable play in, I think, 3 games? Sure, it was a great play! But his whiffs earlier in games are what is putting us into these tough 4th Q / OT situations.
If he wants to step up and be a part of this team he needs to up his game immediately. Otherwise he will be the first one cut.
Quote from: Blue In BC on June 30, 2024, 02:26:03 AMOur D stopped run most of the time but Maier had too long to throw most of the night. I suppose considering the inexperience of our rookie DL that was to be expected. IMO they are improving and it was good to get Nichols back.
Without success in the passing attack it's difficult to blame the OL, however, they are not playing well.
Is it time to give one of the PR OT's a chance?
Our run D has been consistently strong. At least we have something to hang our hat on. Clearly we are focusing on that. However, we often let teams pass at will, and we still often give up that "free" wide out.
PR OT: ya well we cut Ivey who was supposed to be "the guy". I bet we paid Lofton decent coin too, and probably a small signing bonus. Sigh. SSK fans knew the deal with Lofton... swapping ORTs with them paying $125k more should have been our first hint.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:47:32 AMTSN guys kept saying 59? And we were at the 52? 52+7=59? I'll have to recheck. I'll take all y'alls word for it until then!
60! Woot woot. Where was Castillo in the '17 WSF LOL (I think it was '17?).
That was 62 I think
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 03:00:19 AMThat's literally his only notable play in, I think, 3 games? Sure, it was a great play! But his whiffs earlier in games are what is putting us into these tough 4th Q / OT situations.
If he wants to step up and be a part of this team he needs to up his game immediately. Otherwise he will be the first one cut.
Shows some promise but yes needs to step up. You only cut a guy if you have an immediate better replacement.
Quote from: Blueforlife on June 30, 2024, 03:11:27 AMThat was 62 I think
61 in BC? Ya, and Castillo apparently had a big wind at his back today. Still, it's a fun thought experiment: would Castillo make that 61 kick... Then again Meddy was basically the GOAT, and MOS said he makes that kick in practice all the time. Just bad luck that day. Straight down main street, but short. That loss really hurt...
Is this 60 really Blue Bomber's longest ever? Wow, again, kudos to Castillo. Love that guy since his '21 GC win postgame woohoo dance.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:47:32 AMTSN guys kept saying 59? And we were at the 52? 52+7=59? I'll have to recheck. I'll take all y'alls word for it until then!
60!
It was 60. Castillo & Lauther kick from 8 yards back of the line of scrimmage.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 03:22:52 AM61 in BC? Ya, and Castillo apparently had a big wind at his back today. Still, it's a fun thought experiment: would Castillo make that 61 kick... Then again Meddy was basically the GOAT, and MOS said he makes that kick in practice all the time. Just bad luck that day. Straight down main street, but short. That loss really hurt...
Is this 60 really Blue Bomber's longest ever? Wow, again, kudos to Castillo. Love that guy since his '21 GC win postgame woohoo dance.
Last October at BC Place, Castillo hit the left upright from 58 in warmup but came up short from 62.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 03:22:52 AM61 in BC? Ya, and Castillo apparently had a big wind at his back today. Still, it's a fun thought experiment: would Castillo make that 61 kick... Then again Meddy was basically the GOAT, and MOS said he makes that kick in practice all the time. Just bad luck that day. Straight down main street, but short. That loss really hurt...
Is this 60 really Blue Bomber's longest ever? Wow, again, kudos to Castillo. Love that guy since his '21 GC win postgame woohoo dance.
61
https://winnipegsun.com/2016/11/13/decision-by-bombers-coach-oshea-to-kick-for-the-win-will-be-questioned
We were talking earlier about something O'Shea said which was "follow the process". I think the process is playing the game the right way. It is not about the final result. No one has control of the final result. The best you can do is follow the process and if you do it to the best of your ability the final result will be there. No shortcuts. I believe the best teams do this and the ones that focus on the final result are the ones that will fail sooner or later. You have to focus on the process and if you do it well maybe by the end of the season you'll see the results. I don't want this team worrying about and trying to influence wins and losses. As a fan I want this team to play it's best football and let the results take care of themselves. If that takes five, ten, or more games then so be it. I believe that we got to the top the last four or five years by following the process and that's how we'll get there again. I'm glad our coaches and management staff run the team this way. I don't see any despair or panic in O'Shea because he knows this and he is seeing progress with the process. We're playing better and better and getting close to realising the result we want to see.
Quote from: Stats Junkie on June 30, 2024, 03:49:59 AMIt was 60. Castillo & Lauther kick from 8 yards back of the line of scrimmage.
Wow! Thanks for the info! I never knew that. How unusual. Is 8Y an adjustment to all the FG blocks the league (and our team) saw in 2022/2023? Certainly gives you that extra leverage on the angle on the long ones... but it means you have to be that hair extra accurate and strong.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:47:32 AMTSN guys kept saying 59? And we were at the 52? 52+7=59? I'll have to recheck. I'll take all y'alls word for it until then!
60! Woot woot. Where was Castillo in the '17 WSF LOL (I think it was '17?).
Yes it was 59 to 60 yards. HE booted it directly in front of me at McMahon. Was a decent breeze behind him too. Cleared with a lot to spare too. A MEGA BOOT! :) They just ruined a good comeback story by choking in Overtime! :(
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 02:47:32 AMTSN guys kept saying 59? And we were at the 52? 52+7=59? I'll have to recheck. I'll take all y'alls word for it until then!
60! Woot woot. Where was Castillo in the '17 WSF LOL (I think it was '17?).
Yes it was 59 to 60 yards. HE booted it directly in front of me at McMahon. Was a decent breeze behind him too. Cleared with a lot to spare too. A MEGA BOOT! :) They just ruined a good comeback story by choking in Overtime! :(
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 03:22:52 AM61 in BC? Ya, and Castillo apparently had a big wind at his back today. Still, it's a fun thought experiment: would Castillo make that 61 kick... Then again Meddy was basically the GOAT, and MOS said he makes that kick in practice all the time. Just bad luck that day. Straight down main street, but short. That loss really hurt...
Is this 60 really Blue Bomber's longest ever? Wow, again, kudos to Castillo. Love that guy since his '21 GC win postgame woohoo dance.
It WAS NOT GALE force Sask winds. Gusting at times, but nothing that would bowl you over. No, it was mostly LEG that hoofed that FG.
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 04:11:55 AMWe were talking earlier about something O'Shea said which was "follow the process". I think the process is playing the game the right way. It is not about the final result.
We're playing better and better and getting close to realising the result we want to see.
Our D is. But I think our O took a big step back today compared to the BC game last week. Vs BC our O had several drives where we were in full control and looking just like good ol' WFC from 2023.
And we can't just cite Zach leaving as the problem: our O had nothing going at all even with Zach in. We basically had one good drive all game: Strev's TD one.
I get the whole "process" thing, but we've never been in this injury boat before, not even in MOS's early years here. You
may reach a point where the process can't handle the egregious exceptions you're faced with. Every other team would be bringing in vets by this point... we seem content to ignore that option.
Quote from: ichabod_crane on June 30, 2024, 04:28:56 AMYes it was 59 to 60 yards. HE booted it directly in front of me at McMahon. Was a decent breeze behind him too. Cleared with a lot to spare too. A MEGA BOOT! :) They just ruined a good comeback story by choking in Overtime! :(
Thanks for the first-hand comments. Hope you had a good evening there! A nice night for some CFL ball. TSN had lots of shots of Bomber supporters in the stands having fun... watch the PVR and let us know if any were you!
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 04:31:52 AMOur D is. But I think our O took a big step back today compared to the BC game last week. Vs BC our O had several drives where we were in full control and looking just like good ol' WFC from 2023.
And we can't just cite Zach leaving as the problem: our O had nothing going at all even with Zach in. We basically had one good drive all game: Strev's TD one.
I get the whole "process" thing, but we've never been in this injury boat before, not even in MOS's early years here. You may reach a point where the process can't handle the egregious exceptions you're faced with. Every other team would be bringing in vets by this point... we seem content to ignore that option.
Agreed. I suppose there are two ways you can go -- bring in vets or try players from your own talent pool. The decision seems to be the latter and I don't know enough about building a football team to say one is better than another. I do like the idea of fresh talent though.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 30, 2024, 04:34:35 AMThanks for the first-hand comments. Hope you had a good evening there! A nice night for some CFL ball. TSN had lots of shots of Bomber supporters in the stands having fun... watch the PVR and let us know if any were you!
Will try to watch the recording sometime this long weekend if I can withstand the horror!😝
I was like 15-20 rows up on the east sunny side. So many open seats I eventually moved to centre field.
An amazing day for football. Clear skies, about +23 but felt warmer. Lots of eye candy! 😋 many old timers too. Met and talked to several bomber fans. Some even from out of town. Stamps fans were groaning too what a snoozefest it was until late! Jake "the snake" Maier did not have a great game either. Bombers maybe did not have sacks, but I saw a lot of pressure often.
Hey we have not had much real summer weather in Calgary this year. Cool and rainy often. Not soaking rains, but regular rains and drizzle. Including a mega doozy thunderstorm last
Monday which looked like Zeus or Thor was raining down lightning bolts! ⚡️⛈️🌩�🙃
So with a day/evening like today everybody including bombers fans were enjoying summer! Just in time for stampede! YEE HAW! 🤣
Several areas of the bombers are not good.
The OL Does not give the quarterback enough time and he will also be injured.
With our star receivers injured it's very unfortunate.
I do not know why we have to give up two singles, I could possibly see one but not two?
Quote from: Bomber Diehard on June 30, 2024, 12:58:48 PMSeveral areas of the bombers are not good.
The OL Does not give the quarterback enough time and he will also be injured.
With our star receivers injured it's very unfortunate.
I do not know why we have to give up two singles, I could possibly see one but not two?
Field position for an offense that is struggling mightily.
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 05:01:03 AMAgreed. I suppose there are two ways you can go -- bring in vets or try players from your own talent pool. The decision seems to be the latter and I don't know enough about building a football team to say one is better than another. I do like the idea of fresh talent though.
I see us choosing from within our talent pool as a vote of confidence on our scouting staff. They found the first dalton schoen they ll find his replacement.
Quote from: dd on June 30, 2024, 07:38:44 PMI see us choosing from within our talent pool as a vote of confidence on our scouting staff. They found the first dalton schoen they ll find his replacement.
Yeah, agreed. Some fans are panicking but that's never a good idea. It starts you down a slippery slope of not developing your own for the sake of signing cast-offs. I think we have found some very good talent. Unfortunately injuries have struck and it's put us in a bind. We seem to have come out of yesterday's game relatively uninjured so that's a positive sign that maybe we can remain healthy going forward. We are not getting blown out of games. We are competitive and I truly believe the wins will come. If we end the season out of the playoffs it'll be disappointing but after four grey cup appearances in a row I can live with that if I know we are trending in the right direction. This group brought us to the top before, they can do it again.
Ya it definitely Italy looks like it isn't in the cards for this year, but who knows, lots of football left. Not expecting us to win like I'm the previous 4 years, we ll see where this ride takes us
Quote from: Bomber Diehard on June 30, 2024, 12:58:48 PMSeveral areas of the bombers are not good.
The OL Does not give the quarterback enough time and he will also be injured.
With our star receivers injured it's very unfortunate.
I do not know why we have to give up two singles, I could possibly see one but not two?
Their punter kept booting it too deep. I think they were trying to pin us, but the appropriate thing there was to give up the point and take the field position.
NO PANIC on my end. Next season is more important with the Home GC. Don't lose sight of that and do not make stupid moves that mess you up next season vis-a-vis SMS. Not giving up on this season, but next year is the magnum opus season. Bombers have never won the cup at home nor ever even appeared in it at home. Need to break that "curse" next season.
Have followed the Bombers since 1976 and more intensely since 1980. So been through all the "wars" and ending of two long GC droughts! :) 1984 will always be the most magical season to me. 2019 not even close. The hunger in Winnipeg in 1984 blows the doors off 2019. Old Winnipeg arena packed to the roof shaking when they came back with the Cup that year. Winnipeg Airport PACKED to the brim upon them coming back from Vancouver winning the western final (I was there...intense!). Paul Robson coming down the escalator at the airport shaking his fist....WINNERPEG!! :) Even Cal Murphy commented later he had never seen such a powerful fan reaction even after him winning many cups in Edmonton as an assistant there. Tommy Clements era, James Murphy, Jeff Boyd, Joe Pop still in his prime, Rick House, Willard Reaves. Chris Walby, John Bonk, John Hufnagel, Tony Norman (hero of 1988 GC win!). Shawba David Shaw a major character! All Bomber if not CFL legends.
Quote from: Bomber Diehard on June 30, 2024, 12:58:48 PMThe OL Does not give the quarterback enough time and he will also be injured.
Yes, our OL regressed for the CGY game. They weren't great to begin with. Ko-man and Lofton are still having issues, and we don't seem to be finding solutions. It could be Lofton is just too slow to stop the long-way-around attack... surprising given that he's actually pretty lean for a hoggie.
At least half of Zach's woes are that he has no time compared to 2023 (which had less time than in 2022...). And he's getting creamed way too often. And the OL doesn't even give him an escape route during all of this. Zach took way too many bad hits vs CGY.
While we work on the WR-replacement issue we also need to be objective and ruthless regarding OL moves! If Lofton gets beat outside every time, he needs to go.
Quote from: dd on June 30, 2024, 07:38:44 PMI see us choosing from within our talent pool as a vote of confidence on our scouting staff. They found the first dalton schoen they ll find his replacement.
MOS keeps repeating the "R scouting class in TC was the strongest I've ever seen". Ya, I'm not sure anyone else sees it that way. He might just be blowing smoke to placate the seething mob.
I have confidence in our process when it functions
in the normal way: newest guys get PRd or dress as backup, dev a year, then slowly get more dresses/reps. That's what we do (instant superstars like Schoen & Alford aside). But what we're trying to do --
starting guys who were here for the first time in TC (some cut!) -- is
not normal procedure, and should not be relied upon to give must-win-now results.
Quote from: J5V on June 30, 2024, 09:07:54 PMIf we end the season out of the playoffs it'll be disappointing but after four grey cup appearances in a row I can live with that if I know we are trending in the right direction. This group brought us to the top before, they can do it again.
Ya, but how often do 4-year GC teams drop out of the playoff hunt one year and then get back to the GC next year? Ya, never.
If we are so bad we miss the playoffs this season, then it'll be a slow climb back to GC-contender status. I'm not saying a blowup or rebuild, but a moderate-paced climb back up.
Keep in mind that if we suck this year you start to lose top guys who bail to be with the up & comer winners. And players stop taking discounts, too. Ya, so it's pretty imperative by the end of the season we are competitive again. A "lost year" would have drastic consequences.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 01, 2024, 02:11:43 AMYa, but how often do 4-year GC teams drop out of the playoff hunt one year and then get back to the GC next year? Ya, never.
If we are so bad we miss the playoffs this season, then it'll be a slow climb back to GC-contender status. I'm not saying a blowup or rebuild, but a moderate-paced climb back up.
Keep in mind that if we suck this year you start to lose top guys who bail to be with the up & comer winners. And players stop taking discounts, too. Ya, so it's pretty imperative by the end of the season we are competitive again. A "lost year" would have drastic consequences.
I believe that the reason we compiled the talent we did to be so successful the last four (five) years was because of the culture that has been built here. As long as that culture remains we'll be fine. Players want to be here not because they are paid the most but because they get a chance to play with a group of people that are special. There's a reason Lucky wants to come to the Peg and it's not money.
Quote from: J5V on July 01, 2024, 02:29:16 AMI believe that the reason we compiled the talent we did to be so successful the last four (five) years was because of the culture that has been built here. As long as that culture remains we'll be fine. Players want to be here not because they are paid the most but because they get a chance to play with a group of people that are special. There's a reason Lucky wants to come to the Peg and it's not money.
But don't kid yourself: culture plus a rising star is the draw. Not everyone will sign on culture alone. If that was the case we'd have better star retention, which has been a real problem lately.
Players seem to sniff out the shifting winds, and listen to the pundits, and are eager to sign with the next hot team. BC and SSK didn't have much trouble getting talent this FA, as they are perceived to be the next GC contenders. Same with TOR & MTL. They can pick whoever they want, probably at a discount.
CGY, HAM, OTT, EDM have trouble luring anyone to their clubs, because there is no "rising" going on there. We're probably going to be in that mix next FA.
CGY is a very interesting example because they were us 5-6 years ago. Everyone wanted to play there. Ya, after 2019 that basically disappeared overnight and they now struggle to get decent talent as much as the basement dwellers.
Did CGY's culture change? Nah, they just stopped rising. Worse, they started dropping. No one wants to be on a sinking ship. Therefore we must stop the sinking and maintain the aura of legit contender, or it'll steamroll.
Well, whatever was rising in Saskatchewan (they were rising??) just sank with harris's Injury.
It is amazing how a premier QB makes a different in "culture" and "rising star".
Zach has been that guy for 4 seasons. He is not that guy today. He's the highest paid player currently playing.
Not crapping on Zach, Buck, Osh and Walters all gave him the vote of confidence trading Dru away. Watching tonight's game, it is looking more and more that we made the wrong decision... but I really hope Zach figures out what he needs to get back to leading this team to the W column.
No word on Zach's status? Do we give FIne a call?
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 01, 2024, 02:35:34 AMBut don't kid yourself: culture plus a rising star is the draw. Not everyone will sign on culture alone. If that was the case we'd have better star retention, which has been a real problem lately.
Players seem to sniff out the shifting winds, and listen to the pundits, and are eager to sign with the next hot team. BC and SSK didn't have much trouble getting talent this FA, as they are perceived to be the next GC contenders. Same with TOR & MTL. They can pick whoever they want, probably at a discount.
CGY, HAM, OTT, EDM have trouble luring anyone to their clubs, because there is no "rising" going on there. We're probably going to be in that mix next FA.
CGY is a very interesting example because they were us 5-6 years ago. Everyone wanted to play there. Ya, after 2019 that basically disappeared overnight and they now struggle to get decent talent as much as the basement dwellers.
Did CGY's culture change? Nah, they just stopped rising. Worse, they started dropping. No one wants to be on a sinking ship. Therefore we must stop the sinking and maintain the aura of legit contender, or it'll steamroll.
Of course that's true. I believe we look for the type of player that is willing to buy into the culture first and consider talent second. Talent without the right mindset does not equal the sum being greater than the parts. Obviously you want a talented team but the focus here has been on team. I've heard it from too many players: Zach, Willy, Woli, and of course from O'Shea. They share a common culture and always speak to it. Osh is always saying that a particular player "gets it". "It" being the culture -- having each other's back.
I think the culture is highly over rated. Every team tries to create a family of brothers who you'd go to war with.
IMO the reason players have been signing for less in Wpg is because they know they're going to get playoff money and a realistic shot at a Grey Cup. Take those away and we're going to find it hard to attract the best players without paying the most money.
Quote from: TBURGESS on July 01, 2024, 03:45:23 PMI think the culture is highly over rated. Every team tries to create a family of brothers who you'd go to war with.
IMO the reason players have been signing for less in Wpg is because they know they're going to get playoff money and a realistic shot at a Grey Cup. Take those away and we're going to find it hard to attract the best players without paying the most money.
yes and no. Culture counts for sure. Depends on many factors for a play to sign where, but to say it is just about playoff money is a narrow minded opinion.
Quote from: GOLDMEMBER on July 01, 2024, 03:57:31 PMyes and no. Culture counts for sure. Depends on many factors for a play to sign where, but to say it is just about playoff money is narrow minded opinion.
We've been paying players the most at their position this entire time. The culture thing is something every team talks about. It's a cliche like "best shape of my life", "this is a family", and "we're just taking this one week at a time".
I think a good culture is less important than a bad culture. A toxic workplace can bring things down, but otherwise I think people just do their jobs (including repeating the same platitudes they've been repeating since high school).
Players play for 2 things- money and to win a championship.
Players sign for big dough on weak teams, thinking they'll be the missing piece to turn the franchise around and they'll start their winning ways--hello Bighill and Bryant.
Others will take less to stay at a winning place as playoff money is there and there's a legit chance at winning the Cup.
We're starting the cycle over again, and those high priced players not earning their keep will be shown the door as in the SMS you have to produce if you're getting paid the big $$$, you have to produce or they'll get someone who will.
Culture does count, but it's not everything.
But I do believe certain teams do have that magic culture simply because of the way players talk about certain teams. When every single player interviewed talks about a culture being the best they've ever been involved with, I take notice. Even vets who have cycled through many teams, who never talk like that, start talking about it... I take notice.
Right now there are 2 teams with the magic culture: WPG and TOR. I'm not sure how Dinwiddie pulled that off over there, but using the same metric I used for WPG, TOR qualifies. What I find astounding is places like BC, SSK, MTL, even while winning, don't have it. (Maybe Mace can bring it to SSK, we shall see.)
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 01, 2024, 09:57:50 PMCulture does count, but it's not everything.
But I do believe certain teams do have that magic culture simply because of the way players talk about certain teams. When every single player interviewed talks about a culture being the best they've ever been involved with, I take notice. Even vets who have cycled through many teams, who never talk like that, start talking about it... I take notice.
Right now there are 2 teams with the magic culture: WPG and TOR. I'm not sure how Dinwiddie pulled that off over there, but using the same metric I used for WPG, TOR qualifies. What I find astounding is places like BC, SSK, MTL, even while winning, don't have it. (Maybe Mace can bring it to SSK, we shall see.)
Agree wholeheartedly. O'Shea came through the Toronto system so I suspect he brought it with him. O'Shea and Dinwiddie are both player's coaches. I remember seeing a photo of O'Shea loaded down with dufflebags of football gear hauling ***. When players see a coach willing to roll up his sleeves and do the grunt work it makes an impression. Any of us that have played sports know there are certain coaches we would have run through a wall for. O'Shea is one of them.
Culture definitely counts, and I agree - there's been a lot of players talking about culture here.
It isn't everything, of course, but it sure counts.
Hardrick left for SSK - there is no way he left for culture there, nor did he leave assuming he would have a better chance of winning a cup with them. That was for money - and I fully respect his choice, being close to the end of his career and getting a huge paycheck for the family.
Sometimes situations will dictate compromising one incentive for another. Culture, money and chance to win all compete in a player's mind with decisions.
It's really just a matter of what counts more, at that specific time, for that individual.
The team culture MOS built was one of our pillars of success over the last 4 year imo
Quote from: TBURGESS on July 01, 2024, 03:45:23 PMI think the culture is highly over rated. Every team tries to create a family of brothers who you'd go to war with.
IMO the reason players have been signing for less in Wpg is because they know they're going to get playoff money and a realistic shot at a Grey Cup. Take those away and we're going to find it hard to attract the best players without paying the most money.
Is that true in a salary cap era? All things being equal regarding money means other considerations come into play in a big way. I sincerely believe this club does everything it can to keep everyone happy provided they buy into the culture. Whenever I see a player leave over money, I really have to look at the situation carefully before deciding how bought-in they were. In Yoshi's case, I get it, and I wish him well in Sask. With Bailey and Grant, I'm not so sure.
I think bailey and grant wanted more money and a bigger role than they were playing with the bombers.
Quote from: dd on July 02, 2024, 02:04:31 AMI think bailey and grant wanted more money and a bigger role than they were playing with the bombers.
I thought both were getting worked into the offense more. Didn't Grant get injured when we tried working him into a non-returner role? Bailey seemed to be getting his share of touches. I dunno, hard to please everyone -- there's just one football. Bailey does seem to relish his role with the Argos and is doing well.
Quote from: J5V on July 02, 2024, 01:58:36 AMIs that true in a salary cap era? All things being equal regarding money means other considerations come into play in a big way.
Sure it's still true, even with a cap. Because different teams will allocate their SMS differently. SSK wanted to blow the wad on OL, so they could afford to pay Yoshi $100k more than we could. We decided to spend our wad on Rs/RB, so no one could outbid us for Kenny/Schoen. (Not enough to impact the decision and overcome the "culture bonus", anyway.)
Heck, teams will allocate their SMS differently even among the same team across different years! Look at how we went from a very low WR-spend to league-highest WR-spend in a couple of seasons!
SSK blowing the budget on OLine to protect Harris and get a ground game (signing Ouilette) really seems like it missed the mark.
Quote from: J5V on July 02, 2024, 03:14:54 AMI thought both were getting worked into the offense more. Didn't Grant get injured when we tried working him into a non-returner role? Bailey seemed to be getting his share of touches. I dunno, hard to please everyone -- there's just one football. Bailey does seem to relish his role with the Argos and is doing well.
Ya, Bailey is doing well, and good on him.
I never understood why we didn't get him the ball more often. Ya there's only 1 ball but he seemed to only get a handful of passes every game, yet he always made these heroic efforts that pumped everyone up, I thought give it to him more!!
Man do we miss him this Year!!
Quote from: theaardvark on July 02, 2024, 04:38:39 AMSSK blowing the budget on OLine to protect Harris and get a ground game (signing Ouilette) really seems like it missed the mark.
Uh, have you seen the standings?? SSK is 3-0 and top of the league. Their line-focus was paying off bigtime... until they just got unlucky with Trevor's injury. Who knows, maybe they can field a decent replacement QB this time around and keep the wins coming. Maybe trade for Masoli when he's due back?
Ya, Oullette's ground game hasn't been great, yet. But I was never very impressed with muscle guy anyhow. Being a RB is a lot more than just having muscle like Hecht. Look at Cornish: one of the weaker/smaller RBs I can remember, and he may have been the best of the last decade (yes, even better than AH).
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 02, 2024, 04:48:28 AMUh, have you seen the standings?? SSK is 3-0 and top of the league. Their line-focus was paying off bigtime... until they just got unlucky with Trevor's injury. Who knows, maybe they can field a decent replacement QB this time around and keep the wins coming. Maybe trade for Masoli when he's due back?
Ya, Oullette's ground game hasn't been great, yet. But I was never very impressed with muscle guy anyhow. Being a RB is a lot more than just having muscle like Hecht. Look at Cornish: one of the weaker/smaller RBs I can remember, and he may have been the best of the last decade (yes, even better than AH).
Cornish was 6'0" 220, that's not small.
Let's see what happens when the Riders play, Toronto, Montreal, and BC, before we get to excited.
2nd watch, with a focus on OL:
Lofton & Ko-man sometimes get pushed around by DTs, like they are low on weight or something. Not a good look.
Tons of jumbo packages, for both run and RPO. Mostly when Zach was in: changed when it was Strevie. Lots of 6 and 6+FB sets. Lots of work for the new FB guy.
Stunts still working on us. Simple stuff like DL switching up on C and LG (left A gap), which should be a simple handoff between Ko-man/Dobson, is botched and D guy slips through the A gap (see 4Q0:43).
QBs need to take a couple more steps back on passing downs like Cody/BLM often do. Just sitting there or dropping back 1-2 leaves less of a buffer when the hoggies are getting pushed back.
Dobson seems to do a lot of jamming when he needs to be engaging. The stunts often roll in front of him. If he engages and grabs on his guy a lot more plays will work out.
When we had only 5 OL (and no TE/FB) CGY sent 6 most of the first 3 quarters. Caused harassment pressure most times.
1Q7:49 The offside-on-OL guy I mentioned earlier was Lofton. Here it comes... U.N.A.C.C.E.P.T.A.B.L.E. Never seen a RT line up offside pre-snap. I don't even think it's humanly possible. You naturally make a wedge/wing! You don't stick out the OT!
2Q3:58 The Zach-pancake that knocked him out of the game: Dobson + Brady's fault. Dobson does this one-off jam on his DT then goes to help Stan, who needs no help with his guy. The DT runs straight through the vacated Dobson gap and steamrolls Zach. Either Dobson went temporarily insane, or he thought Brady was going to take up the block. Brady instead took a guy on the right, who also would have hosed Zach. So tough to say who blew it, or if it's miscommunication and both are to blame. But in the end, Dobson can't let his QB get creamed like that. Someone asked earlier in the thread if this was a spear on Zach: on rewatch you could have a case for that. Leading with a helmet-to-chest hit with no attempt to use arms or shoulder. The league might put a fine on that play. Then again, command/EITS had buckets of time to call it on-field, and they didn't. And the injury to Zach might be worse than we are hoping: he didn't spear dead center, he was on the edge of the pads closer to the underarm, and that may be less- or un-protected.
3Q5:46 IP No-End was on Wallace in as the 6th off the right end. He was aligned perfectly fine, but I guess didn't "check in". The camera wasn't on him soon enough to see if he did or not. Then again... who remembers the infamous "check in" screwup by the biased CGY ref about 5 years ago? Cost us the game then. MOS needs to check the all-24 on this play to see if we got ripped off again. It was the difference between a 1st down and punt.
Here's my grading of the OL through the whole game:
Botches on pass-pro:
Ko-man 4
Lofton 4
Dobson 3
Neufeld 1
Stan 0
Clear botches on runs:
Lofton 1
So it looks like my hunches were right and the worst are Lofton, and surprising to some, Ko-man. Dobson is close behind, but he looked better in earlier games. Since some of the Dobson issues are the shared A-gap, and Gray also had A-gap trouble, the problem might really be Ko-man.
I would start looking at getting a top of the line C (maybe IMP) and RT. LG needs to be monitored. Stan/Neuf looking 100% as good as ever.
And I don't think Eli is the C solution at the moment, as he always seems undersized out there and sometimes gets pushed around on jumbo.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 02, 2024, 06:07:05 AM2nd watch, with a focus on OL:
... and the injury to Zach might be worse than we are hoping: he didn't spear dead center, he was on the edge of the pads closer to the underarm, and that may be less- or un-protected.
Thanks for sharing your analysis. This is an even greater concern than the receiver issue and I don't know which one is going to be harder/easier to fix.
Quote from: Pigskin on July 02, 2024, 05:03:07 AMLet's see what happens when the Riders play, Toronto, Montreal, and BC, before we get to excited.
Don't sell the RR defence or ST short. They are very good... but they will miss Harris.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on July 02, 2024, 04:48:28 AMUh, have you seen the standings?? SSK is 3-0 and top of the league. Their line-focus was paying off bigtime... until they just got unlucky with Trevor's injury. Who knows, maybe they can field a decent replacement QB this time around and keep the wins coming. Maybe trade for Masoli when he's due back?
Ya, Oullette's ground game hasn't been great, yet. But I was never very impressed with muscle guy anyhow. Being a RB is a lot more than just having muscle like Hecht. Look at Cornish: one of the weaker/smaller RBs I can remember, and he may have been the best of the last decade (yes, even better than AH).
the riders have played Ottawa and Hamiltonx2, the bottom dwellers of the league (along with us).
They are hardly a powerhouse and now that Harris is hurt, will struggle to be competitive until he returns
Quote from: theaardvark on July 02, 2024, 04:38:39 AMSSK blowing the budget on OLine to protect Harris and get a ground game (signing Ouilette) really seems like it missed the mark.
Harris bends down to tie his shoelaces lately he is probably out for 6 games!! ;) Not a good track record for YEARS ALREADY! Sask going to tank I think as who do they have to replace Harris? A bunch of nobodies. Maybe have potential, but that is usually for a rebuilding team. They are TRULY kicking themselves now letting go of Fajardo. He took them to TWO western finals and both were VERY tight games. Had a bad year (more the goofball coach and GM) and toss him out. Or he just wanted out of the nuthouse of Regina.
That GM in Sask should have been canned long ago! How is he holding on? Reminds of some useless managers of the past and almost everyone wondering how they were able to grift on always! :D
Could truly be CRYDERS in Mudville and the Bombers have them coming up soon! :)
Quote from: dd on July 02, 2024, 10:44:47 PMthe riders have played Ottawa and Hamiltonx2, the bottom dwellers of the league (along with us).
They are hardly a powerhouse and now that Harris is hurt, will struggle to be competitive until he returns
Let's try Edmonton, and Hamiltonx2.
Quote from: bluebeard on July 02, 2024, 10:42:11 PMDon't sell the RR defence or ST short. They are very good... but they will miss Harris.
Ehhh... That's a bit premature.
Just watched the Calgary game, the number of very basic penalties that showed no focus—-procedure calls on our O line, no end/not reporting our tight end on our jumbo package, receivers lining up onside—-this is inexcusable, this isnt JV football, these were drive killers. Cmon we gotta be sharper than that.
And if Collaros is out, streveller ain't going to get it done. His passing hasn't improved at all, one hoppers, behind receivers and the pick in overtime. Auuugh.
Quote from: dd on July 03, 2024, 03:57:25 AMJust watched the Calgary game, the number of very basic penalties that showed no focus—-procedure calls on our O line, no end/not reporting our tight end on our jumbo package, receivers lining up onside—-this is inexcusable, this isnt JV football, these were drive killers. Cmon we gotta be sharper than that.
Pretty sure the CGY game was our worst game for IP/OS since the very dark days circa 2014.
Ya, that nonsense is U.N.A.C.C.E.P.T.A.B.L.E! And I bet MOS let that be known on day 1 this week...
Quote from: dd on July 03, 2024, 03:57:25 AMAnd if Collaros is out, streveller ain't going to get it done. His passing hasn't improved at all, one hoppers, behind receivers and the pick in overtime. Auuugh.
I hope that if Zach is out they determine that very, very quickly, like before day 1, and give Strev all the #1 unit practice. Strevie, and the IP/OS problems, will all get better if he's made "the guy" all week.
I will mention that on that last Strevie drive where we tied it CGY was going really easy on us with a soft zone thinking that Strev would keep Brohm-chucking and/or getting pressured and throw picks. They bet heavily that Strevie was no good (except running) and lost the bet. Most of us would say it was a smart bet... just didn't work out. Maybe Strevie is better?
My point is, Strevie looking world-beating on the TD drive may not be indicative of how good he'll do when a D throws "real" schemes at him and mixes things up and tries to fool him.