Two very important games coming up over the next two weeks. With or without Chad Kelly it will be important for the Bombers to establish and execute all three phases of the game before heading to BC where the Lions will be ready and motivated to assume first place in the west.
Several starters will return to action for the Bombers, including...
In: #3 Hansen, #16 Kelly, #94 Jeffcoat
Out: #00 Maruo, #45 Haba, #96 Schmekel
With only 4 games remaining in the regular schedule there is some urgency to win both the Toronto and BC games and set the tone for the playoffs.
Ed Tait's 48-Primer for the game is here - https://www.bluebombers.com/2023/09/27/48-hour-primer-tor-vs-wpg-4/
A big (sold out) crowd is again expected at the Toronto game so bring on the noise! Check out and visit Blue Bomber Alumni prior to the game...
Blue Bomber Alumni
@BomberAlumni
Alumni Alley is back and we've got one heckuva line up..
Join @Wpg_BlueBombers Alumni:
Leo Ezerins, Chris Walby, Stan Mikawos, Lamar McGriggs, Boyd Barrett, Willard Reaves, Jon Oosterhuis & Rick House an prior to kick off (section 117) this Friday! @CFL_Alumni #ForTheW
Blue Bomber Depth Chart
https://twitter.com/Wpg_BlueBombers/status/1707394868065001615/photo/1
Kelly getting back into the lineup for team is good. The kids has some excellent speed.
I had little faith they would keep Haba in the lineup, but with Hansen back at least they have 7 D-lineman dressed. I don't know if they will ever be able to play 8 again as long as they continue to dress Jackson.
I'm going to sound like a broken record at this point, but if I could change this gameday roster, I'd do this:
OUT
Bennett
Jackson
IN
Burtenshaw
Haba
Nice problem to have either way!
Impressive group
No sign of Blackmon yet, I guess he might be a next year project.
Basically the Argos just wanna play to not get injured. They got the Grey Cup locked up imho if they can stay healthy.
Quote from: ModAdmin on September 27, 2023, 06:20:44 PM
Two very important games coming up over the next two weeks. With or without Chad Kelly it will be important for the Bombers to establish and execute all three phases of the game before heading to BC where the Lions will be ready and motivated to assume first place in the west.
Several starters will return to action for the Bombers, including...
In: #3 Hansen, #16 Kelly, #94 Jeffcoat
Out: #00 Maruo, #45 Haba, #96 Schmekel
With only 4 games remaining in the regular schedule there is some urgency to win both the Toronto and BC games and set the tone for the playoffs.
Ed Tait's 48-Primer for the game is here - https://www.bluebombers.com/2023/09/27/48-hour-primer-tor-vs-wpg-4/
A big (sold out) crowd is again expected at the Toronto game so bring on the noise! Check out and visit Blue Bomber Alumni prior to the game...
Blue Bomber Alumni
@BomberAlumni
Alumni Alley is back and we've got one heckuva line up..
Join @Wpg_BlueBombers Alumni:
Leo Ezerins, Chris Walby, Stan Mikawos, Lamar McGriggs, Boyd Barrett, Willard Reaves, Jon Oosterhuis & Rick House an prior to kick off (section 117) this Friday! @CFL_Alumni #ForTheW
Can someone bring me up to speed on who Boyd Barrett is? What years did he pay for the Big Blue? Just can not remember the name. The rest of the Alumni names are very familar.
Here's some info on Boyd Barrett..
https://www.profootballarchives.com/playerb/barr01030.html
re roster management; we use 9 linebackers including sam, yet have one of the worst special team return coverage, how does that make sense? (argos have 6)
Quote from: Pete on September 28, 2023, 11:47:29 PM
re roster management; we use 9 linebackers including sam, yet have one of the worst special team return coverage, how does that make sense? (argos have 6)
Hansen is a special teams demon
Quote from: ModAdmin on September 28, 2023, 09:48:12 PM
Here's some info on Boyd Barrett..
https://www.profootballarchives.com/playerb/barr01030.html
Thanks I do not remember him.
I expect the DL to present all kinds of issues in both run and pass defense.
Quote from: Pete on September 28, 2023, 11:47:29 PM
re roster management; we use 9 linebackers including sam, yet have one of the worst special team return coverage, how does that make sense? (argos have 6)
It doesn?t make sense, lol.
I?d be removing three of those LBs in favour of other positions, personally.
Quote from: GOLDMEMBER on September 29, 2023, 12:55:04 AM
I expect the DL to present all kinds of issues in both run and pass defense.
I think we'll stop Oullette early/mid drive. I just pray we limit him to 0 TDs in the redzone. That's their go-to thing, and doubly so with Kelly benched and who-knows-if-he-can-throw at QB.
I think we'll have trouble on pass-D because of TOR's impenetrable OL. We may have to get more creative with drop-backs and blitzes. Maybe if we can get some middle push we might get somewhere, but our DTs will have to have an all-star level game. We could try a cheetah once in a while, too, just to mix things up.
So that only leaves the QB runs to deal with. That's the big question mark. But Wilson playing should make a huge difference. We'll know pretty early if this new QB is a run threat.
So Kelly is dressing, though listed as QB3. What are the odds they have him start the 1st Q and play 1/2 to a full Q? What are the odds they put him in if Dukes is sucking badly?
Ted Wyman
@Ted_Wyman
5h
I asked #Argos coach Ryan Dinwiddie why he chose this game against #Bombers, specifically, to sit out QB Chad Kelly.
"The crowd noise and (Winnipeg's) defensive line."
For us to win the western conference we pretty much have to win out. While we play Toronto, BC who is tied with us, is playing the hapless Riders at home. Doubt if they lose that one. Then they play us, the Stamps and Hamilton. After we play BC we play the Stamps on the road and the Elks at home. If we lose against Toronto and beat BC....we could very well end up tied for first but we'd have the series so first would be ours.
So yeah....just win out.
The Playbook - Toronto vs Winnipeg. Another great primer for the big game.
https://www.bluebombers.com/2023/09/28/the-playbook-tor-vs-wpg/
On O I think we can get Brady going, and we may have to. They are sitting McManis and Oakman, so that should help considerably. Hoggies gotta do to TOR front 7 what they did to BC in 2nd game and SSK in BB.
On the passing front, they are sitting Peters. I would attack his strong-side corner, and also the weaker weak-side halfback. Buck is going to have to be smarter about attacking the weak points instead of just "business as usual". I want to see a lot more of the book at this game. Open that sucker up.
I'm disappointed we didn't find a way to get McCrae back on the roster as he seems to add a dynamic in the run game (and pass too) that teams don't anticipate. I know, I wanted him off, but since we've benched him our O has struggled more, especially when Brady is stifled. Do we really need Kelly??
I would have put McCrae in, at least until Grant comes back as the extra speed guy on O. If you look at TOR's roster, their D scares me more than their O, therefore the "extra DI guy" might have been better spent on our O. Heck, we could have also put in McCrae and pulled Jackson, and used Eli/Dobson for TE.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 29, 2023, 02:54:40 AM
So Kelly is dressing, though listed as QB3. What are the odds they have him start the 1st Q and play 1/2 to a full Q? What are the odds they put him in if Dukes is sucking badly?
I'm not even sure a # 3 QB can start the game based on that placement on the depth chart. It's an odd rule but I think it is a rule. The fact they didn't even list him as the # 2 QB suggests he won't play much if at all. Why would they play him with 1st place locked up?
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 29, 2023, 05:17:04 AM
Buck is going to have to be smarter about attacking the weak points instead of just "business as usual". I want to see a lot more of the book at this game. Open that suckered up
I'm also hoping the brain trust has the long game in mind. If we're anticipating an Argos/Bombers GC, it'd be nice to see them throw some wrinkles in this game - trick plays; unique alignments (Willie at receiver again please?!).
It feels like we haven't played in a month!
About 17 for kickoff with no wind. Great fall night for football.
I watched the press interview with O'Shea yesterday. He always has this look of distain on his face or, generally, through his body language and answers. I get that the questions are sometimes repetitive or even obvious or unnecessay but it just doesn't display an image of respect.
It probably gets exhausting trying to find different ways to answer the same annoying, vapid questions from the media on such a regular basis.
Can't say I blame him for his perceived lack of enthusiasm.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 29, 2023, 03:49:15 PM
I'm not even sure a # 3 QB can start the game based on that placement on the depth chart. It's an odd rule but I think it is a rule. The fact they didn't even list him as the # 2 QB suggests he won't play much if at all. Why would they play him with 1st place locked up?
The only restriction placed upon the #3 QB is that he cannot be a kicker.
In the mid-1990s, a few teams designated their punter as the #3 QB to gain an extra roster spot. 1996-197, the CFL returned to 2 designated QBs. It was in 1998 that the CFL put the restriction on the #3 QB to prevent teams from abusing the QB rules.
For 1 game in 2007 (and possibly 1 in 2006), the Argos designated Noel Prefontaine as a QB because they only had 2 QBs on the active roster. In the 2007 game, Prefontaine was listed as the #2 QB so that he could kick.
In 2009, the BC Lions lost Paul McCallum to injury early in a game. Travis Lulay was the backup kicker and he performed the first punt after the injury. Problem was, Lulay was the #3 QB on the roster and should have been penalized 25 yards for
illegal deployment of a designated QB. The issue was discovered before the next kicking situation and Paris Jackson & Tad Crawford did the kicking for the remainder of the game.
2018 - #3 QB David Watford was the drive QB for the Roughriders first drive of a game - drive started at the 1 yard line. Zach Collaros was still considered the starting QB for the Riders that game.
Quote from: blue_gold_84 on September 29, 2023, 07:52:52 PM
It probably gets exhausting trying to find different ways to answer the same annoying, vapid questions from the media on such a regular basis.
Can't say I blame him for his perceived lack of enthusiasm.
If you think MOS is not all that receiptive during these gigs, he is a love child compared to Kindly Coach Cal! ;D
Predictions for tonight's game?
Well I see our reputation of making backup QB's look like all stars is still intact...
In all honesty though if we get this little pressure all game it's gonna be a long night
we cant tackle and we cant rush the qb Again our layback defense gives the new qb confidence
Boys forgot how to tackle on the bye week.
Willie - invisible
Jeffcoat - made to look a fool on that TD by a basckup
Leake - so fast
They only rushed 3 on the last play and rushed the play.....then we punt and Leake gives them instant field position. STs man!! Toronto is making this look easy.....right now they don't need Kelly as Duke looks like an all star already.
Crowd sounds suddenly quiet.....Dukes is 4 for 4 for 93 yards. He's also mobile which is always a problem for our D. We start on the 27 as Bede pounds the ball deep on every KO.
Gutsy call on 2nd and short.....need to get the crowd back into.
At this rate they Argos are going to hang 60 on Richie Halls D.
FGs aren't going to cut it today unless our D suddenly makes a stop....which they haven't done yet
Bombers should watch how TO tackles and especially how the ST works, nothing has changed on our ST after the break
good.....we needed that stop. Our STs still aren't going to scare anyone even with trick plays. Starting from the 30.....we need a score now to even things up or pull ahead....
We need to keep moving the pocket, TO looks confused when we do that.
RUN THE BALL
MOVE THE POCKET!
Another pick in the end zone wiped out by a penalty....dodged one there. Why aren't we running the ball as Brady is running possessed?
Quote from: Lincoln Locomotive on September 30, 2023, 12:58:51 AM
Another pick in the end zone wiped out by a penalty....dodged one there. Why aren't we running the ball as Brady is running possessed?
Agreed. Run the ball until you force them to stop it.
Bede just pounds that ball and his hang times allows his cover team to smother most run backs. We're always starting around the 30 or less.
Brady still making something out of nothing.....Dakota just made that short and very short
Keep Brady pounding the ball and wearing them down....he has 70+ yards already.....and that's against a very stout D
Run, run, run the ball.
That's a fumble, dammit!
we fell for the sucker play
Kyrie- terrible penalty to take
Unbelievable.
Defence needs to wake up in the 2nd half. Can't they learn to deal with a QB that can run?
O'Shea's new return game schemes in game 15 still stink. Both in returns and coverage.
I don't think I've seen Hansen on the field yet? What the heck?
Oliveria's fumble could be the difference in losing instead of winning if the game continues back and forth.
Knee looks bad for Houston
100% we deserve to take the L tonight. Far too many mental errors. This team will be lucky to make it past the WF.
Not a great half for the defence. Fumble by BO was bad on O
Defence has to be better
Turnovers have hurt us so much this year. Instead of being up 6 we are now down 4....10 point swing.
This season we've had 6 pick sixes and 2 fumbles run back for 6. In close games that's huge!
Oliveira was down. You could see he was tackled hit the ground ball popped out same rind he hit the ground
Where are Lawler and Grant?
Zach dropping straight back while the Argos pin their ears back. C'mon Buck.
Brady, can't cough up the ball, buddy.
Flush this first half and come out and play championship football. Let's go!
Our dline needs to be better especially the interior
Bit of dirt on this Toronto team.
TO's secondary doesn't give any cushions.....we need to answer back. No FGs....we need to capital in the red zone against this very good TO second string team. Why are we not running though on first down....it's as if Zach always wants to force it long. Another FG attempt.
Talk about leaving points on the field? Geez us!
Don't love the long FG attempt.
Don't love Zach running
I can't understand Buck not moving Zach around back there. He's gonna get creamed.
Quote from: The Zipp on September 30, 2023, 01:44:29 AM
Don't love the long FG attempt.
Don't love Zach running
yeah if Leake gets a missed FG he's going to hurt you.....would have been nice to at the very least come away with some points on that drive. Team isn't very sharp after this bye
D needs to step up now
Teams play us they just don't seem to make mistakes. All thrown balls get caught, no one ever fumbles, no INTs, ***!
was there a flag on Parker's best punt return? Commercial break right after the play.....of course.....mistakes mistakes mistakes. You'd think this was a rookie team
Lawler destroys two Argos on the hit. Luv it!
3rd and 4 - run BO. he will get you 3 almost guaranteed...then prukop the other yard
Disappointed with Buck's game planning. Not seeing any creativity on O. Zach pressured every down, refuses to move him around. I just don't get it. This O is capable of so much more, so many great weapons. SMH
picking on parker now, especially with the cushion he is giving Once again we are making a backup star of the week
We need to play tighter, Dukes isnt going to pick you apart with precision
Ooof
Bad pick by Zach...he is getting a reputation for those
Quote from: The Zipp on September 30, 2023, 02:08:37 AM
Ooof
Bad pick by Zach...he is getting a reputation for those
Finally a mistake!
Quote from: The Zipp on September 30, 2023, 02:08:37 AM
Ooof
Bad pick by Zach...he is getting a reputation for those
Absolutely no creativity on offense. Eventually the D knows what's coming. C'mon Buck.
Finally a takeaway! Couldn't have come at a better time as TO was looking to increase their lead. Our D has been doing much better in the 2nd half. Mind you Ouelette hasn't been playing either.....he's a train
If we don't do something different with Zach he's gonna get killed.
Third stringer in for the Argos at qb
Running BO in the red zone = TD
2 point convert ..why not give it to bo?
Gotta watch Leake on this return
Ah yes ... the lack of character showing itself on the Argos. :-)
argos pretty much gave us this game when they put in the third string qb. I think they will be pretty confident to get to Collaros should we meet again.
28-11 in first downs for Winnipeg. Regardless who they put out its Argos decision but they had nothing deep on the bombers only broken plays to oulette
An ugly win but it still counts. We'll still need to beat the Lions regardless of whether they also win tonight.
Oliveria fumble was probably a 10 point swing that gave the Argos momentum. It happens but we shoot ourselves in the foot at the worst times.
We punted only once for 47 yards. Leake returns it 48 yards. I repeat this was game 15 and the " new coverage scheme " does not work. Someone needs to address this problem and quit the PR rhetoric BS.
Finally saw Hansen on the field a couple of times but to no effect. He may have been in contain mode rather than pressure full mode?
Cole made some good plays tonight.
Sure, we won but that a odd game. It was like both teams were afraid to actually play. At least TO had back-ups in....
At the end of the day we git 2 pts. thanks Dinwiddie...
We still have 2 major problems, our Dline doesn't get enough pressure and let's athletic QB beat it day in and day out........and our special teams although we did get a couple returns today are still really carppy!
A win is a win, but wow. Not sure why we kept going for bombs when the running game was working so well.
JA27, had a very good game on teams.
Quote from: Pete on September 30, 2023, 02:53:45 AM
argos pretty much gave us this game when they put in the third string qb. I think they will be pretty confident to get to Collaros should we meet again.
It's impossible to predict what teams rosters will look like by the play offs and or the Grey Cup. Any team in the hunt could have insurmountable injuries in their next game. IE: It only takes one hit to knock a QB out for the season.
Quote from: Pigskin on September 30, 2023, 03:01:12 AM
A win is a win, but wow. Not sure why we kept going for bombs when the running game was working so well.
We came close to completing a couple of those and it keeps them off the LOS. In that sense it helped the run game. Our OL was blocking as well as they normally do and Collaros was rushing some passes or throwing late due to needing to scramble somewhat.
Overall not entirely impressed with offensive play calling. Oliveria was a force almost on his own more than play calling helping him. He was a man on a mission.
Quote from: J5V on September 30, 2023, 01:25:41 AM
Where are Lawler and Grant?
Zach dropping straight back while the Argos pin their ears back. C'mon Buck.
Brady, can't cough up the ball, buddy.
Flush this first half and come out and play championship football. Let's go!
Grant hasn't played since week 5.
agree with the comment about lawler, he didnt get any separation from the dbs all night. And on defense when are we gonna make opposing rookie qbs earn the 12 yard cushion we are giving them. It makes them look like allstars
Quote from: buckzumhoff on September 30, 2023, 01:25:10 AM
Oliveira was down. You could see he was tackled hit the ground ball popped out same rind he hit the ground
Nope, right call was made fumble recovered by Toronto.
I'm not sure clinching first place that early is a good thing. Toronto has been playing like they're possessed all year. Let's see how they respond in the playoffs when it gets serious again. This will be interesting.
Quote from: Horseman on September 30, 2023, 03:35:07 AM
Nope, right call was made fumble recovered by Toronto.
I agree while I think it was very close there was not enough evidence to rule otherwise.
Toronto DB's are fast - their closing speed is very good and they play aggressive and tight coverage.
Oulette barely played and when he did, he torched our defence. TO is for real and if they don't lose focus and get rusty they will be in the Grey Cup.
He torched our defense? What would you call what Oliveira did to their defense. And we don't hide the fact we are running right at them. What was the yardage. Could have would have . Oulette had one good run outside and a broken play pass where Duke ran for his life to buy time and finally found oulette open in the middle
D was asleep again for the first 20 minutes of the game. Will have to play solid D for 60 minutes again BC.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 30, 2023, 03:06:23 AM
Grant hasn't played since week 5.
I know but I thought he was due back for this game. It was one of the reasons I was looking forward to this game. Is he still not ready? Wow.
Haven't read the thread yet (working on it), so maybe it's been said already... Just wanted to say that I've never actually lost my mind @IGF. Well, I lost my mind when whoever that was on our D went offside on the 3rd & medium @CYL. We were just talking about this the other day here. TOR plays the little 3rd down offside game more than anyone else. I'm screaming don't go offside, don't go offside, it's a bluff. Dude goes offside. I totally lost my bleepity bleep right there in the stands.
Sorry to the fans sitting around me. :-X :o
I didn't catch what player it was, but when I do (on rewatch), that guy's gonna be on my poop list for a long time. Hands down wins the "dumbest play of the year" award.
Well, it was Mr. Wilson.
Toronto sat Ouellette for most of the game and if they didn't take Dukes out in the 4th quarter and put #5 in at QB, we may not have won this game. Our Achilles heel this year continues to be our special teams play. I don't think we win the GC if we make it there because of our special teams.
Oh ya, my other big takeaway from this game... Kenny needs to start showing why he's the highest paid WR. Many games in a row now where he's dropsies and whiffs and almost-INTs. He's paid the big bucks to win the 50/50. So far he's like a 10/90. He'll seriously have to be reconsidered in the off-season if he does nothing through December. We can pay ELC money to a rookie IMP to dropsie and whiff.
Lawler's salary is probably half the reason we don't have the DL talent we need.
Speaking of DL... where were they tonight? Making nobody QB look like an seasoned vet.
We won, but as you can see, I'm not super happy about it.
Very underwhelming win.
1Q11:59 Demski hitch screen, he's getting lots of YAC and YAFC with defenders hanging all over him. He's basically wrapped up and held motionless and TOR #30 Jones(?) comes in and crowns his facemask in a clear spear, he actually jumps off of his two feet. There's actually 4 other TOR D hanging onto Demski when #30 makes the hit.
It's really nasty and obvious and I can't believe a) refs didn't see it, and b) EITS didn't intervene to call it. If you want pics, I can post pics. CFL needs to fine the guy. It was Simoni-level bad. I'm shocked Demski just shook it off; maybe should have attended the Cody School Of Writhing to ensure EITS takes a look. (Sorry if someone posted about this already, it's my 4am rewatch vent time...)
And thanks TSN for making the only replay one that is behind Demski so you can't see the illegal hit.
When we face Oullette in the GC and our DL is trying to bring him down before he rushes by, don't arm tackle him like Willie tried to, grab for the hair. Cracked eggs guy has a mane as long as Grant's. And you can't miss it as it's (dyed?) platinum blond. And it's perfectly legal. Grab that hair and don't let go. Maybe there's some special gloves D's can wear that sticks to hair real well. Just sayin'
2Q0:30 On the unforgivable offside on the fake 3rd&2 attempt by TOR... notice how the TOR C does his pointing thing and then he bobs his head twice in a very strange way and that is what draws Wilson (the guilty party) offside.
Here's the thing: the bobs sure looks to me like it's the TOR C who is calling out the cadence and hut. I'm not sure I've ever seen this before, and I'm not sure this is allowed. It's not so much the shouting that is illegal, it's the fact that when he is shouting it out he is bobbing his head in a manner that is not legal procedure.
And if you watch Dukes carefully it's clear he's not calling out anything as his chest/body/head don't move in the slightest.
I'm pretty sure the C isn't allowed to bark cadence while bobbing his head suddenly like a snap is occurring. And the ball is being moved ever so slightly each time he barks (on the down-the-line angle). I think that should have been IP.
Regardless, Wilson, my Lord, this is TOR's dumb fakery they do every game like they're in the NFL or something. You stand 2 yards back from the line and you laugh at them. You don't fall into the neutral zone.
Quote from: The Zipp on September 30, 2023, 01:16:33 AM
Knee looks bad for Houston
I don't think he blew it out. A bit concerning he didn't return, but it might be precautionary. He walked off ok without help.
I watched the play carefully and his foot was stuck on the turf for a super short time and he got it up and then flipped his whole body around in the direction to relieve the pressure. If anything it was that initial whack that did the most damage. If his cleat had been stuck any longer that's a nasty injury. I think he may get away with minor damage and be back this season.
Houston is probably our best DB this season (though many are still scared to throw on Nichols). It would be bad to lose him. However, Parker is also very good, and in a pinch there's Swarmy. P.S. the injury was friendly fire, by Lawson I believe.
Quote from: The Zipp on September 30, 2023, 01:57:54 AM
3rd and 4 - run BO. he will get you 3 almost guaranteed...then prukop the other yard
So we get 4 downs now ?
Quote from: Sec223 on September 30, 2023, 12:12:09 PM
So we get 4 downs now ?
I would like to see how many points teams could put up using 4 downs...
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 30, 2023, 09:06:44 AM
1Q11:59 Demski hitch screen, he's getting lots of YAC and YAFC with defenders hanging all over him. He's basically wrapped up and held motionless and TOR #30 Jones(?) comes in and crowns his facemask in a clear spear, he actually jumps off of his two feet. There's actually 4 other TOR D hanging onto Demski when #30 makes the hit.
It's really nasty and obvious and I can't believe a) refs didn't see it, and b) EITS didn't intervene to call it. If you want pics, I can post pics. CFL needs to fine the guy. It was Simoni-level bad. I'm shocked Demski just shook it off; maybe should have attended the Cody School Of Writhing to ensure EITS takes a look. (Sorry if someone posted about this already, it's my 4am rewatch vent time...)
And thanks TSN for making the only replay one that is behind Demski so you can't see the illegal hit.
Yup
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 30, 2023, 11:28:22 AM
2Q0:30 On the unforgivable offside on the fake 3rd&2 attempt by TOR... notice how the TOR C does his pointing thing and then he bobs his head twice in a very strange way and that is what draws Wilson (the guilty party) offside.
Here's the thing: the bobs sure looks to me like it's the TOR C who is calling out the cadence and hut. I'm not sure I've ever seen this before, and I'm not sure this is allowed. It's not so much the shouting that is illegal, it's the fact that when he is shouting it out he is bobbing his head in a manner that is not legal procedure.
And if you watch Dukes carefully it's clear he's not calling out anything as his chest/body/head don't move in the slightest.
I'm pretty sure the C isn't allowed to bark cadence while bobbing his head suddenly like a snap is occurring. And the ball is being moved ever so slightly each time he barks (on the down-the-line angle). I think that should have been IP.
Regardless, Wilson, my Lord, this is TOR's dumb fakery they do every game like they're in the NFL or something. You stand 2 yards back from the line and you laugh at them. You don't fall into the neutral zone.
I don?t think he is prohibited from calling it but he cannot be making motions without getting a penalty ?. Oh wait he did!
Lol
That was an embarrassing game.
Did not instill confidence
It was a very good game and a good win. Only allowed Toronto 11 first downs to 28. A big difference. Toronto had good field position didn't have to work the ball downfield as much. The announcer speaker was blasting all game . Couldn't even hear the refs call on plays. Wolitarsky found holes in their defence bug Toronto plays way back in coverage . That's where the shirt passes beat them
Quote from: Tiger on September 30, 2023, 02:16:58 PM
That was an embarrassing game.
Of course it wasn't!
As much as it pains me to say it, the Argos have about as good a defensive secondary as I've ever seen. They were NOT going to be beaten by the big plays the Bombers excel at, so instead, we picked at them until we got the job done. It would have been nice to have more majors and fewer field goals, but it's almost certain that the series when Oliveira fumbled, late in the first half, was going to be a touchdown drive.
As for their offense...it took two series for the Bomber defense to pull their heads out of their butts, but after they did, they shut 'em down the rest of the way.
Take away the Oliveira fumble, and have the defense show up to start the game, and it's a rout. If the Bombers had done those two things, Kelly at QB for the Argos wouldn't have made much difference.
Quote from: Horseman on September 30, 2023, 05:11:10 AM
Toronto sat Ouellette for most of the game and if they didn't take Dukes out in the 4th quarter and put #5 in at QB, we may not have won this game. Our Achilles heel this year continues to be our special teams play. I don't think we win the GC if we make it there because of our special teams.
Ouellette had his legs chopped out from under him on a run up the middle and was hit hard and landed hard. The game feautured a lot of hard hits by both Ds. I don't know if Ouelette was hurt but I think Dinwiddie panicked when he saw that and pulled Ouellette at that point. The Argos are clearly deathly afraid of injuries.
Zach really felt some of those hits. Although TO is a very hard hitting team, I think the toll of the season is catching up to him. I worry Buck coaches like he plays, take the hits to make plays. Lapo was more get the ball out and don't get hit at all.
There were some very good hits to oulette and another receiver near the sidelines. Some one dragged him down I think it was Cole on their wide receiver or Leake. But he didn't land very good . Dinwiddie could be worried. But lots of games to go .I wonder if he will sit these players as gainst other teams
Quote from: TecnoGenius on September 30, 2023, 04:48:15 AM
TOR plays the little 3rd down offside game more than anyone else. I'm screaming don't go offside, don't go offside, it's a bluff. Dude goes offside. I totally lost my bleepity bleep right there in the stands.
LOL! Yes they do and TSN showed O'Shea's face and he was clearly unimpressed. I have no doubt it will be addressed. It was our one and only encounter with the Argos this year and overall we did okay and stayed disciplined. What really stood out to me was how dirty that Toronto team plays. They got flagged for some of it but got away with a lot of dirt too, the high hit on Demski being a prime example. Some late and dirty stuff against BO also. One of the reasons I dislike the Argos so much is that they play to injure and clearly have no regard for player safety while being deathly afraid of injury themselves. Hypocrites.
Quote from: Tiger on September 30, 2023, 02:16:58 PM
That was an embarrassing game.
Did not instill confidence
Agreed, but we got a good look at them and know what to expect in a GC rematch. We'll be ready.
Quote from: buckzumhoff on September 30, 2023, 02:21:11 PM
It was a very good game and a good win. Only allowed Toronto 11 first downs to 28. A big difference. Toronto had good field position didn't have to work the ball downfield as much. The announcer speaker was blasting all game . Couldn't even hear the refs call on plays. Wolitarsky found holes in their defence bug Toronto plays way back in coverage . That's where the shirt passes beat them
Yes, Woli was very good as was Shoen. Baily and Demski played well also.
my takeaways for the game and what we have to do to beat Argos (at full strength) (also much of which applies to BC)
1. The short game was successful, saw more quick outs and using Wolitarski was smart
2. Pass protection wasn't good enough and we need fo fix this or Collaros won't make it to the playoffs
He's starting to rush throws, and getting hit more and more to make plays. We talk about Lawler not making plays or even Demski downfield, getting Zac more time solves this as well.
3. The layback defense won't be as much a factor against Kelly or even Bc as they like to go downfield more
4. Our interior rush has to improve, it's not too late to bring in someone, we have the option of another import with Kramdl starting.
5 Defensively we need to keep one lb on Oullette, he is a good runner, but extra effective on delay runs or tosses.
6 With Mcmanus and Oakfield in the run game will be less effective so we need to use BO on screens or short throws.
7. Replace Jackson with Mcrae, in the short game he's a threat while I didn't see Jackson make 1 play. Against TO or BC we need to utilize all of our roster
Quote from: Pete on September 30, 2023, 03:34:44 PM
my takeaways for the game and what we have to do to beat Argos (at full strength) (also much of which applies to BC)
1. The short game was successful, saw more quick outs and using Wolitarski was smart
2. Pass protection wasn't good enough and we need fo fix this or Collaros won't make it to the playoffs
He's starting to rush throws, and getting hit more and more to make plays. We talk about Lawler not making plays or even Demski downfield, getting Zac more time solves this as well.
3. The layback defense won't be as much a factor against Kelly or even Bc as they like to go downfield more
4. Our interior rush has to improve, it's not too late to bring in someone, we have the option of another import with Kramdl starting.
5 Defensively we need to keep one lb on Oullette, he is a good runner, but extra effective on delay runs or tosses.
6 With Mcmanus and Oakfield in the run game will be less effective so we need to use BO on screens or short throws.
7. Replace Jackson with Mcrae, in the short game he's a threat while I didn't see Jackson make 1 play. Against TO or BC we need to utilize all of our roster
Good points and I agree with most of your comments.
The short pass game is very effective but those short passes to the sideline have resulted in too many int's or pic 6s. Need to be a bit more careful and not rush those throws.
I'd like to replace Jackson but I'm not sure if McCrae will be the best choice. Things are going to be in the air until we know if Houston can play next week.
What I think we've all seen is that our DL ( aside from rotation depth ) doesn't get enough pressure inside. Constantly losing contain on the outside partially as a result. I was hoping Hansen would improve the DL overall but it was a lot to ask after a year off against a top team.
To that end I'd hope we might add one of the DL from the PR for the next game and sit our import LB. Lions OL is not nearly as good as the Argos and neither is their run game. We need to be able to collapse the pocket.
1st place is up for grabs when we play the Lions so we need to show up for play 1. Avoid a couple of those big mistakes like the Oliveria fumble. Those are huge turning points.
Quote from: the.inkster on September 29, 2023, 06:06:32 PM
I'm also hoping the brain trust has the long game in mind. If we're anticipating an Argos/Bombers GC, it'd be nice to see them throw some wrinkles in this game - trick plays; unique alignments (Willie at receiver again please?!).
So, first two returns are reverses.. was that OK?
Quote from: theaardvark on September 30, 2023, 03:52:25 PM
So, first two returns are reverses.. was that OK?
Yes it plants the seed. Holm may have gained another 20 yards if not for touching the sideline by a couple of inches.
Quote from: theaardvark on September 30, 2023, 03:52:25 PM
So, first two returns are reverses.. was that OK?
I saw them work on it in practice a number of weeks ago but I am forbidden from mentioning it here. Didn't work too well then either btw. My theory is that they use it this week because Grant is back next week. I can hope can't i? I mean if not, they would save it for the MUST win of the year wouldn't they?
Concerning to see Houston get injured and Parker was seen limping late in the game....
Forgot that we have some solid backup options that could be just as good to fill in. Desmond Lawrence and Abu Daramy Swaray are more than capable of playing and starting.
If Parker is nicked, I'd make Holm the returner for now...
If Houston is out, the ADS should be back in...
Quote from: theaardvark on September 30, 2023, 04:19:13 PM
If Parker is nicked, I'd make Holm the returner for now...
If Houston is out, the ADS should be back in...
I hope we don't lose either but even losing one creates issues both on the return game and depth in the secondary.
Quote from: northof30 on September 30, 2023, 04:28:53 PM
TSN is the worst!
(Toronto Sports Network) I saw more of Kelly on the sidelines and doing stupid hand shakes than I did of Zach in the game. BTW, did you know that Toronto had wrapped up the East already? TSN must have said it 100 times just in case people didn't know.
Quote from: J5V on September 30, 2023, 05:53:52 PM
(Toronto Sports Network) I saw more of Kelly on the sidelines and doing stupid hand shakes than I did of Zach in the game. BTW, did you know that Toronto had wrapped up the East already? TSN must have said it 100 times just in case people didn't know.
Imagine needing that much promotion for your team that you need to repeat it so often and annoy the rest of the country, and show someone who isn't even playing that game. Sad. :'(
Quote from: northof30 on September 30, 2023, 04:28:53 PM
TSN is the worst!
Yup
At least they did not ignore the game and just interview people like during the Hamilton game
3Q11:05 Pierce gets a IC flag. But at the end of the play he's hitting Lawler, and no other defender around. So Lawler must have been his guy and the IC must have been on Lawler, therefore shouldn't the IC flag have been a DPI? DPI is upgraded to IC when the ball is thrown to the IC'd receiver.
I was wondering that at @IGF too. I thought TSN should show what happened, but in typical TSN fashion they don't show the IC foul.
Another note: our ST was playing basically TOR's starting ST... there was no holding back on that front for them. Leake and all the normal cover/blocking guys. And we pretty much clobbered them. We may have even won the net yards battle!! Leake only got the one breakout.
Our blocking for Parker was much improved. He had 2 breakouts, though one was called back for a phantom IB no one saw and no replay was ever shown.
Castillo was kicking off all the way to the 10 and we were getting guys down there by the time Leake made the 20 or so. Even on one IB callback return Leake only got to the 30 or so.
Add Grant into our ST and I think we can go toe to toe with BC and TOR STs. BC especially has just a meh returner.
TOR was overloading one side of every FG attempt and our guys stood firm and Boudreau had them doing much better than the shambles of a GC. I'm not sure how some of those TOR looks were still legal, with the new this year rules. I guess some guys must have been a yard back. But we need to watch for TOR FG blocks as they are trying tricky block looks on every attempt.
I think we've turned the ST corner and can start to be more confident that we'll stop returners, as well as get more yards on our side.
Quote from: Blue In BC on September 30, 2023, 03:05:22 AM
Overall not entirely impressed with offensive play calling. Oliveria was a force almost on his own more than play calling helping him. He was a man on a mission.
Watch again. Buck had the run playbook wide open. We were throwing in a new jumbo set every other down. Jackson in maybe 30% of the run plays, especially later. Some sets with 2 TE OL. If I'm having trouble keeping it all straight with all my advanced PVR stuff and pause and replay/slowmo, imagine those D's trying to figure it out in real-time??
We also did a lot of new short game stuff, and some old standbys we used earlier in the year really worked. The only real short mistake was the ubiquitous quick curl left where the DE jumps and blocks like in the GC. Thankfully we only did that once. I want that play flushed from our book completely. Won't work against Argos ever again.
And the one go post to Demski almost worked for a bust and a TD. Just a little more air...
I think Buck goes mental on the playbook for the BC game. I think it's more important than the WDF. If we win we play wimpy, no run-game BC in the cold. We lose and WDF will look like the 2016 "65 yard kick attempt" WSF loss in cushy warm BC Place. It'll be easier to beat them now in BC Place than later with a packed house in WDF. Not to mention... BC gets a final week bye, we will play 2 more games in earnest and have no bye if we need to waste time on a WSF.
Quote from: Pete on September 30, 2023, 03:34:44 PM
5 Defensively we need to keep one lb on Oullette, he is a good runner, but extra effective on delay runs or tosses.
7. Replace Jackson with Mcrae, in the short game he's a threat while I didn't see Jackson make 1 play. Against TO or BC we need to utilize all of our roster
I wonder who Oullette learned that from... oh ya, that's right, AH33, literally the best escape artist and dump-pass expert in the CFL. Ya, you have to keep a guy on him at all times. No excuse for letting him sneak out of blocking like that. TOR loves that vacated middle. They seem to plan it into every single play; it's their insurance policy.
Jackson was doing a ton in this game. He made some great blocks, sealing blocks, cross-line blocks, critical blocks that were probably getting BO20 up to the second level. I'm warming up to Jackson and he's getting better and being used more.
To sit Jackson and roster McCrae you'd need to be facing a team where you're not trying to pound it as much, but need more edge speed for sweeps and double & triple move go routes when no one suspects the RB to go deep. As it gets colder, it'll be more Jackson, not less. McCrae may not get ARd again this season, unless we get one "garbage season" game in the final week if BC would just do us a solid and lose 1 or 2 games!!