OLine solutions...

[TecnoGenius]

This really needs its own thread.  Lots of talk in the FA threads, etc.  But no real consensus as to what is going on.

Losing Yoshi (Hardrick) is huge, but not insurmountable.  So do we finally move Gray (if retained) there, or slide Neufeld in, or risk it on Ivy?

So posters have said Richmond retired.  That's bad timing, unless we clearly weren't enthused.  He never did show much.  McGloster was the better one and we should have tried to keep him, instead of him beating us by locking down Willie most of the GC.  So posters have said Ivy is the only real in-house IMP tackle.

Does Gray walk?  No chatter yet in the tamper period, so it's looking good for retaining him, I guess.  Does Yoshi walking let Gray ask for mega-$$ if he knows he's our only option at RT??

Eli is set, but Dobson is still a question.  We usually can retain the dev guys.  I think Spooner is the last good dev guy we lost in FA?  (Going by memory.)  I'm thinking we do keep Dobson?  I would make it a priority.  He's great as the 6th and clearly will be good enough to be a starting G in another season or so.  And isn't our NAT OL cupboard bare after those guys?

So have at it.  Let's hear the best guesses -- real good guesses -- as to what we're doing to fill those 2 gaping holes as well as 6th spot and new guys for the hopper.  What are the odds we go 4 NAT OL?  Is an early/mid-career FA IMP a possibility?  KW has done it 3 time before.  Can Ivy possibly get it done?  Or will the scouts come up with near-impossible magic (never been done in WFC?)?

After QB (where we're set), these questions are probably the most important ones that will define the success of the team in 2024.

[theaardvark]

Ivy has some time on the team, but the guy I'm interested in is Vanterpool.  6'6, 315 and his scouting reviews are glowing.  He might not have NFL skills/size. but he seems perfect for CFL.  And cming in at RT is easier than LT, and with our coaches and Big Stan to guide him, and Eli that went to the same school.. I think we might end up with a gooder here.

[Blue In BC]

Vanterpool was 1 of 14 T's in FBS to not allow a sack in 500+ snaps. Also didn't take a penalty in 900+ snaps.

Good size and is an interesting candidate. That said, it wouldn't surprise me to see Richmond back before TC if the team makes him a better contract offer. I can why he wouldn't want another ELC deal but how much would it take?

[LXTSN]

I lean towards giving Ivey the shot, however... There will need to be competition. From my knowledge, Ivey hasn't been dressed for a single game in the CFL. That doesn't give him much of a head start on the other guys that we bring into camp. Vanterpool I had never heard of before today but that seems like a solid option as well.

I don't love the second option of starting a national at tackle. Our options would be Gray (if re-signed) or Eli. I don't trust Gray at all in that position (I barely trust him at left guard), and I don't think Eli would be mobile enough at RT.

[theaardvark]

Vanterpool was 1 of 14 T's in FBS to not allow a sack in 500+ snaps. Also didn't take a penalty in 900+ snaps.

Good size and is an interesting candidate. That said, it wouldn't surprise me to see Richmond back before TC if the team makes him a better contract offer. I can why he wouldn't want another ELC deal but how much would it take?

You have to wonder why Richardson, who was under contract already, would choose to retire.  Under a deal he had agreed to.  No, when he agreed to that deal, Yoshi and Big Stan were not going anywhere except by injury, where Richardson would be able to come in and prove himself.  He unfortunately didn't get that chance.

Now that Yoshi has moved on, he would have been asked to compete for a starting spot, at the American Oline backup salary.  Walters does not have to offer him any more, the contract is valid.  But he could have put in more/better playing time bonuses. 

Walters is not known for renegotiating contracts, even with future stars. See: Dalton Schoen.  Richardson cannot sign in the CFL without a release from the Bombers.  If he changes his mind about playing out his deal and proving himself a CFL starting tackle, we might see him in camp.  If he has a non-football career ready to go, then probably not.

[TecnoGenius]

Vanterpool was 1 of 14 T's in FBS to not allow a sack in 500+ snaps. Also didn't take a penalty in 900+ snaps.

Vanterpool starting in his first week in the CFL is basically impossible, no?  When is the last time a young OL came up from the states to start in his first year?  It's not just WFC that develops these guys for 1-3+ years before they can start: it's a league-wide thing.  Sure, there's got to be exceptions forced into injury-replacement duty that were good, but I can't name any at the moment, and in any event, they are rare.  NATs seem better at doing that... maybe because Canada U sports better prepares them for the CFL game?

[TecnoGenius]

I lean towards giving Ivey the shot, however... There will need to be competition.

Ivey (not Ivy I guess) was miles behind Richmond in development... If I/we didn't think Richmond was ready, then Ivey must certainly not be either?  But I guess potential desperation can lead to unorthodox decisions?

[TecnoGenius]

You have to wonder why Richardson, who was under contract already, would choose to retire.

You mean Richmond?

He wasn't up for FA?  I didn't know that.  Retiring while under contract is interesting.  Was he on his 2nd contract with us?  Surely he wasn't still on his first?  I thought he'd been here 2-3+ seasons?

I still think we found him lacking and will not be interested in pursuit.  But I could be wrong now that desperation may be setting in.

[TecnoGenius]

No, when he agreed to that deal, Yoshi and Big Stan were not going anywhere except by injury, where Richardson would be able to come in and prove himself.  He unfortunately didn't get that chance.

There were a couple of 2023 games where Yoshi was out with injury, and instead of putting Richmond in RT, we just moved Neufeld to RT and put the NAT spares in at RG.

Looking back now, this may have been seen as an insult to Richmond who, as you said above, should have been activated to finally get his chance.  (Maybe also an insult to Gray!)

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Ivey (not Ivy I guess) was miles behind Richmond in development... If I/we didn't think Richmond was ready, then Ivey must certainly not be either?  But I guess potential desperation can lead to unorthodox decisions?

I remember Ivey from last pre-season and was not impressed, but who knows.

[TecnoGenius]

I remember Ivey from last pre-season and was not impressed, but who knows.

TBH both Ivey and Richmond stunk up the joint in PS and garbage-season when dressed.  Doesn't mean they can't still improve.  Clearly IMP OLs takes time to dev, kind of like IMP QBs.  I'm certainly not making a statement on Ivey's future, just Ivey's present (or more accurately, Ivey's last 300 days).

Were Stanley and Yoshi starting full time in their rookie seasons?  I'll guess: no?  Look at them now.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

There were a couple of 2023 games where Yoshi was out with injury, and instead of putting Richmond in RT, we just moved Neufeld to RT and put the NAT spares in at RG.

Looking back now, this may have been seen as an insult to Richmond who, as you said above, should have been activated to finally get his chance.  (Maybe also an insult to Gray!)

Pretty sure Neufeld didn't have any snaps at RT last season and not sure Yoshi missed any games.  Richmond did play the entire last game against the Stamps in place of Bryant in late Oct.

[TecnoGenius]

Pretty sure Neufeld didn't have any snaps at RT last season and not sure Yoshi missed any games.  Richmond did play the entire last game against the Stamps in place of Bryant in late Oct.

It may have been 2022, but I thought 2023.  If Neuf didn't play a snap at RT in either year then I'm going insane; I'm nearly positive I'm right, though.  I'll dig through the depth charts and get back to you.

Edit: Hmm, can't immediately find it in the charts, so it would have had to be an in-game temp replacement.  Still pretty sure Neuf did take snaps at RT, because I made a mental note (and probably forum note, knowing me) that it was odd we didn't move Gray over.  But if not in the charts, it couldn't have been an entire start.  Maybe someone else remembers this so I don't have to go nuts digging through all my PVR?

Note: Lofton seems to have gotten many of the pre/garbage-season RT snaps, according to the charts.  What happened to him?

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

It may have been 2022, but I thought 2023.  If Neuf didn't play a snap at RT in either year then I'm going insane; I'm nearly positive I'm right, though.  I'll dig through the depth charts and get back to you.

Edit: Hmm, can't immediately find it in the charts, so it would have had to be an in-game temp replacement.  Still pretty sure Neuf did take snaps at RT, because I made a mental note (and probably forum note, knowing me) that it was odd we didn't move Gray over.  But if not in the charts, it couldn't have been an entire start.  Maybe someone else remembers this so I don't have to go nuts digging through all my PVR?

Note: Lofton seems to have gotten many of the pre/garbage-season RT snaps, according to the charts.  What happened to him?

Lofton played LT for the Riders for 5-6 games last season but is listed as a FA now.

[TecnoGenius]

Lofton played LT for the Riders for 5-6 games last season but is listed as a FA now.

Ooof, if he's partially responsible for that tire fire in SSK last season... hard pass on him!!   

[LXTSN]

Ivey (not Ivy I guess) was miles behind Richmond in development... If I/we didn't think Richmond was ready, then Ivey must certainly not be either?  But I guess potential desperation can lead to unorthodox decisions?

I don't think there's any evidence to say that Ivy was miles behind Richmond. I'll give you a couple reasons why I think he could be just as good.
Ivy is 2 years younger than Richmond. Ivy is only 26, and has room to grow.
Richmond got here before Ivy and I think it's fair to say that the bombers can be in the habit of being loyal to a fault. That could be a reason to keep Richmond on the roster if they were at a comparable skill level.

Obviously it's really hard to compare OL with stats. It's really just the amount of times they get blown by from a DE. Without seeing them play it's really impossible without speculating.

[Jesse]

Losing Yoshi (Hardrick) is huge, but not insurmountable.  So do we finally move Gray (if retained) there, or slide Neufeld in, or risk it on Ivy?

Does Gray walk?  No chatter yet in the tamper period, so it's looking good for retaining him, I guess.  Does Yoshi walking let Gray ask for mega-$$ if he knows he's our only option at RT??

Eli is set, but Dobson is still a question.  We usually can retain the dev guys.  I think Spooner is the last good dev guy we lost in FA?  (Going by memory.)  I'm thinking we do keep Dobson?  I would make it a priority.  He's great as the 6th and clearly will be good enough to be a starting G in another season or so.  And isn't our NAT OL cupboard bare after those guys?

So have at it.  Let's hear the best guesses -- real good guesses -- as to what we're doing to fill those 2 gaping holes as well as 6th spot and new guys for the hopper.  What are the odds we go 4 NAT OL?  Is an early/mid-career FA IMP a possibility?  KW has done it 3 time before.  Can Ivy possibly get it done?  Or will the scouts come up with near-impossible magic (never been done in WFC?)?

After QB (where we're set), these questions are probably the most important ones that will define the success of the team in 2024.

I obviously don't have any inside knowledge, but I've read a couple of time that Gray is expected to move on? I imagine we want to keep him around and might be the best option at taking over at tackle. But perhaps he must also be looking for that pay raise - whether from us or elsewhere. Can't imaigine we'd willingly move on in a year Hardrick leaves.

Eli and Dobson are both under contract. I guess they're both in the fight for starting LG. Perhaps Eli still has a chance at becoming the C, but Kolo's re-signing makes that unlikely, imo.

But if Gray walks, there's at least a decent chance it's rookie imports competing for the spot.

[theaardvark]

6'2 286 is a little on the small side for a tackle, no?  I hope his feet and speed make up for it...

[CrazyCanuck89]

6'2 286 is a little on the small side for a tackle, no?  I hope his feet and speed make up for it...

Who is this size?

[theaardvark]

Who is this size?

Ivy

[Pigskin]

Who is this size?

Chris Ivy.

[TecnoGenius]

I obviously don't have any inside knowledge, but I've read a couple of time that Gray is expected to move on? I imagine we want to keep him around and might be the best option at taking over at tackle. But perhaps he must also be looking for that pay raise - whether from us or elsewhere. Can't imaigine we'd willingly move on in a year Hardrick leaves.

Well, if (big if) Gray is The Mafia's desired option for RT, then there's his pay raise!  As a NAT OT he can demand, and be paid, a lot more than he was as "just a" LG.  Since he would begin on a sort of trial basis, clearly we wouldn't give him crazy money right off the bat, but he'd probably be due a respectable bump.  If this is the case, and Gray is smart, he'll insist on a 1-year contract so he can prove his worth at RT and then ask for Bryant money in the next FA.

[TecnoGenius]

6'2 286 is a little on the small side for a tackle, no?  I hope his feet and speed make up for it...

The 6'2 is written in stone, but the 286 can be solved easily enough with the trick I learned from my inside line on L.Rice: get eating those 10 lb tubes of bologna 24/7.

286 is the same weight as some DTs, and you don't want them twisting/stunting and pushing you back like a leaf in the wind.

[TecnoGenius]

Still no replies to my questions about McGloster... how did we let him walk?  Was it a case of him getting good enough he wanted to start (and be paid) and we simply couldn't afford it since we were clearly set at OT?

Or was it we thought he stunk and just let him walk and he didn't even get a pay raise?

Or was this around when Lapo walked and he stole away McGloster?  Ahh Aha.... the cfl stats site shows he started 2021 with OTT (weird, no line for MTL, but it's the same guy).  So Lapo spotted his talent and offered him more than PR money.  That wily Lapo.  It finally starts to make sense.

So then the ultimate beneficiary was MTL stealing him from OTT (FA? trade?) when it all fell apart post-Lapo and the witches had to be burned (baby & bathwater & all that).

It just kind of irks me that we're sitting here ruing the loss of our star RT and trembling because we have zero idea how to replace him, when we had his perfect ready-made replacement in-house a few seasons ago, and could have probably kept him if we had bumped up his pay a little bit to match Lapo.  But apparently we liked Richmond instead.

GC-win-caliber OT to boot!!  He was a shut-down RT in that game.  Frustrating

[Pigskin]

McGloster: Signed with Winnipeg in May 2019. Made the AR out of TC. Went to the PR after game 3. Then was released. Probably asked to be released to join LA Chargers.

Aug 2019 signed with LA Chargers. Was released at the end of TC.

Jan 2020 signed with Ottawa. No season. 2021 played 5 games was released at the end of the season.

Feb 2022 signed with BC. Cut in May.

July 2022 signed by  Montreal. PR all season. 2023 played 9 games.

 

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Still no replies to my questions about McGloster... how did we let him walk?  Was it a case of him getting good enough he wanted to start (and be paid) and we simply couldn't afford it since we were clearly set at OT?

Or was it we thought he stunk and just let him walk and he didn't even get a pay raise?

Or was this around when Lapo walked and he stole away McGloster?  Ahh Aha.... the cfl stats site shows he started 2021 with OTT (weird, no line for MTL, but it's the same guy).  So Lapo spotted his talent and offered him more than PR money.  That wily Lapo.  It finally starts to make sense.

So then the ultimate beneficiary was MTL stealing him from OTT (FA? trade?) when it all fell apart post-Lapo and the witches had to be burned (baby & bathwater & all that).

It just kind of irks me that we're sitting here ruing the loss of our star RT and trembling because we have zero idea how to replace him, when we had his perfect ready-made replacement in-house a few seasons ago, and could have probably kept him if we had bumped up his pay a little bit to match Lapo.  But apparently we liked Richmond instead.

GC-win-caliber OT to boot!!  He was a shut-down RT in that game.  Frustrating

Can't hold onto guys that want to play for 4 years, they come, they go, doesn't mean much of anything.  McGloster may be adequate, but he's not a stud.

[TecnoGenius]

McGloster: Signed with Winnipeg in May 2019. Made the AR out of TC. Went to the PR after game 3. Then was released. Probably asked to be released to join LA Chargers.

Aug 2019 signed with LA Chargers. Was released at the end of TC.
[...]
July 2022 signed by  Montreal. PR all season. 2023 played 9 games.

Wow!  Quite a journey for him.  Makes a little more sense now.

But as for MTL... The instant they benched Rice and put McGloster as RT starter was when they started their big 8+ game winning streak, culminating in their GC win.  I know this because I track Rice's career pretty closely.

I don't think it's so much that Rice stunk as McGloster has become pretty darn good.  Again, check out his GC performance against Willie & co.  Yoshi got beat more than McGloster did...

I would still consider Rice as a "no other option" RT option, especially if Gray walks.  He's still sitting with no calls in FA == cheap(ish).  If we did end up starting 4 NAT OL it opens up all sorts of extra roster / scheme options on D, which could really help with our soon-to-be underpowered D.

Other FA OL still out there:
N Steward
N Richards
A Tate
A Riley
N Saxelid
N Van Zeyl
N Johnson
A Kelly
A Lofton
N Campbell
N Sceviour
A Thornton
N St John
N Thomassin
A Norman

Wow!  There's actually a whackton of OL still in FA!  Cross off everyone above who can't play OT.  Who's left?

Anyone know how good Tate is?  No other names stand out to me.

[CrazyCanuck89]

Wow!  Quite a journey for him.  Makes a little more sense now.

But as for MTL... The instant they benched Rice and put McGloster as RT starter was when they started their big 8+ game winning streak, culminating in their GC win.  I know this because I track Rice's career pretty closely.

I don't think it's so much that Rice stunk as McGloster has become pretty darn good.  Again, check out his GC performance against Willie & co.  Yoshi got beat more than McGloster did...

I would still consider Rice as a "no other option" RT option, especially if Gray walks.  He's still sitting with no calls in FA == cheap(ish).  If we did end up starting 4 NAT OL it opens up all sorts of extra roster / scheme options on D, which could really help with our soon-to-be underpowered D.

Other FA OL still out there:
N Steward
N Richards
A Tate
A Riley
N Saxelid
N Van Zeyl
N Johnson
A Kelly
A Lofton
N Campbell
N Sceviour
A Thornton
N St John
N Thomassin
A Norman

Wow!  There's actually a whackton of OL still in FA!  Cross off everyone above who can't play OT.  Who's left?

Anyone know how good Tate is?  No other names stand out to me.

Lot's of tackles on that list.

[theaardvark]

There are lots of FA options.  Unfortunately there are no $SMS left unless we land one cheap, and the last thing you want is a cheap tackle.  I'd rather have a rookie tackle with upside than a used tackle that no one wants.

We will address the issue in mini-camps, training camps and into the season.  I have faith in both the scouts and the coaches that this will not be an issue.

If we start the year with Bryant, Dobson, Kolankowski, Eli and Neufeld as our Oline, we will still have one of the best in the league.

Ranking the "musts" this off season, Oliviera and Schoen were much higher than Hardrick, Jeffcoat or the other FA's we lost.  We were never going to be able to keep them all, the fact that we got the top 2 pending FA's in the league to sign here is amazing. 

[TecnoGenius]

If we start the year with Bryant, Dobson, Kolankowski, Eli and Neufeld as our Oline, we will still have one of the best in the league.

Not week 1 we won't.  That line-up would be extremely shaky, and it leaves no one proven capable as our 6th OL for jumbo (which we use all the time now).

I would say at the bare minimum we must have Gray, and either Gray/Neuf are RT... or we magically pull a serviceable IMP RT out of thin air (Ivy or otherwise).

If we are starting both Eli/Dobson in the 5, then we have big problems.  Eli is better as 6th; and the backup, dressed C.

Ranking the "musts" this off season, Oliviera and Schoen were much higher than Hardrick, Jeffcoat or the other FA's we lost.  We were never going to be able to keep them all, the fact that we got the top 2 pending FA's in the league to sign here is amazing.

I don't know.  All the best receivers in the world aren't going to help you when your OL lets all the pass rush through.  Look at BC with M.Reilly and when Claybrooks was there, and EDM last season.  Amazing receiving corps, maybe the best on paper, couldn't complete a pass to save their lives.  That could be us in 2024 if KW doesn't have some magic fairy dust lined up.

[Jesse]

Not week 1 we won't.  That line-up would be extremely shaky, and it leaves no one proven capable as our 6th OL for jumbo (which we use all the time now).

I would say at the bare minimum we must have Gray, and either Gray/Neuf are RT... or we magically pull a serviceable IMP RT out of thin air (Ivy or otherwise).

If we are starting both Eli/Dobson in the 5, then we have big problems.  Eli is better as 6th; and the backup, dressed C.

I think you're severely over estimating the OL talent across the league.

I do not see us moving Neuf to RT. Dobson/Eli will fight it out for the guard spot and the other will continue to be #6. We can find a tackle and still field an excellent OL in week 1.

[LXTSN]

I would prefer to see how Vanderpool and Ivey handle training camp.
Worst case scenario would be moving Neufeld to RT, but I think we find a better option there

[theaardvark]

I think you're severely over estimating the OL talent across the league.

I do not see us moving Neuf to RT. Dobson/Eli will fight it out for the guard spot and the other will continue to be #6. We can find a tackle and still field an excellent OL in week 1.

*IF* we have to start the season with Neufeld at RT, it will not be a catastrophe.  We could even DI Vanterpool or Ivy (no E) as they get up to speed, and then move Neuf inside as one of them is ready. 

Ideally, we replace Hardrick with a new American RT in camp, and have Eli/Dobson fight for Gray's job. 

With only 2 rostered right now, I'm hoping the scouts bring a few more in.

[CrazyCanuck89]

*IF* we have to start the season with Neufeld at RT, it will not be a catastrophe.  We could even DI Vanterpool or Ivy (no E) as they get up to speed, and then move Neuf inside as one of them is ready. 

Ideally, we replace Hardrick with a new American RT in camp, and have Eli/Dobson fight for Gray's job. 

With only 2 rostered right now, I'm hoping the scouts bring a few more in.

People do forget that Neufeld spent his first couple of years in the league at tackle.

[Pete]

WHAT I would like to see is us draft a Canadian tightend. The cdn fb position is becoming antiquated, teams are putting more additional lineman in up front, and much like we used Jackson,  a tightend with good blocking skills can also provide more reception opportunities. There's a reason te's are so important in the nfl. this would give the oline more support without losing an offensive threat. I wouldn't be adverse to even replacing Bailey with an import te.
Was there even one fb last year that even approached 100 yrds total for the season?

[Jesse]

*IF* we have to start the season with Neufeld at RT, it will not be a catastrophe. 

It is the last thing I would do.

People do forget that Neufeld spent his first couple of years in the league at tackle.

I haven't forgotten, he just wasn't very good until he was moved to guard. Moving him from a spot where he has been successful is a great way to make two spots worse, instead of just one.

[theaardvark]

It is the last thing I would do.

I haven't forgotten, he just wasn't very good until he was moved to guard. Moving him from a spot where he has been successful is a great way to make two spots worse, instead of just one.

Neufeld *CAN* play RT, we used him for that purpose over Gray last year. It is not optimal, it is contingency.  If we can't get an American RT up to speed, Neufeld knows how to play the spot, and Eli/Dobson can play inside.

Optimally, we have a new RT, and Eli/Dobson fight for Gray's spot.  But if that is not the case week 1, we have a viable option.

[KINGCHARLES]

I'm going to put all my faith into a few people here. The Canadian Mafia and Marty Costello, Coach Costello is entering his 9th season as an OL coach here and his 7th as the main OL coach. We've consistently been a top 3 offence in the league for the last 5 seasons and a lot of that credit can go to the play of the offensive line. The last 2 seasons we've allowed the 2nd fewest amount of sacks in the CFL.
Eli and Dobson were drafted with the intent on being groomed into starting roles and I think the Mafia wants to give them those opportunities this season. They will obviously also be looking at drafting 1-2 OL in this years draft with the full mentality of grooming and developing for the future.
This offseason was an inevitable offseason for the Bombers, we needed to have change and some of that had to happen on the OL. I believe 3 of the last 5 seasons we  have lost at least 1 starting OL to the salary cap. This is what will continue to happen with aging vets and dominating teams.

[Pigskin]

At #8 there should be a couple of very good OLs. Daniel Johnson, 6'5" 320  LT Purdue, and Giovanni Manu 6'8" 350 LT UBC.
Manu is said to be CFL ready.

There is a very good TE in the top 20. Tanner McLachlan 6'5" 245, but he looks like a guy NHL teams will go after.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

*IF* we have to start the season with Neufeld at RT, it will not be a catastrophe.  We could even DI Vanterpool or Ivy (no E) as they get up to speed, and then move Neuf inside as one of them is ready. 

Ideally, we replace Hardrick with a new American RT in camp, and have Eli/Dobson fight for Gray's job. 

With only 2 rostered right now, I'm hoping the scouts bring a few more in.

Bombers A-1 O-line gave up 4 sacks to the Als in the Grey Cup no less, throw in a rookie OT against a vet. squad and they will feast. O-line is only as strong as it's weakest link.

[CrazyCanuck89]

At #8 there should be a couple of very good OLs. Daniel Johnson, 6'5" 320  LT Purdue, and Giovanni Manu 6'8" 350 LT UBC.
Manu is said to be CFL ready.

There is a very good TE in the top 20. Tanner McLachlan 6'5" 245, but he looks like a guy NHL teams will go after.

That should be great if the Bomber's get either of those tackles, even Manu's team mate. The guy could fall do to nfl interest.

[Pigskin]

That should be great if the Bomber's get either of those tackles, even Manu's team mate. The guy could fall do to nfl interest.

Theo Benedet, is going to go in the top 3. However I think he will get lots of attention from the NFL.

[TecnoGenius]

*IF* we have to start the season with Neufeld at RT, it will not be a catastrophe.  We could even DI Vanterpool or Ivy (no E) as they get up to speed, and then move Neuf inside as one of them is ready. 

Ideally, we replace Hardrick with a new American RT in camp, and have Eli/Dobson fight for Gray's job. 

But when's the last time we started week 1 with a rookie ELC IMP OL OT?  Never?  Not since I've been paying attention.  Heck, our OL success run with Yoshi/Stan was literally built on sniping established tackles from other teams.

Why all of a sudden do we think that either a) import rookie Jesus shows up TC and can start week 1, or b) one of our own existing "dev" IMP OT will be good enough?  That would be relying on something the Mafia has literally never done before.

I think (a) is a pipe dream, foggettaboutit.  (b) Is more to our MO (at other positions), but is still a moonshot.

Maybe we still snipe an existing, established FA.  So many out there, some may take peanuts to keep working, and play for the best, GC-bound team.  If I had to place bets, this would be my bet.

If come week 1 it's Neufeld @ RT, then we know we were in "no other options" mode.  Maybe he'll rise to the challenge, who knows.  He wasn't bad when there; just not Yoshi level.  I'd say Neuf @ RT is at least as good as Rice.

[TecnoGenius]

WHAT I would like to see is us draft a Canadian tightend. The cdn fb position is becoming antiquated, teams are putting more additional lineman in up front, and much like we used Jackson,  a tightend with good blocking skills can also provide more reception opportunities. There's a reason te's are so important in the nfl. this would give the oline more support without losing an offensive threat. I wouldn't be adverse to even replacing Bailey with an import te.
Was there even one fb last year that even approached 100 yrds total for the season?

Yes, that appears to be the need for this draft.  TE/FB, unless we find a FA castoff NAT who will work for near-ELC...

I can't think of a FB who got 100, but maybe one of those teams that throws the trick play to the FB/TE more often than usual?  Who was that the last couple of years: BC, MTL?  Don't remember.  That play seemed to disappear in 2023, but was more common 2021-22?

[TecnoGenius]

I'm going to put all my faith into a few people here. The Canadian Mafia and Marty Costello, Coach Costello is entering his 9th season as an OL coach here and his 7th as the main OL coach. We've consistently been a top 3 offence in the league for the last 5 seasons and a lot of that credit can go to the play of the offensive line. The last 2 seasons we've allowed the 2nd fewest amount of sacks in the CFL.
Eli and Dobson were drafted with the intent on being groomed into starting roles and I think the Mafia wants to give them those opportunities this season. They will obviously also be looking at drafting 1-2 OL in this years draft with the full mentality of grooming and developing for the future.
This offseason was an inevitable offseason for the Bombers, we needed to have change and some of that had to happen on the OL. I believe 3 of the last 5 seasons we  have lost at least 1 starting OL to the salary cap. This is what will continue to happen with aging vets and dominating teams.

Yes, every year it seemed we were losing 1-2 NAT OL to cap and retirement.  But usually not 2 starters.  Losing both Yoshi and Gray in one swoop is a big hit to deal with, and may not have been expected by KW... unless he wanted Gray out knowing either Dobson/Eli was better.

If we must start both Eli and Dobson, then we'll 100% need to draft probably 2 OL and one would immediately be dressing for games to be the 6th.  This is not an ideal situation, and we usually don't do that (Gray, Desjar, Chungh are exceptions).

We always keep 2(+) NAT OL in the dev hopper.  Would have to restock the shelves.  If we move to a NAT RT solution then we'll require even more OL DP and even more kept in the hopper.  I hope the money we saved losing Yoshi is worth it all!!

Your post was really good, and I agree with it all.  I think we have faith Dobson/Eli can both start (though not ideal, nor desired).  It was a darn prudent move to bring back outcast Eli when we did, and probably on a $friendly$ contract.  Those who said nay need to thank their lucky stars Mafia disagreed.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Yes, that appears to be the need for this draft.  TE/FB, unless we find a FA castoff NAT who will work for near-ELC...

I can't think of a FB who got 100, but maybe one of those teams that throws the trick play to the FB/TE more often than usual?  Who was that the last couple of years: BC, MTL?  Don't remember.  That play seemed to disappear in 2023, but was more common 2021-22?

The best example of a FB/TE type player in the league is Milanovic-Litre who's been all around the league, but just moved from Ottawa to Hamilton.

[Jesse]

The best example of a FB/TE type player in the league is Milanovic-Litre who's been all around the league, but just moved from Ottawa to Hamilton.

I think with the bigger CFL fields, having a TE is kind of wasted. We'd rather just have the extra receiver on the field.

[LXTSN]

I think with the bigger CFL fields, having a TE is kind of wasted. We'd rather just have the extra receiver on the field.

I would say the closest thing to a NAT TE in this league would be Jevon Cottoy. I think that type of WR/TE would be a better fit to replace Bailey, rather than fit them into a FB position.

Leadblocking and and special teams play would be the most important skills for a new fullback. I thought Burtenshaw was decent, is he still available?

[CrazyCanuck89]

I think with the bigger CFL fields, having a TE is kind of wasted. We'd rather just have the extra receiver on the field.

Tighends and bigger and faster than the Dalla Riva and Gabriel days.  They should be a mismatch for any CFL linebacker.

[theaardvark]

But when's the last time we started week 1 with a rookie ELC IMP OL OT?  Never?  Not since I've been paying attention.  Heck, our OL success run with Yoshi/Stan was literally built on sniping established tackles from other teams.

Why all of a sudden do we think that either a) import rookie Jesus shows up TC and can start week 1, or b) one of our own existing "dev" IMP OT will be good enough?  That would be relying on something the Mafia has literally never done before.

I think (a) is a pipe dream, foggettaboutit.  (b) Is more to our MO (at other positions), but is still a moonshot.

Maybe we still snipe an existing, established FA.  So many out there, some may take peanuts to keep working, and play for the best, GC-bound team.  If I had to place bets, this would be my bet.

If come week 1 it's Neufeld @ RT, then we know we were in "no other options" mode.  Maybe he'll rise to the challenge, who knows.  He wasn't bad when there; just not Yoshi level.  I'd say Neuf @ RT is at least as good as Rice.

SO, I guess Lofton makes us a GC champ again?

[LXTSN]

Great to have added competition. Lofton, Ivy and Vanderpoole should be what everyone has their eyes on in training camp!

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

I would say the closest thing to a NAT TE in this league would be Jevon Cottoy. I think that type of WR/TE would be a better fit to replace Bailey, rather than fit them into a FB position.

Leadblocking and and special teams play would be the most important skills for a new fullback. I thought Burtenshaw was decent, is he still available?

Both Cottoy and Bailey are SB's, FB/TE is a different position altogether often used to extend the O-line. Cottoy may have the size to play that position but they've never played him there, whereas Milanovic-Litre has played that position his entire career, Argo Declan Cross was also a good example.

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Lofton is a known commodity with CFL experience. He's important either as an early season starter or depth piece. Both are important. Richmond was clearly our succession plan but it didn't crumble for us the right way. Hopefully we'll find an American tackle in training camp who can be a good option by Labour Day but at least we're not automatically penciling in a rookie day 1. Gotta protect to be able to use all the money tied up in our receivers.

[Blueforlife]

Our OL will take time to gel.  We will find a couple new decent pieces.  We have been spoiled rotten with our group and agree with that those see potential / have in names, coaches and management.

Now if we get a couple key injuries, I'm worried.  We have also been lucky with that.  Normally lose a couple big guys in camp or along the way.  Hopefully we are healthy and find a couple new faces to develop.  I'm excited for the season, will be another good one that's for sure.

To me a good OL isn't made it's developed.  We are in transition and if we can build consistency in our group it will be the backbone of the club as it has been in the past.  Big shoes to fill.

[DM83]

What the jell is wrong with you guys?
Gray was the worst player in the line.  He was the first to miss his block and run downfield to the third level, and miss a second block in the secondary,  he was very tall.

Hardwick was a good bet to miss a block every game.  He was lucky that
 Our QB got rid. Of the ball fast, or escaped contain.  Hardwick was obviously given the. o lineman award, because it was getting embarrassing for Stanley to win it again.

Those two guys won't be missed

True they do have to get two new guys to play.  But we all knew change was evident.
We need to get Castillo signed same with Grant.

[TecnoGenius]

SO, I guess Lofton makes us a GC champ again?

Haha, ya.  Reading my post again I think I nailed it: we know we need a vet(ish) at RT.  But surely many others on the FA list were better bets?  Or maybe Lofton is the only one who'd take our pittan$e?  Anyone we bring up on ELC will just be the next IMP dev guy.  (Ivy's kind of in a weird middle ground.)

Reading Yoshi's "guilty" presser, surely there was some way we could have met him in the middle?  I bet if we came within $50k of SSK we could have kept him.  Argh, aggravating.

Here's how I see it: if we had a readymade solution in a PR guy who we know can do it, or a cast-off who we know can do it and know we can get, or an already-here NAT we know can do it... then you let Yoshi walk.  If you don't have one of those things, and the alternative is panic chaos and sackfest, then why oh why don't you find the cheapest price you can keep Yoshi for?

Now I'm wondering about Richmond... what occurred first?  Did Richmond retire or did Yoshi agree to terms with SSK?  If Richmond retired after Yoshi's decision, then I'm calling shenanigans.  If Mafia had Richmond set as the solution then this is one big cluster.  If that happened, KW is fuming.

As for Lofton... I'm not sure Rice wouldn't be a better RT choice, though once again this may hint that money is critically low...

[TecnoGenius]

Gray was the worst player in the line.  He was the first to miss his block and run downfield to the third level, and miss a second block in the secondary,  he was very tall.

Hardwick was a good bet to miss a block every game.  He was lucky that
 Our QB got rid. Of the ball fast, or escaped contain.  Hardwick was obviously given the. o lineman award, because it was getting embarrassing for Stanley to win it again.

Those two guys won't be missed

They will be missed if the replacements are worse.  And it's very easy to be worse than allstar Yoshi and pretty-good Gray.

As we see across the league, finding good IMP RTs (let alone great ones!) is very, very difficult.  I don't know why, but it just is.  How often are we laughing at the pathetic OLs other (bad) teams put together?  That could be us now.

You're right that Gray sometimes blew his run blocks.  But I wouldn't say it was horrible.  Same with Hardrick, if he lets a guy blow by once a game, great, that's better than 90% of the other RTs.  He's a superb run blocker, washer, sealer.

If we field a meh RT, just watch to see what happens to Brady's run game.  All that money might mean nothing if we can't get those seals and blocks.  Half of Brady's success is just our OL.

[TecnoGenius]

I've decided not to panic for one simple reason: The Canadian Mafia has always bailed us out of catastrophic-looking OL problems.

Remember when Chungh left?  Freaking out was pointless, the next guy (Neufeld?) stepped in and we didn't even miss him.

Remember when Bond left?  We finally filled the G spot with a NAT and we didn't miss him.

Remember when Goosen suddenly retired ("pulled a Richmond" haha), Couture (I think) stepped in and was even better.

Couture, in turn, leaves, and Ko-man steps up and is nearly as good.

Desjar leaves and it's panic time: Gray steps in and while not as good, was good enough to keep our OL top-3 in league.

Speller, Spooner, etc, guys who were in the pipe and signed elsewhere.  Not missed.

This current panic seems a bit worse because it's a OT, not an interior guy, but since they always come up with magic, I'll defer my panic... until Zach takes 6 sacks in week 1, because The Mafia has always shown they'll find a way.  So far.

[Jesse]

Haha, ya.  Reading my post again I think I nailed it: we know we need a vet(ish) at RT.  But surely many others on the FA list were better bets?  Or maybe Lofton is the only one who'd take our pittan$e?  Anyone we bring up on ELC will just be the next IMP dev guy.  (Ivy's kind of in a weird middle ground.)

Reading Yoshi's "guilty" presser, surely there was some way we could have met him in the middle?  I bet if we came within $50k of SSK we could have kept him.  Argh, aggravating.

Here's how I see it: if we had a readymade solution in a PR guy who we know can do it, or a cast-off who we know can do it and know we can get, or an already-here NAT we know can do it... then you let Yoshi walk.  If you don't have one of those things, and the alternative is panic chaos and sackfest, then why oh why don't you find the cheapest price you can keep Yoshi for?

Now I'm wondering about Richmond... what occurred first?  Did Richmond retire or did Yoshi agree to terms with SSK?  If Richmond retired after Yoshi's decision, then I'm calling shenanigans.  If Mafia had Richmond set as the solution then this is one big cluster.  If that happened, KW is fuming.

As for Lofton... I'm not sure Rice wouldn't be a better RT choice, though once again this may hint that money is critically low...

They knew Richmond was talking retirement after the season ended. He talked about it in his exit interviews. Bob Irving claims we wanted Yoshi to stay, and I'm sure he'd rather of stayed, the only conclusion I can draw is that Sask's offer was far and away better than what we could offer (if we were even able to make an offer becasue we were still working things out with Brady and Dalton).

[theaardvark]

Haha, ya.  Reading my post again I think I nailed it: we know we need a vet(ish) at RT.  But surely many others on the FA list were better bets?  Or maybe Lofton is the only one who'd take our pittan$e?  Anyone we bring up on ELC will just be the next IMP dev guy.  (Ivy's kind of in a weird middle ground.)

Reading Yoshi's "guilty" presser, surely there was some way we could have met him in the middle?  I bet if we came within $50k of SSK we could have kept him.  Argh, aggravating.

Here's how I see it: if we had a readymade solution in a PR guy who we know can do it, or a cast-off who we know can do it and know we can get, or an already-here NAT we know can do it... then you let Yoshi walk.  If you don't have one of those things, and the alternative is panic chaos and sackfest, then why oh why don't you find the cheapest price you can keep Yoshi for?

Now I'm wondering about Richmond... what occurred first?  Did Richmond retire or did Yoshi agree to terms with SSK?  If Richmond retired after Yoshi's decision, then I'm calling shenanigans.  If Mafia had Richmond set as the solution then this is one big cluster.  If that happened, KW is fuming.

As for Lofton... I'm not sure Rice wouldn't be a better RT choice, though once again this may hint that money is critically low...

Which of Oliviera or Schoen do you give up to sign Hardrick?  Just curious...

[Pete]

Which of Oliviera or Schoen do you give up to sign Hardrick?  Just curious...

Once we signed schoen id seriously would have considered releasing or trading Lawler. 285k would go a long way to signing a de or tackle.
We've spent more money on each of the offensive groups. Qb. Receivers and running back than any other team in the league.
On the positive it should make for exciting games

[TecnoGenius]

Which of Oliviera or Schoen do you give up to sign Hardrick?  Just curious...

I thought about that.  While Hardrick probably would have taken 40-50 less to stay here, in the end he got about 100 more.  That's crazy.  The best part of all this is we made SSK massively overpay for an IMP OL who has maybe 2 seasons left.  This'll hurt them elsewhere.

If I had to pick, I would have let Schoen walk.  That's who I was preparing mentally for losing.  We're all kind of shocked we retained him.

We have amazing receivers, even without Schoen.  We let Schoen walk and we still have Lawler, Demski, Bailey (who we'd be able to afford), Woli.  Add in the best ELC IMP we can find and we would have been fine.  Most teams have 1-2 placeholder receivers (whether IMP or NAT).  We could have lived with 1 (or gotten lucky in scouting).

The problem is you can't have placeholder OL.  One weak hoggie and they'll just stack and stunt that side and you do nothing but lose games and get QBs injured.

It may still work out, we may still get lucky at RT.  But the odds are against us.  I hope Schoen can run a lot of hot routes and take the crosser hits, because that's what we're going to need to do to get any passing yards with a weak RT.

On the bright side, Strevie can come in a lot if the heat is on and run it down their throats every which way.

[dd]

Streavie  is not super human. Yes he can run the ball aggressively, but I recall him hobbling at the end and playing through a lot of pain. His running style comes at a cost, and that cost is injury. I hope he plays an injury free season but doubt that that happens

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Streaked is not super human. Yes he can run the ball aggressively, but I recall him hobbling at the end and playing through a lot of pain. His running style comes at a cost, and that cost is injury. I hope he plays an injury free season but doubt that that happens

Yah he's not Mr. Invincible, he played the WSF against Calgary on an ankle so bad he could barely hobble back to the huddle. I did not support O'Shea's decision to ignore the obvious and keep him in the game that day.

[dd]

Ya playing through injury is a tricky thing. Most players will opt for pain killers and freezing vs being taken out of the game, and I understand that, been there, done that. Nobody holds a gun to a players head and forces him to stay in the game. Teams will have protocols to assess the injury and the player and make the decision whether he plays or not. The bombers did the same thing with bighill and schoen in last years grey cup

[Pigskin]

Apparently, Schoen and Bailey are still not 100%.

[Pete]

while this thread is concerned about oline solutions, a bigger problem is our dline, weve gone from the best in the league a few years ago to the potentially the second worst (next to elks)

[DM83]

A lot of players after injuries, never come back to pre-injury status. Bailey was a glue guy, but as a higher paid Import, he needed to get seperation.  Great team guy and real football player.  Maybe they bring him back when they cut Lawler?

[Jesse]

A lot of players after injuries, never come back to pre-injury status. Bailey was a glue guy, but as a higher paid Import, he needed to get seperation.  Great team guy and real football player.  Maybe they bring him back when they cut Lawler?

The way receiver contracts are going, we probably sign Lawler and Schoen next year for less than they're making now.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

The way receiver contracts are going, we probably sign Lawler and Schoen next year for less than they're making now.

Maybe Lawler, but Schoen signed at $230k which is a very fair price.  Unfortunately they will both be FA's next season, so unless signed early Walters can't control their asking price.

[Jesse]

Maybe Lawler, but Schoen signed at $230k which is a very fair price.  Unfortunately they will both be FA's next season, so unless signed early Walters can't control their asking price.

I mean the sum of their two salaries could be less in 2025 than it is in 2024.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

I mean the sum of their two salaries could be less in 2025 than it is in 2024.

If they make it to FA there's no guarantee that will be true, key is to lock up one on a multi-year deal before FA begins and decide whether they can afford to keep the other or not. Walters is spending too much money on the offence, at some point he needs to correct the imbalance.

[GCn19]

Streavie  is not super human. Yes he can run the ball aggressively, but I recall him hobbling at the end and playing through a lot of pain. His running style comes at a cost, and that cost is injury. I hope he plays an injury free season but doubt that that happens

Do you remember how he was hurt? Just asking because it wasn't because of his playing style.

[theaardvark]

If they make it to FA there's no guarantee that will be true, key is to lock up one on a multi-year deal before FA begins and decide whether they can afford to keep the other or not. Walters is spending too much money on the offence, at some point he needs to correct the imbalance.

Our WR situation might change next year.  This year, we did not have a recruit step up like Schoen did when he came.  One reason might be, there was no playing time, our WR corps was stacked.  Which might be why Sheed is not signed...

If we have the next Schoen show up this year, then we can move on from one of Lawler or Schoen.  And ride an ELC for a year again.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

Our WR situation might change next year.  This year, we did not have a recruit step up like Schoen did when he came.  One reason might be, there was no playing time, our WR corps was stacked.  Which might be why Sheed is not signed...

If we have the next Schoen show up this year, then we can move on from one of Lawler or Schoen.  And ride an ELC for a year again.

Recruit Ontaria Wilson looks very good, but expecting the next Schoen to show up is pretty unrealistic. Even Lawler took 2-3 years to begin to excel.  The Bombers have not offered a lot of job opportunities for new recruits in the last 4 years, this year looks different.

[TecnoGenius]

Do you remember how he was hurt? Just asking because it wasn't because of his playing style.

I'm not sure we ever figured out precisely what play busted Strevie's ankle.  There wasn't one thing you can point to.  But it almost certainly was one of his bull running scrambles up the middle and subsequent nasty tackle by some MLB or WILL.  He would take severe AH-level punishment in there, and QBs just can't do that for long.