Veterans who face a tough training camp challenge

[bwiser]

Who do you think are the veterans most in danger of losing their jobs? I think most of the positions are pretty safe particularly on offense. I think Liegghio and Winston Rose are in the most jeopardy. There are 24 Db's in camp so the Bombers are still looking to improve in the secondary. The other veteran who could be in some trouble is Kyrie Wilson if he hasn't recovered fully from a serious achilles injury.

[pjrocksmb]

Leggs and Rose make it.  Wilson depends on health but he is very good.  Just my 2 cents.

[kkc60]

it?s always interesting to kind of brainstorm names that could be at risk. of course injuries factor in, but it?s difficult to see really any surprise cuts. Leggs, Rose and Wilson are probably the three most realistic. Maybe Ricky Walker counts too? Although we really brought very little defensive tackle competition (outside of the canadian 4 + Adamson). Not too sure if Lawrence, Holm, Parker or Houston would qualify as surprises. All flashed but it?s a numbers game.

[Blue In BC]

We always bring in a ton of DB's so I wouldn't read too much into that. You need to have 2 or 3 on the PR and injuries in TC could move the depth chart upwards.

2022 injuries to Wilson and Houston could be roster issues both short and long term. If healthy, all is good. We don't know what their actual status is at the moment. I doubt Rose is at risk but maybe we find the next Alford, and DB careers are short.

I'd bet Leigghio is on the game day one roster. Obviously some fans want him cut already. We'll see how it goes.

Because of age and some new depth, I still wonder about Briggs whose performance slipped in 2022. Benson is another whose age could work against him. Both can still add value but it's not impossible a rookie Canadian is too good to allow to slip through the cracks.

Clements and Cole don't exactly have defined roles and rookies and or ratio decisions may push them off the roster. A rookie is more likely to be willing to sit on the PR.

McCrae: I like him but barring injury he won't be the starter or a DI. Tough call because I think he adds value if you can get him on the roster. How does he fit.

Agudosi: Similar to McCrae. How do you get him on the roster? Injury recovery status not known and I don't know if he's willing to sit on PR again.

Bombers could roster a couple of these players on the 1 game IR while seeing how newbies do. At some point a decision has to be made.

Some hard calls but roster size is limited, SMS is always an issue. 

[TecnoGenius]

Losing their jobs in TC, or during the season?

It seems clear WFC gives players their "injury mulligan" but if they have another big one we let them walk.  So that puts Wilson on the bubble.  He'll have to have a good year and stay pretty healthy.

I think Rose bounces back.  I'm not worried about him.  He was getting beat mentally, and was too aggressive.  He'll learn from that.  You need a couple of good vets in the DB field, especially with a lot of relatively young faces.

Really as for 3+ year WFC or 5+ year CFL vets there's really no starting IMP other than Wilson with a shot of getting cut out of TC, or really at all in-season.  The DIs and PRs on the other hand, especially recent acquisitions from other teams, always are at risk.  Lawrence and Darby are in that position.  Especially Lawrence.

I won't delve too much into vet NATs.  They kind of follow different rules and progressions.

Stable roster usually == success in the CFL.  That's a good thing.

[DM83]

We usually injured list the non- starters, if they will play at some point.

[Sec223]

I'm thinking this is the last year for a few vets. Father Time is knocking on the door. Fingers crossed no one ends their career with an injury.

[NewBlue]

I'm thinking this is the last year for a few vets. Father Time is knocking on the door. Fingers crossed no one ends their career with an injury.

Agree on all points.  Part of the process needs to be to find the young guys that can just soak up the game this year, and get more playing time next year.
Would love to see Bighill stick around with the club in a coaching position next year.

[Sir Blue and Gold]

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who need to have good camps or could be in trouble of outright release (might be bubble players depending how they show up to camp):
Kyrie Wilson
Marc Legghio
Winston Rose
Carlton Agudosi
Evan Holm

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who have serious competition for their starting spot:
Chris Kolankowski
Pat Neufeld
Rasheed Bailey
Jackson Jeffcoat

[Buck]

Clint Kent...oh wait..

[KINGCHARLES]

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who need to have good camps or could be in trouble of outright release (might be bubble players depending how they show up to camp):
Kyrie Wilson
Marc Legghio
Winston Rose
Carlton Agudosi
Evan Holm

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who have serious competition for their starting spot:
Chris Kolankowski
Pat Neufeld
Rasheed Bailey
Jackson Jeffcoat

I personally hope that Rose just had an "off" year, he struggled a bit with a foot/lower body injury  for the first 5-7 weeks of the season, and there was also a lot of moving pieces on defence last year due to injuries that affect the whole defensive style.
Neufeld....wasnt he a CFL all-star, yes Dobson might be able to play all interior positions but im not sure if you just swoop in and steal Neufelds spot.
Bailey, he took a massive pay cut compared to rumoured offers from other teams, i think the Bombers keep him no matter what. He's probably the best downfield blocking WR in the entire CFL and also arguably the best run blocking WR in the CFL, sometimes you can't teach/coach that ability.

Jeffcoat is an amazing compliment to Jefferson when healthy, he equally helps the entire healthy defence elevate their game. We need someone that can fill in and provide the same level play or better for when the Jeffs need rest or if Jeffcoat gets injured. Makes me think if someone was to have an amazing TC/preseason, Jeffcoat could be expendable (and i don't like the thought of him not being a Bomber)

[Sir Blue and Gold]

I personally hope that Rose just had an "off" year, he struggled a bit with a foot/lower body injury  for the first 5-7 weeks of the season, and there was also a lot of moving pieces on defence last year due to injuries that affect the whole defensive style.
Neufeld....wasnt he a CFL all-star, yes Dobson might be able to play all interior positions but im not sure if you just swoop in and steal Neufelds spot.
Bailey, he took a massive pay cut compared to rumoured offers from other teams, i think the Bombers keep him no matter what. He's probably the best downfield blocking WR in the entire CFL and also arguably the best run blocking WR in the CFL, sometimes you can't teach/coach that ability.

Jeffcoat is an amazing compliment to Jefferson when healthy, he equally helps the entire healthy defence elevate their game. We need someone that can fill in and provide the same level play or better for when the Jeffs need rest or if Jeffcoat gets injured. Makes me think if someone was to have an amazing TC/preseason, Jeffcoat could be expendable (and i don't like the thought of him not being a Bomber)

Totally agree on all counts. Probably all those vets are safe, like you say, but I can envision some 'what if scenarios' that are possible, such as:

- Rose comes in and has regressed further. Having already lost the boundary corner spot last year, he's an expensive field corner that could be beat out by younger/cheaper/faster. It's a relatively comfortable spot to play for a lot of new Americans.
- Dobson comes in big, strong and ready. Neufeld transitions to the best in-game emergency OL in the league (although the fact he can't play centre is problematic).
- Jeffcoat gets hurt in training camp (which would be unsurprising) and one of the young Americans shows promise. He starts the year on the one game IR and his younger, cheaper replacement delivers in the first few weeks of the season.
- Bailey, while a fantastic blocker, is beat out by a fantastic young American who is a much better overall receiver, cheaper, with tons of upside. Bailey starts the year on the 1 game IR and enters limbo land. Although the Bombers appreciate his team-friendly deal, there was a reason he was asked to sign it in the first place which is the truest indicator of the organization's perceived value of the player.

[the paw]

Totally agree on all counts. Probably all those vets are safe, like you say, but I can envision some 'what if scenarios' that are possible, such as:

- Rose comes in and has regressed further. Having already lost the boundary corner spot last year, he's an expensive field corner that could be beat out by younger/cheaper/faster. It's a relatively comfortable spot to play for a lot of new Americans.
- Dobson comes in big, strong and ready. Neufeld transitions to the best in-game emergency OL in the league (although the fact he can't play centre is problematic).
- Jeffcoat gets hurt in training camp (which would be unsurprising) and one of the young Americans shows promise. He starts the year on the one game IR and his younger, cheaper replacement delivers in the first few weeks of the season.
- Bailey, while a fantastic blocker, is beat out by a fantastic young American who is a much better overall receiver, cheaper, with tons of upside. Bailey starts the year on the 1 game IR and enters limbo land. Although the Bombers appreciate his team-friendly deal, there was a reason he was asked to sign it in the first place which is the truest indicator of the organization's perceived value of the player.

I think Dobson will eventually get Neufeld's spot, but I don't think its this year.  If he does, Neufeld will retire, I don't think he will be a sixth man.

Even if Jeffcoat gets hurt in camp, they probably carry him for the year.  Although that might be the writing on the wall. 

If anyone on planet Earth had any faith in Agudosi's durability, I don't think Bailey would have been re-signed.  I don't know how they are managing to pay all these receivers, but it seems pretty clear that once Schoen is off his rookie deal, it is hard to imagine a budget that retains him, Demski and Lawler.  So they have to be looking at all these new guys with an eye to next year.  And since they are looking, I agree that Bailey might not have a lot of wiggle room. 

[Blue In BC]

I think Dobson will eventually get Neufeld's spot, but I don't think its this year.  If he does, Neufeld will retire, I don't think he will be a sixth man.

Even if Jeffcoat gets hurt in camp, they probably carry him for the year.  Although that might be the writing on the wall. 

If anyone on planet Earth had any faith in Agudosi's durability, I don't think Bailey would have been re-signed.  I don't know how they are managing to pay all these receivers, but it seems pretty clear that once Schoen is off his rookie deal, it is hard to imagine a budget that retains him, Demski and Lawler.  So they have to be looking at all these new guys with an eye to next year.  And since they are looking, I agree that Bailey might not have a lot of wiggle room. 

Agudosi will initially be headed to the PR IMO. I don't see him beating out Bailey to start the season. As the season progresses, an injury or performance issue may change that. However, we may have some new contenders among the rookies. Injury history is certainly a possible issue.

Next year is next year. Sure we expect that SMS may come more into play with all the veterans we have. OTOH we could see some significant retirements on the OL and resulting SMS changes.

[Sir Blue and Gold]

I think Dobson will eventually get Neufeld's spot, but I don't think its this year.  If he does, Neufeld will retire, I don't think he will be a sixth man.

Even if Jeffcoat gets hurt in camp, they probably carry him for the year.  Although that might be the writing on the wall. 

If anyone on planet Earth had any faith in Agudosi's durability, I don't think Bailey would have been re-signed.  I don't know how they are managing to pay all these receivers, but it seems pretty clear that once Schoen is off his rookie deal, it is hard to imagine a budget that retains him, Demski and Lawler.  So they have to be looking at all these new guys with an eye to next year.  And since they are looking, I agree that Bailey might not have a lot of wiggle room. 

True - however keep in mind the salary cap increased $160,000 this off-season and will go up another $75,000 next season, followed by $100,000 increases in year 2025, 2026, and 2027. Players will also receive 25% of revenue (via the revenue sharing agreement) starting in 2024, and the CFL can reimburse how it sees fit, which possibly can be added to the cap. So if it felt like GMs were throwing a little more money around this off-season, they were (about $1.4M more). Assuming those with highest leverage take a disproportionate amount of the increases, then that money likely goes to QBs, star Americans (Lawler/Shoen) and actually good Canadians (Demski).

[Horseman]

I think Agudosi will end up on the 6 game too start the season, his injury isn't fully healed (wink, wink). I cannot see the Bombers placing him on the PR after the game he had last year, someone would just pick him off our PR (cough, Chris Jones, cough). As far a Neufeld is concerned, he is safe, as he can play all OL positions, including Center.

[Blue In BC]

I think Agudosi will end up on the 6 game too start the season, his injury isn't fully healed (wink, wink). I cannot see the Bombers placing him on the PR after the game he had last year, someone would just pick him off our PR (cough, Chris Jones, cough). As far a Neufeld is concerned, he is safe, as he can play all OL positions, including Center.

The catch with the 6 game IR is that he can't practice. He's on an ELC so he could just go on 1 game IR. That's if he looks good in TC and doesn't re-injure.

[pjrocksmb]

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who need to have good camps or could be in trouble of outright release (might be bubble players depending how they show up to camp):
Kyrie Wilson
Marc Legghio
Winston Rose
Carlton Agudosi
Evan Holm

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who have serious competition for their starting spot:
Chris Kolankowski
Pat Neufeld
Rasheed Bailey
Jackson Jeffcoat

All those vets make it (last three as starters) imo but a week or so into camp see what new studs can do.

Rose will rebound if healthy, same with Wilson.  Leggs will make it (few bumps along the way).  I think Holm.could develop into at least a good backup.

[Throw Long Bannatyne]

I think Agudosi will end up on the 6 game too start the season, his injury isn't fully healed (wink, wink). I cannot see the Bombers placing him on the PR after the game he had last year, someone would just pick him off our PR (cough, Chris Jones, cough). As far a Neufeld is concerned, he is safe, as he can play all OL positions, including Center.

Yep, the Lawler signing threw a spanner in the works, it knocks Agudosi and Bolo down a notch and I don't think either  would accept a PR assignment at this point in their career, nor should they when they could start for almost any other team in the league.  It could also put them in a jam to retain Schoen next season, I don't think they'll have the funds to pay two top-end receivers at the going rate.  An early season injury to a receiver may be a blessing in disguise, as long as it's not too serious.

[TecnoGenius]

Veterans (or at least players who played last year) who have serious competition for their starting spot:
Chris Kolankowski
Pat Neufeld
Rasheed Bailey
Jackson Jeffcoat

I think Ko-man is part of our long-term future.  I'm not sure we let him walk unless he becomes too expensive a la Couture / Desjar.  I don't see who can displace him.

Dobson is still the dev/#6 guy.  And don't sleep on Eli, but he's not a starting G at the moment: he's the insurance and could have a bright future.

Jeffcoat is as good as Willie.  There, I said it.  It wasn't true in '19, but it's true now.  He's as much a disruptor as Willie.  The only way Jeffcoat gets cut is if he keeps having his injury problems.  If I'm a QB, I'm fearing Jeffcoat.  Willie will sneak around and force a fumble but Jeffcoat will maim you.  All Jeffcoat needs is to go to the Willie how-to-not-get-hurt clinic.  Willie is like a cat, he always falls gracefully and never gets injured.

If we were ever dumb enough to cut a healthy Jeffcoat I can guarantee you Pinball and TOR would hire him the next day.

[NewBlue]

I think Ko-man is part of our long-term future.  I'm not sure we let him walk unless he becomes too expensive a la Couture / Desjar.  I don't see who can displace him.

Dobson is still the dev/#6 guy.  And don't sleep on Eli, but he's not a starting G at the moment: he's the insurance and could have a bright future.

Jeffcoat is as good as Willie.  There, I said it.  It wasn't true in '19, but it's true now.  He's as much a disruptor as Willie.  The only way Jeffcoat gets cut is if he keeps having his injury problems.  If I'm a QB, I'm fearing Jeffcoat.  Willie will sneak around and force a fumble but Jeffcoat will maim you.  All Jeffcoat needs is to go to the Willie how-to-not-get-hurt clinic.  Willie is like a cat, he always falls gracefully and never gets injured.

If we were ever dumb enough to cut a healthy Jeffcoat I can guarantee you Pinball and TOR would hire him the next day.

I think Eli is more the insurance at C than he is at G.  He was touted as one of the best C's in College. It'll likely take him some time to get back into game shape, so he could likely start on PR

[Sir Blue and Gold]

I think Ko-man is part of our long-term future.  I'm not sure we let him walk unless he becomes too expensive a la Couture / Desjar.  I don't see who can displace him.

Dobson is still the dev/#6 guy.  And don't sleep on Eli, but he's not a starting G at the moment: he's the insurance and could have a bright future.

Jeffcoat is as good as Willie.  There, I said it.  It wasn't true in '19, but it's true now.  He's as much a disruptor as Willie.  The only way Jeffcoat gets cut is if he keeps having his injury problems.  If I'm a QB, I'm fearing Jeffcoat.  Willie will sneak around and force a fumble but Jeffcoat will maim you.  All Jeffcoat needs is to go to the Willie how-to-not-get-hurt clinic.  Willie is like a cat, he always falls gracefully and never gets injured.

If we were ever dumb enough to cut a healthy Jeffcoat I can guarantee you Pinball and TOR would hire him the next day.

Asotui Eli is a natural centre and is why I put Chris Kolankowski on the serious competition list -- he's not a guard. Eli has the better pedigree, is way more naturally talented but has also been out of the game a full season. If he's in shape and ready it could be an easy decision, if not, he may need more time but if healthy he's going to win the starting spot eventually, in my opinion.

You may say Jeffcoat is a good as Jefferson but that is incorrect. By any measure, Jefferson is the better player. That doesn't mean Jeffcoat is bad, he's a great player - when healthy - but he hasn't been healthy since 2021 and contemplated retirement this off-season. He gets hurt again in TC or early in the season and it's hard to see him surviving especially if his replacement can perform half decently. You could make the argument that had we found a decent import DE last year he wouldn't even be at camp this year.

Dobson is a development guy until he's not. I think fairly highly of him and he's had enough seasoning to play. Whether he outright beats someone in camp (Neufeld probably, if that scenario plays out, probably somewhat unlikely) or he takes over after an injury is anyone's guess but I think he's a starter one way or another very soon.

[Waffler]

If I'm a QB, I'm fearing Jeffcoat.  Willie will sneak around and force a fumble but Jeffcoat will maim you.

As I see it too. Jefferson makes plays but doesn't put you out of the game. Jeffcoat will.