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Author Topic: Back up Qb's  (Read 4789 times)
theaardvark
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« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2020, 03:58:26 PM »

Signing Collaros pretty much cemented our need for an experienced backup. This is extreme common sense. Scouts (even great ones) don't find you year one starting QBs.

Which is why McGuire, in his second year, with a full year working in Buck's system, with Buck, is so important.  You don't need to spend extra money bringing in a guy that needs to learn the system, when he's probably 3rd on the depth chart.  You can have a rookie filling that spot, and should injury happen, there will be a number of options available when that happens, and we will have SMS to do it. 
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TBURGESS
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« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2020, 04:38:53 PM »

You miss my point, again.  We don't "keep money back", we save from paying money to a QB that has proven they are not starter material...  if you sign any of the QB's suggested, it will not be for league min, PR, or the like.  It will be for a decent wage, because they "have experience".  I just don't think we need to invest in that when we have McGuire in the backup role, and will have new ELC/PR paid arms in camp.

Maybe I'm just snakebit over the last "veteran backup" we signed as a FA...

Franklin won't come cheap, or without a signing bonus...  rather than lock in at a cheap rate, he'd be smart to wait for injury opportunity...
The only thing we'd save is signing bonus money. None of Franklin, Pipkin or even McGuire have proven they aren't starter material yet. It doesn't matter if we sign a QB for league minimum or not. If we get Streveler back, we'll cut that guy anyway and give his whole salary to Chris. 

The only advantage to going cheap is we save some signing bonus. The huge downside is the lack of experience.
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Doublezero
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« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2020, 04:49:41 PM »

Sure bring in some competition but Bombers very obviously like McGuire and you can't discount the experience he had last year, dressing for 18 games on a Grey Cup winner. That winning experience goes a long way. Here's what it says about him on the Bombers website:

McGuire put up spectacular numbers during his days with the University of Western Illinois Fighting Leathernecks, and left as the school?s all-time leader in passing yards (9,819), passing touchdowns (72), completions (771) and attempts (1,291). His 9,819 passing yards ranks second all-time in the history of the Missouri Valley Football Conference. McGuire was named the school?s Male Senior Athlete of the Year in 2018 and was an Honorable Mention All-Missouri Valley Conference player in 2016 and 2017.
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theaardvark
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« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2020, 05:04:17 PM »

The only thing we'd save is signing bonus money. None of Franklin, Pipkin or even McGuire have proven they aren't starter material yet. It doesn't matter if we sign a QB for league minimum or not. If we get Streveler back, we'll cut that guy anyway and give his whole salary to Chris. 

The only advantage to going cheap is we save some signing bonus. The huge downside is the lack of experience.

Signing bonus is hard cost, and lost if the player doesn't stick with the team.  Salary for any mentioned QB will not be near what McGuire makes, or a new rookie coming in.  And none have proven they can play in our system, for our team, any more than a rookie coming in.

So, signing bonus and salary are going to be substantial SMS hits over McGuire + recruits.  The question is, will we be more of a GC contender with Pipkin coming in if injury happens, or with McGuire? 

You aren't breaking camp with McGuire + a mentioned "backup with experience".  Not with the 2 QB roster. 
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Throw Long Bannatyne
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« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2020, 05:10:06 PM »

Sure bring in some competition but Bombers very obviously like McGuire and you can't discount the experience he had last year, dressing for 18 games on a Grey Cup winner. That winning experience goes a long way. Here's what it says about him on the Bombers website:

McGuire put up spectacular numbers during his days with the University of Western Illinois Fighting Leathernecks, and left as the school?s all-time leader in passing yards (9,819), passing touchdowns (72), completions (771) and attempts (1,291). His 9,819 passing yards ranks second all-time in the history of the Missouri Valley Football Conference. McGuire was named the school?s Male Senior Athlete of the Year in 2018 and was an Honorable Mention All-Missouri Valley Conference player in 2016 and 2017.

Every professional QB that plays at "Nowhere college" located in "Nowheresville" presents the exact same resume of incredible achievements, doesn't seem to mean much.
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blue_or_die
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« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2020, 05:32:41 PM »

What I'm hoping happens is we sign an experienced guy but we treat McGuire like a #2. If Collaros is out for a sizable amount of time, I want to see McGuire take his lumps and see if he can run our offense. If he can't catch on, then we revert to the other, more known QB.

Of course, that could change if things turn black and white during camp as to who shows better. I can't say I'd maintain my opinion if, say, Pipkin absolutely schools McGuire in camp or something.

I obviously don't want to throw away the season, but I am very interested in seeing who our future will be.
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TBURGESS
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« Reply #21 on: February 03, 2020, 05:42:56 PM »

Signing bonus is hard cost, and lost if the player doesn't stick with the team.  Salary for any mentioned QB will not be near what McGuire makes, or a new rookie coming in.  And none have proven they can play in our system, for our team, any more than a rookie coming in.

So, signing bonus and salary are going to be substantial SMS hits over McGuire + recruits.  The question is, will we be more of a GC contender with Pipkin coming in if injury happens, or with McGuire? 

You aren't breaking camp with McGuire + a mentioned "backup with experience".  Not with the 2 QB roster. 
What kind of signing bonus do you think Franklin or Pipkin will get? IMO it would be pretty low considering they are trying to resurrect their careers, not substantial as you seem to think. They aren't getting big salaries either and salary part is moot anyway as they'd be cut if Streveler came back. In any case bonus + salary to greatly reduce risk is a good thing, not a bad thing.

No QB who hasn't played in our system can prove that they can play in our system. That's not a reason not to sign any QB. If it was, then we wouldn't have signed any QB from any other team in the past. The last Bomber QB of note, who originally came from our system, was Brock back in the mid 70's.

Because of Collaros' injury history, I expect we'll have 3 QB's, not just Collaros + a backup. The #2 guy will need to be able to win games at the CFL level. McGuire hasn't even started a game, let alone won one. The other QB's mentioned have.

You're ignoring the huge risk of going with Collaros, McGuire plus another unknown QB.
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3rdand1.5
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« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2020, 05:48:33 PM »

My 2 cents are, it would be foolish to not have a back-up plan. Starting QB's get injured, it happens. I don't know if Mc Quire is a viable back-up he has thrown all of what 1 professional pass. If we do not sign another QB with some CFL experience it's a gamble for sure. My caveat is that one or more of the guys on the above list may still be available week 1,2,3 etc. if we need.

Very interesting offseason, we are not going into camp with Nichols or Strevelor and without LaPo?

I can't wait to see how this offence does this year?
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theaardvark
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« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2020, 08:03:16 PM »

What kind of signing bonus do you think Franklin or Pipkin will get? IMO it would be pretty low considering they are trying to resurrect their careers, not substantial as you seem to think. They aren't getting big salaries either and salary part is moot anyway as they'd be cut if Streveler came back. In any case bonus + salary to greatly reduce risk is a good thing, not a bad thing.

No QB who hasn't played in our system can prove that they can play in our system. That's not a reason not to sign any QB. If it was, then we wouldn't have signed any QB from any other team in the past. The last Bomber QB of note, who originally came from our system, was Brock back in the mid 70's.

Because of Collaros' injury history, I expect we'll have 3 QB's, not just Collaros + a backup. The #2 guy will need to be able to win games at the CFL level. McGuire hasn't even started a game, let alone won one. The other QB's mentioned have.

You're ignoring the huge risk of going with Collaros, McGuire plus another unknown QB.

Not ignoring risk, just saying you don't need to pay for a replacement until the bulb burns out.  There will be plenty of veteran, serviceable arms available all season long.  In the meantime, we can save some cash, and try to develop the next Streveler, or Arbuckle, or Evans (if McGuire isn't already that, in which case, we need a new McGuire)

Buck, Collaros and McGuire have time together... bring in a mentioned QB,and they will assume they are ahead of McGuire, and might rightly be based on experience.  I don't want to put McGuire behind anyone but Collaros in reps received. 

Any QB off the scrap heap is, in my opinion, proven to fail.  Why do you want to pay a premium for experience, if all that experience has done is shown their deficiencies.

 
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Pigskin
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« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2020, 08:05:40 PM »

I am okay with Collaros and McGuire, but if we could land MBT I would be happy with that also.
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Sec227
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« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2020, 08:11:09 PM »

No way Nichols is coming back. Ships sailed, hurt feelings etc. Even his landing spot is murky at the moment.
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booch
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« Reply #26 on: February 03, 2020, 08:11:20 PM »

Yeah...I agree...we hopefully get McGuire meaningful reps like Strev got during the season as we go along...If/when Zack goes down, well it's McGuire's job to hold down the fort, and there will be at least one of, if not multiple arms with experience..Pipkin..Franklin..Jennings..Bridge..MBT..if not more licking around to be signed as McGuire's back-up, or his replacement if he really...Reeeaally falters...no need to tie up experienced qb back-up money in your SMS if not needed..especially in the odd chance we get someone back from NFL

The way this team is built, and the vet expoerience on offence, and solid O-line we just need McGuire to not be stupid and play outside himself
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theaardvark
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« Reply #27 on: February 03, 2020, 08:37:06 PM »

I am okay with Collaros and McGuire, but if we could land MBT I would be happy with that also.

MBT was here, so we know first hand about him... if Buck thinks he's worth bringing in, I'm sure Walters would do so.   He did show some positives, but I just wasn't sold on him.  He did beat Franklin out...  but i think if he's available, Tor will keep him, even if they sign Nichols.. they might not even sign Nichols, and keep MBT and give him the year...
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Pigskin
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« Reply #28 on: February 03, 2020, 09:05:09 PM »

MBT over 4,000 yards passing and 26 TD's, on a pretty crappy team.

Anyone that attended a bomber practice can tell you that McGuire has a very good arm. At 6-2, 220, he has good size, and seems to run well.
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booch
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« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2020, 09:08:58 PM »

MBT over 4,000 yards passing and 26 TD's, on a pretty crappy team.

Anyone that attended a bomber practice can tell you that McGuire has a very good arm. At 6-2, 220, he has good size, and seems to run well.

He definately has the best arm and makes all the throws with ease...best arm I seen on Bomber roster in recent memory to be honest
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