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Author Topic: Biggest Surprises  (Read 3892 times)
GCn19
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« Reply #30 on: September 19, 2019, 04:21:57 PM »

To me, this brings up the fact that Walters has done a magnificent job of managing the Bombers since his inception of getting the GM portfolio.  We are very fortunate to have him.  Keep up the good work Mr. Walters.

KW has had quite a few years to do so. We had some stinker years early in his tenure as he started the rebuild and to date have exactly zero GCs in his tenure. Soooo...magnificent may be overstating it a bit.
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Throw Long Bannatyne
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« Reply #31 on: September 19, 2019, 04:57:08 PM »

because it's a complete fallacy that a QB needs to carry a clipboard by 3+ years to be any good...you need to be smart, able to read a defense, be decisive, and have a strong arm...  oh, and one more thing... the starting QB to get hurt so you can actually get a chance to play... it's not as complicated as people would like to believe...

Wasn't that way in the past, for the most part QB's put in their time as backups and rarely got a fair shot at the starting job in their first two years. BLM made one of the quickest transitions to starting QB that I can remember and it took him 1-1/2 years, signed with the Stamps in 2012 and became the starter midway through 2013.  QB's like Darian Durant took 4 years to earn the position, which was not unusual at the time.
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BBRT
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« Reply #32 on: September 19, 2019, 05:39:33 PM »

KW has had quite a few years to do so. We had some stinker years early in his tenure as he started the rebuild and to date have exactly zero GCs in his tenure. Soooo...magnificent may be overstating it a bit.

That's how I see it also. Would give KW passing marks but until he gets the Bombers to the Grey Cup only giving him passing grades. Maybe C+ Maybe!
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GCn19
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« Reply #33 on: September 19, 2019, 05:50:23 PM »

That's how I see it also. Would give KW passing marks but until he gets the Bombers to the Grey Cup only giving him passing grades. Maybe C+ Maybe!

I like the team he's built and feel he can significantly upgrade his mark this season if all continues to go well. However, GCs are the measurement of success in the CFL.
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Blue In Edmonton
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« Reply #34 on: September 19, 2019, 06:02:49 PM »

Add to the list of surprises that in the year of the backup QB, Mike Reilly is the last QB standing. Edmonton has announced that Logan Kilgore will start for them this week.
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ichabod_crane
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« Reply #35 on: September 19, 2019, 07:56:02 PM »

You obviously didn't see how many bad QB's Montreal had post AC. Or for that matter the number of QB's Winnipeg has had in the last 20 years that were horrible,

The "legend" TJ Rubley! ..... the forgettable Jeff Reinbold era.

Michael Bishop had an arm where he could throw a ball through a closed barn door but had no accuracy and was an interception machine.......the forgettable Mike Kelly era! Wink

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blue girl
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« Reply #36 on: September 19, 2019, 09:54:36 PM »

The "legend" TJ Rubley! ..... the forgettable Jeff Reinbold era.

Michael Bishop had an arm where he could throw a ball through a closed barn door but had no accuracy and was an interception machine.......the forgettable Mike Kelly era! Wink


Also Mike Kelly's original answer at QB Stefan LeFors.
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TecnoGenius
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« Reply #37 on: September 20, 2019, 06:20:46 AM »

Add to the list of surprises that in the year of the backup QB, Mike Reilly is the last QB standing. Edmonton has announced that Logan Kilgore will start for them this week.

Yup, it's official now!  So when do we start laying bets on when Reilly gets injured enough to go on the IR?  Surely in a year like this it's got to be all or nothing.
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GCn19
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« Reply #38 on: September 20, 2019, 11:01:26 AM »

The "legend" TJ Rubley! ..... the forgettable Jeff Reinbold era.

Michael Bishop had an arm where he could throw a ball through a closed barn door but had no accuracy and was an interception machine.......the forgettable Mike Kelly era! Wink



Reinbold did bring in one really good looking QB recruit, Jay Walker. The guy started one or two games at the end of one season and did incredibly well and we were unable to re-sign him the next year because he wanted Dunigan money.
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Blue In BC
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« Reply #39 on: September 20, 2019, 02:04:35 PM »

Reinbold did bring in one really good looking QB recruit, Jay Walker. The guy started one or two games at the end of one season and did incredibly well and we were unable to re-sign him the next year because he wanted Dunigan money.

Yes I remember Walker and he did look good for those few games. That being said Dinwiddie and Elliott looked good for a brief time as well.

It's not uncommon for a rookie to appear to be a good prospect. The reality is that it's very unusual for it to not take a few seasons to learn the pro game. That's true in both the CFL and NFL at most positions.

The jump from college to pro game is a learning curve for most.

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bluebeard
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« Reply #40 on: September 20, 2019, 03:02:32 PM »

KW has had quite a few years to do so. We had some stinker years early in his tenure as he started the rebuild and to date have exactly zero GCs in his tenure. Soooo...magnificent may be overstating it a bit.
You are probably right that I did get carried away but you have to remember that as an assistant GM, Walters did not have the authority to mold the Bombers.  He did not have the final word.  Also, when he finally did get the GM position, he inherited a train wreck. Slowly and patiently he build what we have today. No GC yet but one hell'va team.  I can see this team being the Calgary Stamps of the future...but that's me I guess.
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Blue In BC
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« Reply #41 on: September 20, 2019, 04:18:19 PM »

You are probably right that I did get carried away but you have to remember that as an assistant GM, Walters did not have the authority to mold the Bombers.  He did not have the final word.  Also, when he finally did get the GM position, he inherited a train wreck. Slowly and patiently he build what we have today. No GC yet but one hell'va team.  I can see this team being the Calgary Stamps of the future...but that's me I guess.

Hard to know. Calgary has been a team that has found and developed their own rookies. OTOH Winnipeg has been a team that has signed new talent more in free agency. Either process can work or fail.

In the new CBA ( 1 year deals as options for vets ) there seems to be more changes to every teams roster each season. I think we have nearly half of our starters as new starters in 2019. Several were with the team last year but not starters that have moved up as others moved out.

Others are veteran free agents or a few rookies either drafted or scouted. We'll go into 2020 with another long list of potential free agents. I think we'll be able to retain most but who really knows.

As good as this team is, the team in 2020 could be the same, better or worse. I wouldn't bet against an even better team. In particular due to the development of 2019 draft choices. It all starts with the Canadians and we've got some good ones.

If we lose some talented imports during the off season we'll make the necessary changes. Winnipeg is going to be a destination choice for some top talent IMO.

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GCn19
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« Reply #42 on: September 20, 2019, 05:45:29 PM »

Hard to know. Calgary has been a team that has found and developed their own rookies. OTOH Winnipeg has been a team that has signed new talent more in free agency. Either process can work or fail.

In the new CBA ( 1 year deals as options for vets ) there seems to be more changes to every teams roster each season. I think we have nearly half of our starters as new starters in 2019. Several were with the team last year but not starters that have moved up as others moved out.

Others are veteran free agents or a few rookies either drafted or scouted. We'll go into 2020 with another long list of potential free agents. I think we'll be able to retain most but who really knows.

As good as this team is, the team in 2020 could be the same, better or worse. I wouldn't bet against an even better team. In particular due to the development of 2019 draft choices. It all starts with the Canadians and we've got some good ones.

If we lose some talented imports during the off season we'll make the necessary changes. Winnipeg is going to be a destination choice for some top talent IMO.



For sure.

You are probably right that I did get carried away but you have to remember that as an assistant GM, Walters did not have the authority to mold the Bombers.  He did not have the final word.  Also, when he finally did get the GM position, he inherited a train wreck. Slowly and patiently he build what we have today. No GC yet but one hell'va team.  I can see this team being the Calgary Stamps of the future...but that's me I guess.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not suggesting that Walters has done a poor job either. If I were to give a grade right now though, I wouldn't rate him A-F, just simply IC (incomplete) with the possibility he can earn an A.
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66 Chevelle
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« Reply #43 on: September 21, 2019, 06:18:15 PM »

You obviously didn't see how many bad QB's Montreal had post AC. Or for that matter the number of QB's Winnipeg has had in the last 20 years that were horrible,

you are correct, only season 3 for me... but, I'd be willing to bet that those you are referring to... it wouldn't have matter how many years they carried that clipboard, they were never going to make the grade in the first place...

I wouldn't go as far as to say that there isn't any value in a rookie QB having the luxury of carrying that clipboard for a year to get acclimated to the game... but I be willing to bet that until they find out they can't, they'll believe they can make every throw... it's the nature of the beast...

but, beyond a year, you're just waiting for a good QB in front of you to get hurt, move on, or retire... after a year, they will only get better by playing the game...
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Blue In BC
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« Reply #44 on: September 21, 2019, 06:43:31 PM »

you are correct, only season 3 for me... but, I'd be willing to bet that those you are referring to... it wouldn't have matter how many years they carried that clipboard, they were never going to make the grade in the first place...

I wouldn't go as far as to say that there isn't any value in a rookie QB having the luxury of carrying that clipboard for a year to get acclimated to the game... but I be willing to bet that until they find out they can't, they'll believe they can make every throw... it's the nature of the beast...

but, beyond a year, you're just waiting for a good QB in front of you to get hurt, move on, or retire... after a year, they will only get better by playing the game...

I've been watching for nearly 60 years so I've seen what's happened over a long period. Some QB's have gotten playing time early due to injuries to starters. In some cases I've seen starting QB's go down in TC and lost for the season.

Backs got to play. In some cases it was year 1 and for others it may have been year 2, 3 or 4.

The point is that there is no guaranteed time for how long it takes to develop of if they develop.

History shows very few QB's are ready year 1. Many survive for many seasons as back ups with limited playing time and never develop into starting QB's.

Ex Winnipeg QB's Dom Davis is a perfect  example. Brian Bennett is another. Both have struggled and / or been passed on the depth charts of their respective teams.


Even A. Calvillo who started in his 1st season in the Las Vegas expansion team wasn't that good. He went to Hamilton for a couple more seasons and they didn't re-sign him. It wasn't until he went to Montreal where he became a good QB probably around his 5th CFL season. Then he progressed to possibly the best CFL QB of all time.

We can even look at Streveler who's shown some talent but also struggles in the passing game. He's still a work in progress that may turn out to have a long career. He's had more real game time than most 2nd season QB's.

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