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Author Topic: XFL will be putting CFL rule into play  (Read 1624 times)
66 Chevelle
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« on: April 23, 2019, 06:39:51 PM »

Read earlier today that the XFL will being using the CFL's "5 yard halo" rule on punt returns to help protect returners... 

I like the rule but have began to grow weary of kick returns as a whole... after all, it seems that on every kick return, punt or kick off, there is always a penalty... holding, block in the back, 5 yards, etc...

I was watching Good Morning Football a few weeks ago and they were interviewing some NFL player and they asked him if he ever got nervous before a game. He said no, that it wasn't an issue with him, then added that he did in college... he said he was a returner in college and even though he didn't get nervous before the game, he'd always get a little worked up right before a return... he said something to the effect of 'you don't have any idea how much steam a defender builds running full speed at you like they do'... said he doesn't miss that part of his game now that he's in the NFL... makes sense, maybe that's why you can see normally sure handed receivers bobble punts from time to time...

Also heard that they may be picking up 4 of the AAF teams to expand their league to 12 teams... I'm sure they are merely considering putting a new team into the markets of 4 now defunct AAF team locations that had a respectable fan base...
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Stretch
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« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2019, 06:55:21 PM »

I'd be interested to see the following stats from the NFL:

% of kickoffs caught and returned
% of kickoffs resulting in a touchback (either caught and downed or go into/through the end zone)

% of punts caught and returned
% of punts fair caught
% of punts downed by the kicking team
% of punts resulting in a touchback

It seems like hardly any of either are returned anymore so I'd like to see if the numbers back up that assumption.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2019, 07:15:14 PM by Stretch » Logged

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66 Chevelle
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« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2019, 11:56:02 PM »

ask and ye shall receive, lol...

2018 NFL Kicking stats:

KICK OFF

Kick Offs                   2,043
Touch Backs              1,298
Out of Bounds                14
Return TDs                      5
Onside Kicks                  36
Onside Recover                3
Kick Off Ret Yds       16,915

PUNTING

Punts                     2,198
Punts Blocked              16
Touch Backs               151
Inside 20                   837
Fair Catch                  601
Returned                    908
Return TDs                    7
Punt Ret Yds            7,690
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66 Chevelle
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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2019, 12:09:59 AM »

what I could find on penalties...

Roughing the Kicker             8
Running into Kicker              8
Illegal Touched Kick             8
Fair Catch Interference         5
Kick Off Catch Interf             5
Illegal Downfield Kick           7
Player OOB on Kick              6

this is kind of a catch all for SPECIAL TEAMS as a total because they didn't have penalties such as Illegal Block, Holding, etc, separated by activity, so....

Special Teams Penalties          577
Penalty Yards                      5,036
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bomber4life85
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« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2019, 03:27:40 AM »

I?m a bit surprised at ?only? 601 fair catches it seems they do it more often  but i guess just under a third of the time is quite a bit.
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TecnoGenius
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« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2019, 04:17:36 AM »

Read earlier today that the XFL will being using the CFL's "5 yard halo" rule on punt returns to help protect returners... 

I like the rule but have began to grow weary of kick returns as a whole... after all, it seems that on every kick return, punt or kick off, there is always a penalty... holding, block in the back, 5 yards, etc...

5 yard rule is great, glad to see it in the XFL.  Fair catch is the rule I hate most in the NFL.

I think kick returns are one of the best parts of the CFL.  They make kicks interesting and exciting, as every punt could be a return for TD.  Edge-of-your-seat stuff.  Compare that with the NFL where kicks are basically go-get-a-beer times.

I never hear players in the CFL complain about return duties.  In fact, the great returners revel in it: they are severely disappointed when the kick goes OOB or is unreturnable.

If safety became a big problem, make it 10 yards instead of 5.  I could also see a rule that makes a 25 yard penalty and disquali if a tackler gets no yards and blatantly, devastatingly whacks the returner.  I've never seen such a thing in the modern CFL (thankfully), but I could see some nasty player/team thinking 15 yards is a small price to pay for permanently taking out a league-star returner.
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BlueInCgy
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« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2019, 08:34:46 AM »

5 yard rule is great, glad to see it in the XFL.  Fair catch is the rule I hate most in the NFL.

I think kick returns are one of the best parts of the CFL.  They make kicks interesting and exciting, as every punt could be a return for TD.  Edge-of-your-seat stuff.  Compare that with the NFL where kicks are basically go-get-a-beer times.

I never hear players in the CFL complain about return duties.  In fact, the great returners revel in it: they are severely disappointed when the kick goes OOB or is unreturnable.

If safety became a big problem, make it 10 yards instead of 5.  I could also see a rule that makes a 25 yard penalty and disquali if a tackler gets no yards and blatantly, devastatingly whacks the returner.  I've never seen such a thing in the modern CFL (thankfully), but I could see some nasty player/team thinking 15 yards is a small price to pay for permanently taking out a league-star returner.


Pretty sure that Vince instituted the 5 yard rule the first time around as well.

As far as brutal hits on kicks go, I remember Brian Clark absolutely destroying a returner who was in the process of fielding a kick in the air.  Not that he was the type of guy who would deliberately intend to injure, but they have happened.
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Waffler
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« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2019, 11:15:51 AM »

As far as brutal hits on kicks go, I remember Brian Clark absolutely destroying a returner who was in the process of fielding a kick in the air.  Not that he was the type of guy who would deliberately intend to injure, but they have happened.

I think this is the play that is responsible for the 15 yard penalty, previously all were 5 yards. Players were starting to be coached to ignore it and take the 5 if I recall.
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GCn19
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« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2019, 01:23:13 PM »

I think this is the play that is responsible for the 15 yard penalty, previously all were 5 yards. Players were starting to be coached to ignore it and take the 5 if I recall.

You are correct. The 15 yard no yards is the Brian Clark rule.
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dd
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« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2019, 09:57:33 PM »

The Brian Clark rule is 2 fold--there is a 15 yard penalty for being within the 5 yard halo and catching the ball in the air, PLUS, there's a 15 yard penalty for Unneccessary roughness/smoking the returner when he catches the ball and you're within the 5 yard halo, so within 5 and contact gets you 30 yards in penalties
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TecnoGenius
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2019, 04:40:03 AM »

The Brian Clark rule is 2 fold--there is a 15 yard penalty for being within the 5 yard halo and catching the ball in the air, PLUS, there's a 15 yard penalty for Unneccessary roughness/smoking the returner when he catches the ball and you're within the 5 yard halo, so within 5 and contact gets you 30 yards in penalties

I didn't know that!  That explains a lot.  Great rule.  Now I know why we don't see smoked-NY-returners more often.  30y would be painful.  And nowadays you'd get a fine from the league to boot.

Didn't know the Clark stuff either.  That's why I come to this place!  What year was the Clark hit?  Details on google are scarce (and no video).  Who did he hit?
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Stats Junkie
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« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2019, 11:01:53 PM »

All's fair in punts and war: A devastating tackle revives old debate:
Ullrich, Lowell. The Province; Vancouver, B.C. 14 Aug 2002:

A third-quarter hit by Blue Bombers' special teams tackler Brian Clark on B.C.'s Geroy Simon nearly sent the Lions punt returner into a new career.

Clark bulldozed into Simon as he awaited a bouncing football without regard to the mandated five-yard restraining zone.

The penalty: Twenty yards, 15 of which was assessed for rough play. Clark was not ejected.

Days later, Simon has let the play pass, after an apology from his former Winnipeg teammate.

"I still do think it was a cheap shot. It was a helmet-to-helmet hit and it looked on the tape that he accelerated into me," Simon said. "You just can't harp on it."

The CFL knows it's also a little more dangerous, which is why there are two degrees of no-yards penalties.

A 15-yard infraction is assessed if a returner catches the ball on the fly and is hit in the restraining zone.

To avoid that, according to some players, coaches instruct tacklers to deliberately take the five-yard penalty if the ball bounces to avoid a big return.

"You don't know if the ball is going to come bouncing towards you," said special teams co-captain Kelly Lochbaum. "When I was in Calgary [coach Wally Buono] always told me 'just go blast him.' "

Clark blasted Simon, and Bombers coach Dave Ritchie reacted predictably, ripping officials over the rough play yardage that came with the violation.

"It doesn't matter the degree of a tackle. It's a tackle," he said.



The extra 15 yard penalty was assessed on this play. Since then, the CFL has mandated that a 25 yard penalty (with ejection) could also be applied in this circumstance (instead of the 15 yard penalty).
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TecnoGenius
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« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2019, 03:20:15 AM »

The extra 15 yard penalty was assessed on this play. Since then, the CFL has mandated that a 25 yard penalty (with ejection) could also be applied in this circumstance (instead of the 15 yard penalty).

Thanks for the story and digging that up!

Here's a great example of the CFL getting a rule right (as they do more often than not).  And I don't think we've seen a horrible NY hit since, have we?

Love the CFL kicking game.  Love how CFL leads the world in keeping the kick game exciting.  Now... can WPG find a star returner in '19?
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