Is it safe to say we're now designed as a mostly-O focused team since 2023?
Basically when we brought Kenny back in 2023 at league-top-WR-salary, and gave Demski a massive bump, and Zach a big bump, and paid up to retain Woli and Bailey, we decided the WFC path was going to be O-focused.
And we doubled down in 2024 with the massive contracts to keep Schoen and Brady. The only skill guy we let walk on O was Bailey, and that was only deemed ok because he was just plain good, not superstar good.
Add to the above skill positions the fact that we also put a lot of money into our OL, even with the much-weakened 2024 lineup. We may not be spending what we did in 2023, but we're probably still spending more than league average.
My point is this: We clearly planned around out-scoring opponents to win games. And I don't mean getting 22 when they get 21: I mean putting up between 35 and 45 points consistently every game. And it didn't seem too much to ask, because we've pretty much been doing that for at least 2 seasons straight. With all the talent retention, we were banking on that lopsided O production.
And then it wouldn't matter if our D was much weaker than previous years, or that or DL was suddenly below league average, or our DBs had tons of rookies and sophomores. I truly believe this was all discussed by The Canadian Mafia, and it was all planned this way as a conscious choice to make the best use of our SMS constraints and already-here talent base. (Ask yourself, when's the last time we bagged a huge D name in FA? Willie in 2019? Holy smokes!)
Given all of the above, the only way we're going to consistently win games is if our O does what it's designed to do: put up the huge numbers. And if our O isn't doing this, I posit that we should ignore the D personnel problems and use all available resources to fix what ails the O. And nothing should be off the table.
If the weakened OL isn't going to get up to snuff pronto, try the backups; if they can't do it, try a couch sitter; if they can't do it try 3 IMP OL. Even if we want to stick with 2 IMP OL, why not just try 3 for one game so we can see how much of the overall problem is OL vs skill positions?
If the rookie WRs aren't getting the job done or are turtling, bench them. There's always FA couch sitters milling around this time of year. Give one a call. I don't care if it's an older guy. Some experience might help get some completions. Heck, if no one is out there, make a trade.
And can Kenny play with a cast like D players do? If this is even remotely "a thing", get him out there and give him gut and over-the-shoulder passes. If our O is designed around Kenny taking $300k, then we can't sit there waiting for 8+ weeks thinking rookies can do what Kenny does. We need a solution now!
Through week 2 the only skill guy I've seen with any fire and heart was Woli. He's fired up. He's making almost every play coming his way. And he's our 5th read NAT! Not acceptable in an O-must-score team. Where's the fire from the other guys? If they want to mope, maybe they should be cut too.
Years ago, in an interview, Dave Dickenson said something I didn't understand at the time. But it prophetically describes our situation now. He said "We're built around having very strong QB play, and we don't have that right now". It was around the time Bo Levi Mitchell was starting to have major trouble. And so Calgary was rapidly falling from the #1 West team to #3. He knew precisely what the team problem was because he designed it in a certain way, and he knew that when it didn't work to design that they were going to be in deep trouble.
That's the Bombers right now. We're designed a certain way with certain assumptions, and it's not working. We can't just say "let's fix the D a bit" because that won't help: we stopped being a D-focused team in 2022 -- or earlier! Nope, we must fix the O, and expend the whole wad doing so. Any help we get on D will just be gravy.
So let's figure out the O problems, let's focus everything on that, let's bring in any talent it requires, and let's start scoring 40 every game. If we fail to do that, we risk going the way of the Stamps after 2019...
It's not how ya start it's how ya finish. If that's true we should win the cup
We should focus on being a Time of possession team. If you honestly think this team can consistently score 40 points a game you're in worse shape than I thought. We are lucky to score 25 points so grind it out and prey on turnovers as our special teams ain't scoring any punt or kick return TDs our D might score the odd one but I wouldn't count on it
Quote from: DM83 on June 16, 2024, 07:50:39 PMIt's not how ya start it's how ya finish. If that's true we should win the cup
Well, that's the best bright side of all these early injuries: all these guys will be coming back mid/late season. Just in time to get warmed up for the post-season.
It'd be great if injuries work by allotment, and we've used all ours up ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: dd on June 17, 2024, 02:18:20 AMWe should focus on being a Time of possession team.
I agree, and that's been our M.O. or semi-M.O. for several seasons now.
Quote from: dd on June 17, 2024, 02:18:20 AMIf you honestly think this team can consistently score 40 points a game you're in worse shape than I thought. We are lucky to score 25 points so grind it out and prey on turnovers as our special teams ain't scoring any punt or kick return TDs our D might score the odd one but I wouldn't count on it
Look at our QB, RB, WRs, SBs on a depth chart. For conversation's sake assume Kenny is in. Just stare at that. I stare at every chart every week. Our QB/RB/WR/SB corps is far and away the best in the league, both by cost, talent, ability, aggregate stats -- whatever, we are miles away the best that every team would trade for tomorrow.
And look what basically that same group put up on average in the last 2 seasons. I'm pretty sure we were #1 or close to it in points per game.
So ya, I "honestly think this team can consistently score 40 points a game"! In fact, I expect it, and more! As per my original point, we've deliberately designed it this way.
If we can't achieve it because the #5 rookie WR sucks, then replace him. If we can't achieve it because the OL has weak links, then replace them. Do what you want with the D, it won't matter if our O can't do what was planned for them. And everyone needs to do whatever is required to make SMS room to sign what we need. (And/or go over the cap.)
Injuries and players not signed have played a significant factor in the 2 losses.
Consider...
Unsigned...
Walker
Jeffcoat
Bailey
Gray
Grant
Hardrick
Houston
Injured...
Oliviera (1 game)
Lawler (6 game)
N. Hallett (6 game)
Garbutt (6 game)
J. Kelly (6 game)
Haba (6 game)
Lawson (6 game)
Parker (6 game)
This has to have had a major impact on effectiveness and performance of the team early in the season.
Quote from: ModAdmin on June 17, 2024, 06:40:39 AMInjuries and players not signed have played a significant factor in the 2 losses.
Consider...
Unsigned...
Walker
Jeffcoat
Bailey
Gray
Grant
Hardrick
Houston
Injured...
Oliviera (1 game)
Lawler (6 game)
N. Hallett (6 game)
Garbutt (6 game)
J. Kelly (6 game)
Haba (6 game)
Lawson (6 game)
Parker (6 game)
Exclude the injured for a moment. The losses on skill O is just... Bailey. Bailey was good, but surely replaceable (in terms of talent, maybe not heart). If his replacement can't get it done and that's costing us our powerhouse O, then go get a vet.
As for injuries: for at least half the game of week 1 we were at full planned O strength. They should have gotten business done. If we are again at full strength in a few weeks, I would expect they get business done.
And if they can't get business done, then we need to look at the OL, as the only other changed piece, to realize our league-top-O plans.
I'm not so much looking back here as looking forward. Assume our skill O at full strength, what's holding them back still? Anything? Fix it.
I agree we are built to be stronger on O, however I don't think all the blame is to be on the new guys. Our highly priced players are not playing at a level as they were previous years, unless if they start pulling their weight expect the same results.
quotation from Ed Tait article.
"We've got to figure out a way to start faster," (Collaros)
This is not a new problem.
Also....I'm trying to remember the last time Collaros lit it up....he's not playing like a MOP at the moment. Too many untimely picks especially when the team is in scoring position. Zach has been saying all the right things but it has not reflected in his play. He was out-performed by his former back up last game who threw 0 picks! Zach threw 2....and his passing completion percentage was hovering around 50% which is just unacceptable. For our O to work he needs to figure it out pretty quick or we will be 0-3 this time next week. O-line also has to be better at run blocking.
Quote from: Lincoln Locomotive on June 17, 2024, 05:44:15 PMAlso....I'm trying to remember the last time Collaros lit it up....he's not playing like a MOP at the moment. Too many untimely picks especially when the team is in scoring position. Zach has been saying all the right things but it has not reflected in his play. He was out-performed by his former back up last game who threw 0 picks! Zach threw 2....and his passing completion percentage was hovering around 50% which is just unacceptable. For our O to work he needs to figure it out pretty quick or we will be 0-3 this time next week. O-line also has to be better at run blocking.
We actually have to run the ball, so our OL can get better at run blocking. JA27 with 7 carries in Ottawa.
Quote from: Pigskin on June 17, 2024, 06:31:16 PMWe actually have to run the ball, so our OL can get better at run blocking. JA27 with 7 carries in Ottawa.
100% THIS.
How little confidence do you have in JA27 and the OL that he never touches the ball on first and goal from the 7 with a minute left to play? If Brady was playing, every play in the last minute would have been a rush to the A/B gap.
I think it's safe to say that play-calling has been the issue, more than anything else on offence. There's no reason Buck should be rusty at this point. Coaches should be itching to get back into it. Normally coaches will fall into a lull mid to later in the season.
He's made this offence very difficult to watch in these first 2 games.
BO and KL are not in our lineup and Collaros is 0-3 TD/int , this is not going to get us 40 points. We have to call a game plan that reflects our current talent level and struggling Qb. Run the ball more for Pete sake, get the O line and offence some confidence. JA can run the ball, give him a chance. 7 carries last game was ridiculous
Quote from: LXTSN on June 17, 2024, 06:43:45 PMI think it's safe to say that play-calling has been the issue, more than anything else on offence. There's no reason Buck should be rusty at this point. Coaches should be itching to get back into it. Normally coaches will fall into a lull mid to later in the season.
He's made this offence very difficult to watch in these first 2 games.
Buck also has to figure out how to us Strev17. He can be a excellent weapon for this team.
Quote from: dd on June 17, 2024, 02:18:20 AMWe should focus on being a Time of possession team. If you honestly think this team can consistently score 40 points a game you're in worse shape than I thought. We are lucky to score 25 points so grind it out and prey on turnovers as our special teams ain't scoring any punt or kick return TDs our D might score the odd one but I wouldn't count on it
Need to bring LaPo back on as an offensive consultant to restore much of his ball control offence that Buck has thrown out. Relying on roll to the right and shoot from the hip isn't working for Zach any longer, and it isn't fooling DC's either. Smart football wins.
Quote from: ModAdmin on June 17, 2024, 06:40:39 AMInjuries and players not signed have played a significant factor in the 2 losses.
Consider...
Unsigned...
Walker
Jeffcoat
Bailey
Gray
Grant
Hardrick
Houston
Injured...
Oliviera (1 game)
Lawler (6 game)
N. Hallett (6 game)
Garbutt (6 game)
J. Kelly (6 game)
Haba (6 game)
Lawson (6 game)
Parker (6 game)
This has to have had a major impact on effectiveness and performance of the team early in the season.
Fiscal mismanagement, ignoring the budget and spending too much in some areas at the expense of balanced spending in other areas. Flipping so many seasoned veterans for less experienced players leaves them downgraded and weaker at too many positions to overcome easily. While the money saved on their salaries added nothing that wasn't already in house.
Jeffcoat
Bailey
Gray
Grant
Clements
Walker
Rose
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 17, 2024, 08:52:15 PMFiscal mismanagement, ignoring the budget and spending too much in some areas at the expense of balanced spending in other areas. Flipping so many seasoned veterans for less experienced players leaves them downgraded and weaker at too many positions to overcome easily. While the money saved on their salaries added nothing that wasn't already in house.
Jeffcoat
Bailey
Gray
Grant
Clements
Walker
Rose
Well, your point would be better made if more than the 2 bolded players were playing...
"While the money saved on their salaries added nothing that wasn't already in house."Well, sign those guy to not play this year, and you lose Schoen or Oliviera, or both.
Losing Bailey and Grant stung, for sure. But losing either of Schoen or Oliviera would have hurt far worse.
Quote from: bluengold204 on June 17, 2024, 02:17:27 PMI agree we are built to be stronger on O, however I don't think all the blame is to be on the new guys. Our highly priced players are not playing at a level as they were previous years, unless if they start pulling their weight expect the same results.
Of course, 100%. I keep hammering on Kenny, but it's really all of the super-high-pay vets. Kenny wasn't doing any worse than the rest, he just cost us most visibly by whiffing on a catchable TD and then getting 6GIRd (again).
Massive pay Demski: virtually invisible, whiffing; 1 good open catch in 2 weeks.
Massive-r pay Schoen: virtually invisible, whiffing, not getting open.
Massive pay Brady: stats just a bit better than Johnny, yikes; probably injured. 1.6Y less YPC than JA27!!!!!!!
Massive-est pay Zach: playing like a bottom-3 starting QB: I've seen better this season from BLM, T.Harris, VAJ, and even Dukes and maybe Dru and MBT! And Cody, barf. Cody out-playing Zach by a country mile at probably $200k less salary.
All that said, they are still the best grouping in the whole CFL! There is zero reason for all of this, unless our OL is complete garbage this year (and if it is, get some solutions FAST). Therefore rather than worry or moan, these massively paid guys need to start earning their pay.
If the problem really was vets not practicing in TC and playing in PS #1 & 2, then YAY, week 1 & 2 were "their PS #1 & 2". Therefore in week 3 we should just as good as all the other O's were in week 1.
No more excuses now for the O! I want 40 points on Friday, and then the D just has to be mediocre, which I am sure they can meet or exceed.
If we still suck, time to airlift radical OL solutions and a legit vet 3rd IMP R. Oh ya, and also the restructures I asked for... you want your exorbitant team-wrecking money? Earn it.
Quote from: Pigskin on June 17, 2024, 06:31:16 PMWe actually have to run the ball, so our OL can get better at run blocking. JA27 with 7 carries in Ottawa.
Yes. But, unless Brady is in and 100%, we need to run it when they don't expect it. And some edge-arounds. Just Johnny going up A-gap every first down won't get us much. That's why Buck ditched it early in week 2.
We never do QB draws or draw screens or delayed RB draws. We never do the QB/RB out option. We never do anything to fork or pin. We're playing checkers while everyone else plays chess. 95% of receivers are fully blanketed 95% of the time. Or more.
Get back to winning the chess match!
Quote from: dd on June 17, 2024, 06:59:16 PMWe have to call a game plan that reflects our current talent level and struggling Qb.
I disagree, well partially. We need to up the game plan and open up the full playbook as our "current talent level" at skill O positions should be league-best (with Kenny in). And if Kenny out means we suddenly have to play rookie-QB bad-receivers ball, then things are in worse shape than I think.
Zach can't be a "struggling QB". There's no injury we're aware of. No excuses. One of the highest paid CFL players, voted #1 in top 50, the option to suck and go back to square one to a simpleton playbook is, frankly, not an option.
He needs to dial it in, whatever it takes. That's the job of him and the QB coach and Buck. None of them should be sipping margaritas by the pool until they fix this.
Now, if it's all due to garbage OL performance, then air drop vet replacements. We will not win if our O is "struggling", because the no-money D wasn't built to win games by themselves.
Must. Get. 40. Points.
Quote from: Pigskin on June 17, 2024, 07:46:25 PMBuck also has to figure out how to us Strev17. He can be a excellent weapon for this team.
100%. Buck needs to go watch 2019. That's it. I have it on PVR if he needs. :D
Lapo knew what to do, and we all thought we'd be straight back to that. But noooooo, let's use Strevie like he's only Can't-Throw Prukop.
Strevie needs to be taking 5-10% of snaps. Doing his stay-in thing. And for xxxxx sake's have him switch up the gaps and run outside and chuck the ball sometimes! And take every 2nd & 1 shot you get, with strict instructions to chuck it into the stands if 1st read isn't open. This isn't rocket science.
Quote from: Throw Long Bannatyne on June 17, 2024, 08:52:15 PMFiscal mismanagement, ignoring the budget and spending too much in some areas at the expense of balanced spending in other areas. Flipping so many seasoned veterans for less experienced players leaves them downgraded and weaker at too many positions to overcome easily. While the money saved on their salaries added nothing that wasn't already in house.
Bailey
Gray
Bailey was the only skill O guy lost. As the weakest R he should have been somewhat easy to replace, at least to 80% standard.
So let's ignore Bailey. And ignore the Kenny injury because the week 2 air show was basically the same as the week 1 air show, meaning Kenny being out didn't kill us and can't be used as the sole excuse.
That leaves OL, and you list Gray (but forgot Yoshi). Gray wasn't Desjar. And Dobson isn't Gray. If all these woes are all OL then we need to change plans on OL.
The old Sherlock Holmes adage: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. Or for us: when you have eliminated the skill O being to blame as impossible, the OL that remains, however improbable, must be the UNIT BRINGING US DOWN. I won't go there yet, but when Kenny is back and there are once again no excuses for the skill players, I will scream that loud and clear if the O continues to suck. (Or if we airlift an IMP LG and we suddenly put up 45 points: amounts to the same thing.)
Quote from: theaardvark on June 17, 2024, 09:08:11 PMLosing Bailey and Grant stung, for sure. But losing either of Schoen or Oliviera would have hurt far worse.
Losing Bailey shouldn't have stung the O at all. (Ignore Grant, he had virtually no role on O last season.)
Picture this:
It's early 2023 and we're winning nearly all of our games and putting up 35+ every game. Suddenly Bailey is out, but we put in McCrae or our best runner-up WR IMP from TC. Picture it. What would we expect? In other words, all else being equal, what would we expect?
We'd 100% expect the O to keeping blowing up opponents and winning games. And that's pretty much what we did when we had various short-term O injuries/DUI-problems last season.
So... using logic, what is the only other thing that changed besides Bailey (again, assuming Lawler in)? 2 OL. Since we all agree Bailey was the weakest IMP WR on the AR, losing him for the next big hopeful rookie shouldn't be killing us! You swap out a tier 3 talent for a tier 4 talent, it shouldn't drag you from hero to zero. So it's got to be OL!!
And if, on the off chance, I'm wrong and the OL is just as good as 2023, then the only thing left is the 5th WR! And that means we should airlift a stout vet WR. Or, heck, maybe it's 2 OL + 1 WR! Sure, possible. Airlift 1 every 2 weeks until the problem is solved.
We're a leaky dike. Keep plugging the holes until we find the one that fixes it all. Completely ignore upgrading the D, all SMS savings needs to go into OL or 5th WR.
I have confidence the Bombers will right the ship... eventually. We just need to have enough points to make it into the playoffs, then it's anyone's chance to win the cup.
Quote from: BLUEBOMBER on July 02, 2024, 06:01:13 PMI have confidence the Bombers will right the ship... eventually. We just need to have enough points to make it into the playoffs, then it's anyone's chance to win the cup.
Three teams miss the play-offs.
The bad news is that, right now there are three winless teams. The good news is that there are three more teams who only have two wins each. There is not that much ground to make up and a lot of time in which to do it.
Quote from: TecnoGenius on June 18, 2024, 05:14:40 AMSo... using logic, what is the only other thing that changed besides Bailey (again, assuming Lawler in)? 2 OL. Since we all agree Bailey was the weakest IMP WR on the AR, losing him for the next big hopeful rookie shouldn't be killing us! You swap out a tier 3 talent for a tier 4 talent, it shouldn't drag you from hero to zero. So it's got to be OL!!
Agree 100% We need to find a way to get this OL in sync. Here's hoping they can figure it out.
Personnel is the issue. We simply ain't good enough!
I love Strev. But as we saw a couple years ago he is a specialist. He is limited.
Sad to say we are playing others who were not even at training camp. We knew back then, that the guys who were cut, were not good( consistent).
Who remains as difference makers? Or maybe just as a competent position player who can not. "F" up?
To defend us, as has been noted, clog up the box, stop the run, and dare Strev to throw something over 5 yards. Can he complete some passes over 20 yards?
It's going to be a challenge
Quote from: DM83 on July 04, 2024, 08:09:35 PMPersonnel is the issue. We simply ain't good enough!
I love Strev. But as we saw a couple years ago he is a specialist. He is limited.
Sad to say we are playing others who were not even at training camp. We knew back then, that the guys who were cut, were not good( consistent).
Who remains as difference makers? Or maybe just as a competent position player who can not. "F" up?
To defend us, as has been noted, clog up the box, stop the run, and dare Strev to throw something over 5 yards. Can he complete some passes over 20 yards?
It's going to be a challenge
Its going to be a challenge alright. I am hoping we have cleaned up the procedure and offensive offside penalties from last game, but holy smokes, we got new recievers and Strev starting his 1st game, it definitely looks bleak. They're going to key on the run and force us to pass it to a double teamed Demski and some rookies?? I just don't see it happening