State of the roster

Started by Jesse, February 05, 2025, 01:44:23 AM

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Jesse

Just wanted to take a look at the position groups so far and see if we think we can see some improvements in some position groups, even though we've seen some big names leave.

Quarterback: Same

Zach's #1. We can all hope for a bounce back season, but hopefully last year is as bad as it gets. Streveler may or may not be back, but we didn't use him to great effect last year anyway, so this position hopefully only has upside from last year.

Runningback: Same

Brady will hopefully not miss TC and start the year off strong. There was also some bad TD luck that hopefully corrects itself. Logan would be a nice complement if we actually choose to make that a part of the gameplan (certainly wasn't a part of Buck's plan).

Receivers: Same?

I know Lawler seems like a loss, but his actual production wont be hard to replace (even if he puts it together and finally manages to play a full season for Hammy - we're comparing the roster to last year). Schoen hopefully gives us everything we wanted and we have Mitchell and White Jr to compete for the #2 while Demski is the vet in the room with Clercius bring a physical presence.

OL: Same/Downgrade?

We lose Dobson, but still have more consistency than we did going into last year with Lofton returning. Instead of depending on multiple rookies, we have guys entering their 2nd year who both have starts under their belt.

DL: Improved?

Willie is Willie. Vaughters should/might give us some extra push from the other side, or at least be more consistent. Lawson coming back hopefully gives us more than we had from the interior. And I'm really excited about year 2 of Adams and Woods.

LB: Same/Improved?

Full year of Tony Jones in the middle. Ayers coming into year 2. Jon Jones one of those guys ready to take a starter role. I think we have an intriguing array of pieces.

Secondary: Downgrade?

On paper, we lost Ford, so it feels like a downgrade. But we've also been here before, DB leaves for NFL or pay day with another team, we replace them with another DB and still lead the league in defensive categories.

I'm pretty comfortable trusting the brain trust on this one.
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Blueforlife

#1
Receivers slightly downgraded
OL too early to tell but could be a downgrade
Rest agree

TecnoGenius

Good summary.

I would also break out FS onto its own.  Still a big question mark there.

If Kenny is gone, then it would be nice if Pokey could mosey back mid-season like so many NFL hopefuls do.  Pokey is a similar build/style to Kenny.

Mitchell is too, though he doesn't quite have the magic hands.

Last season I think our problem (with Schoen hurt) was too many Kenny-type RECs: Kenny, Pokey, Wheatie.  You really only need 1 or 2 of those guys on a team.  We should be more balanced this year, which will help on 2nd down.
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Blue In BC

Good summary. I think it's possible we've improved at LB and DL. Depth on the DL is still somewhat of an unknown.

Parker will replace Ford in the secondary so the real loss is more of a ratio issue. While ratio is not critical at the moment it's unclear how we adjust and whether that happens at safety.

Options suggested have included a 3 import OL, all import DL or safety. In theory none of those are necessary but remain as options. Injury in TC could impact final choices.

We've lost 10+ players at this point and that will increase depending on our final list of potential free agents.

It will be a different team. Generally I think we'll be ok.
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blue_gold_84

Solid analysis, @Jesse.

I think the DL will be where we see the most improvement. I think the defense is going to be really good.

The two question marks for me: QB depth and the return game.

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BombZ

Quote from: Jesse on February 05, 2025, 01:44:23 AMJust wanted to take a look at the position groups so far and see if we think we can see some improvements in some position groups, even though we've seen some big names leave.

Quarterback: Same

Zach's #1. We can all hope for a bounce back season, but hopefully last year is as bad as it gets. Streveler may or may not be back, but we didn't use him to great effect last year anyway, so this position hopefully only has upside from last year.

Runningback: Same

Brady will hopefully not miss TC and start the year off strong. There was also some bad TD luck that hopefully corrects itself. Logan would be a nice complement if we actually choose to make that a part of the gameplan (certainly wasn't a part of Buck's plan).

Receivers: Same?

I know Lawler seems like a loss, but his actual production wont be hard to replace (even if he puts it together and finally manages to play a full season for Hammy - we're comparing the roster to last year). Schoen hopefully gives us everything we wanted and we have Mitchell and White Jr to compete for the #2 while Demski is the vet in the room with Clercius bring a physical presence.

OL: Same/Downgrade?

We lose Dobson, but still have more consistency than we did going into last year with Lofton returning. Instead of depending on multiple rookies, we have guys entering their 2nd year who both have starts under their belt.

DL: Improved?

Willie is Willie. Vaughters should/might give us some extra push from the other side, or at least be more consistent. Lawson coming back hopefully gives us more than we had from the interior. And I'm really excited about year 2 of Adams and Woods.

LB: Same/Improved?

Full year of Tony Jones in the middle. Ayers coming into year 2. Jon Jones one of those guys ready to take a starter role. I think we have an intriguing array of pieces.

Secondary: Downgrade?

On paper, we lost Ford, so it feels like a downgrade. But we've also been here before, DB leaves for NFL or pay day with another team, we replace them with another DB and still lead the league in defensive categories.

I'm pretty comfortable trusting the brain trust on this one.

bluengold204

QB=same
RB=same
WR=downgrade.  Mitchell is not Lawler
OL=id say slight downgrade which scares me as they weren't great last year to begin with
DL=upgrade Vaughters will help Willie and vice versa
LB=id same same/upgrade Tony better than bighill
Secondary=downgrade on paper we lost Ford and still no option at safety.  Time will tell if we recruit better options

Pete

#7
Oline is weaker - loss of Dobson and aging of vets.
Wr - will depend on health of Schoen. Productivity wise will miss Wilson more than Lawler
Dline better with Vaughters and Lawton
Dbacks - weaker with loss of Ford
LBS - better
Rb - better, Logan gives us more options
 Of concern is losing young cdn talent in Dobson and Ford. Also not signing Garbutt was a mistake I believe.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: Blue In BC on February 05, 2025, 01:12:29 PMOptions suggested have included a 3 import OL, all import DL or safety. In theory none of those are necessary but remain as options. Injury in TC could impact final choices.

If we don't make a splash in FA on OL (OG) I really think there's a good chance we'll go 3 IMP OL.  Randolph at LG plus our existing lineup could be a league top-3 OL.

I maintain that Eli isn't a real LG option, and Wallace isn't ready (or possibly never will be).  Either we draft a week-1-ready LG, or we make a FA splash, or Randolph becomes the starter.  I don't see any other choices.

Remember how good our OL suddenly became with Randolph at RG in '24!!

The only tricky part is no Ford means 1 less ratio overage.  However, we were starting 8, 9, 10 NATs most of '24, so we can easily afford this change.
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TecnoGenius

I don't think the loss of Ford is as big a deal as people think.  I was never sold on him being our best DB anyhow.  I think Nichols & Holm are more important, and we keep both.

Ford only gets the big attention because he's a NAT.  Otherwise he's just another very good DB.

I have no doubt we will find yet another great DB.  We do every year.  It's just that he won't be NAT.  And that's fine.

I also think Parker, Bonds, Bridges are all viable to be the "next big thing".  We'll see after TC.
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blue_or_die

#10
Hey, good analysis and fun thread.

QB = biggest question is backup, both in their ability to take over and manage in case of (shall not be said), and equally important, how they're used as a change of pace/3rd and short/special play sort of role. I want someone able to do all of that. If it's Strev, great, but hoping Jarious uses him better than Buck did.

RB = already perfection

Rec = Not a concern for me. Dalton will be #1, Demski is solid as always, I think Dillon gets more catches than we think because of attention having to be paid to the top 2 looks, and Clercius takes another step after a good first season. We also have guys like Wheatfall who contributed pretty well for their rookie seasons and could break out this year. Or, we find another Ontaria on an ELC as we've proven we can

OL = wish Dobson wasn't leaving and we had full continuity from last year, but we had so many new faces spending half a season gelling so as long as we find someone skilled who can fit in, that shouldn't be nearly as much a struggle.

DL = I'm very excited to have Vaughters come in and be a factor so that we can #FreeWillie. Equally excited to have Lawson as a full time starter all season and although I've been calling for a bona fide dominant DT like Cersena or Stove for ages, between Thomas and Adams and Woods we should have very solid rotation in the middle

LB = very excited about Ayers and Keeping Up With The Jones'. Also missing is Kyrie Wilson's re-signing and he will be a key rotation piece in a number of different packages. Having his skill and experience in a role where we don't completely rely on his health will let him contribute to the best of his capacity I think. Kramdi is now a star and could get even better.

DB = We lose our amazing finds every year and replace them every year. Will miss Ford, but at the end of the day he's a field corner. Even if we don't find a super star here, they just need to be competent at this position but hey, maybe it's a new Alford! Bonds will take another step from an already stellar rookie year. Nichols and Holm are Nichols and Holm. Hoping BA has a bounce back but again, he's a safety and now that he's not the youngin he once was, "hiding" him at safety is perfectly fine for what he has left in the tank.

In summary, I'm expecting/hoping we scout a young ELC OL, rec and db. I don't think we need to pay up for any of these with crazy FA spending.
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theaardvark


QB - Zach a year older, and coming of a confidence straining third GC loss, Wilson still unknown and 3rd guy / Dev guy TBD - down

RB - Same starter, better depth. -up

Rec - Wilson / Lawler gone, Schoen back.  Mitchell, White might be moneybal kinds of guys, and there's Wheatfall and a bazillion more to step up - slight down

Oline - Dobson is a loss, but I think Wallace/Randolph will be an upgrade.  Lofton year two.  - even

Dline - Vaughters is an upgrade, if Willie is still got it, and we land one DL out of those left out there - big upgrade.

LB's - Year two of Jones - Ayers/Wilson - Kramdi is going to be very good, and lots of healthy backups is going to make us deep at that spot. - up

DB's - Yes, Ford is a loss, but Parker comes back.  Lots of competition at FS, and Holm, Nichols, Bond are solid AF.  Depending on who wins FS, same or up

Specials - new LS will be the key, not the hardest position but definitely a lynchpin. Competition at P, but can only be an upgrade if we change - same

Coches - OC is the key, Hogan needs to step up, having Jackson on the staff is a bonus.  Is Hogan/Jackson > Buck/Hogan?  We will see soon enough - same/?
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DM83

Wasn't Dobson a turnstile? Zac had to always bail because his guy was always running by him.

TecnoGenius

Quote from: theaardvark on February 06, 2025, 03:33:27 PMOline - Dobson is a loss, but I think Wallace/Randolph will be an upgrade.  Lofton year two.  - even

If we go Randolph (or new wunderkind) I fully agree.  Wallace, nope.  Not if he's at the level he was at last year.  He may only ever be a gadget guy because of his size.  We'll see.

Will Mafia take the bold step of going "all 2017" again and starting 3 IMP OL??  I hope so.  Takes the pressure of the dev guys and the draft choices.
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TecnoGenius

Quote from: DM83 on February 06, 2025, 11:43:26 PMWasn't Dobson a turnstile? Zac had to always bail because his guy was always running by him.

Dobson wasn't great, especially earlier in the season.  I thought he was the "problem guy" for '24.  However, the OL got way better with Randolph in, and then when Neuf came back too.

I never saw what PFF decided he was OL of the week or whatever he "won" mid/late season.  So I agree with you, somewhat/mostly, but we're probably the only 2 here who feel that way!

He's no Desjar, and if other teams want to give him Desjar money, let them.  However, if we can use (part of) the $400k to woo him back I'd be all for it because continuity is king come week 1 in the CFL.  And he's proven more than serviceable.  I think he's the 2024 version of Speller.

Oh ya, I'll miss the slick stache.
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